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To Infinity and Beyond: The Marvel Cinematic Universe
- Thread starter Vaeran
- Start date
Jeanie
(Fem or Gender Neutral)
Man, if you think that's getting buried, let me gesture to my wall of red string conspiracy theories about who they're also planning to bring in.
So in episode 4, SWORD director guy mentioned they lost some astronauts recently and in this episode Monica mentions knowing a guy who could build a vehicle that would be able to protect people entering the Hex Field. It's not much of a stretch to see the thing they're hinting at. It's pretty transparent if you think about it.
Just so we're all on the same page, you're hinting at the Fantastic Four/Reed Richards yes? That was my thought at least, and it would make sense. Also, putting money on Dr Strange showing up since there's a good chance we're going full House of M at this point.
I think the tone of that scene heavily insinuates that the answer is a no. Why would a little kid who idolized Capt Marvel, suddenly act so apprehensive at the mere mentioning of her name like it was a personal betrayal unless she just never came back to visit like she promised? Though to be fair, she could merely be upset that Capt Marvel just wasn't around to stop the snap, and wasn't around for her mom when she died. Still betting on the former though, since that was already the implication IMO.
Jeanie
(Fem or Gender Neutral)
Yeah.
Booyaka! It's a lingo Darcy wants to spread!
Ah, good point! The only bit that stayed with me from that Ep 4 discussion was that they were short-staffed due to people losing their nerve, so I missed the part you mention even on a rewatch. It would be fantastic if they went that route! We DO know from Endgame that the Snaps (at least two of them, but possibly all four) created "unprecedented cosmic waves" across the universe, so your theory is really on fire.
Yeah, either of those could apply, but the former could hit even harder if Carol was out there in space while Maria dealt with her cancer.
(And is this the first official mention of "Captain Marvel" in the MCU? As opposed to "Carol" or "Danvers"?)
It's pretty clever how they foreshadowed the cliffhanger not just by T&B asking Wanda to revive the dog, but by (possibly) having a) Wanda create it out of thin air, having it b) immediately sniff around hazardous objects that could kill it.
If Vision needs more revelations like he needs a hole in the head, imagine when he catches on that he lay in pieces and across six tables at a lab somewhere when Wanda came to get him. No disassemble! No disassemble No. 5! (It's also weird how Vision's indestructibility comes and goes.)
Whoever Agnes turns out to be, she's getting closer and closer to blowing her cover than Wanda herself is, and she's not even subtle about it. Hell, since Wanda was surprised at the dog's death, I wonder if Agnes was the one who killed it so it wouldn't disturb the relationship between Wanda and the kids.
I like that the Twins are real, unlike the dog(?) (and "Peter"?) albeit with hyper-advanced intellects, and they're very much their own persons, able to notice inconsistencies in their reality even as they also manipulate it to their whims. Definitely looking forward to what the greater MCU narrative does with them in the long term. Also liked that Wanda's accent came back when she left the hex field and returned to the real world.
Pretty sure the 80s did not have such advanced drones, though
If Vision needs more revelations like he needs a hole in the head, imagine when he catches on that he lay in pieces and across six tables at a lab somewhere when Wanda came to get him. No disassemble! No disassemble No. 5! (It's also weird how Vision's indestructibility comes and goes.)
Whoever Agnes turns out to be, she's getting closer and closer to blowing her cover than Wanda herself is, and she's not even subtle about it. Hell, since Wanda was surprised at the dog's death, I wonder if Agnes was the one who killed it so it wouldn't disturb the relationship between Wanda and the kids.
I like that the Twins are real, unlike the dog(?) (and "Peter"?) albeit with hyper-advanced intellects, and they're very much their own persons, able to notice inconsistencies in their reality even as they also manipulate it to their whims. Definitely looking forward to what the greater MCU narrative does with them in the long term. Also liked that Wanda's accent came back when she left the hex field and returned to the real world.
Pretty sure the 80s did not have such advanced drones, though
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Re: your spoilerpop Zef
The bit about the dog - I assume the dog is real, and it felt low key super-dark that the dog's only actions in the show was to try and commit suicide twice. Coupled with the horror all the other characters were feeling while being mind-controlled, it would make sense for the dog to feel the same way too.
About Agnes - I read a theory elsewhere on the internet that they thought the reason Agnes is drinking all the time is so that the alcohol can both blunt the trauma of the situation, and that the alcohol interferes with Wanda's brainwashing to a degree.
The bit about the dog - I assume the dog is real, and it felt low key super-dark that the dog's only actions in the show was to try and commit suicide twice. Coupled with the horror all the other characters were feeling while being mind-controlled, it would make sense for the dog to feel the same way too.
About Agnes - I read a theory elsewhere on the internet that they thought the reason Agnes is drinking all the time is so that the alcohol can both blunt the trauma of the situation, and that the alcohol interferes with Wanda's brainwashing to a degree.
Jeanie
(Fem or Gender Neutral)
Re Agnes:
I see her as the one in control of the town folk, not Wanda or Vis and definitely not the kids. She explicitly stated stated that you can't control kids, which is why Billy and Tommy are the only kids in town.
I feel pretty solid about my theory but I'm also holding out hope that somehow this also leads to Adam Brashear with a comic accurate origin. I want to see The Mouse explain that the MCU could have had a Superman analogue if the average white man wasn't so damn scared. I'd bet it would do Black Panther level money and piss off the RW "news".
I see her as the one in control of the town folk, not Wanda or Vis and definitely not the kids. She explicitly stated stated that you can't control kids, which is why Billy and Tommy are the only kids in town.
I feel pretty solid about my theory but I'm also holding out hope that somehow this also leads to Adam Brashear with a comic accurate origin. I want to see The Mouse explain that the MCU could have had a Superman analogue if the average white man wasn't so damn scared. I'd bet it would do Black Panther level money and piss off the RW "news".
Me when I saw the back of Pietro's head: Yeah, saw it coming
Me when I saw his face: WHAT?!?!
Me when I saw his face: WHAT?!?!
omg lmao. All in; love this.
Oh daaaaaaaang
My theory, related somewhat to potential Fantastic Four references, is that Agnes is Agatha Harkness. She seems to be the only person in Westview capable of manipulating Wanda to the same extent she can manipulate everyone else, to a degree that goes beyond Zany Sitcom Neighbor
Also, who or what is Lagos? Every other commercial break is for someone that hurt Wanda in the past, but that one doesn’t ring a bell.
...outside of that giant SMT Boss Monster from Ultimates. But... that’d be a bit of an escalation for this show
My theory, related somewhat to potential Fantastic Four references, is that Agnes is Agatha Harkness. She seems to be the only person in Westview capable of manipulating Wanda to the same extent she can manipulate everyone else, to a degree that goes beyond Zany Sitcom Neighbor
Also, who or what is Lagos? Every other commercial break is for someone that hurt Wanda in the past, but that one doesn’t ring a bell.
...outside of that giant SMT Boss Monster from Ultimates. But... that’d be a bit of an escalation for this show
Lagos is where Wanda accidentally killed some civilians in Captain America: Civil War.
So... Monica basically confirms this is the case, but she also has those weird medical results after leaving Westview. Did Westview do something to her, or was it something beforehand? Was she still normal after the Snap?
Sprite
(He/Him/His)
Pretty much. That’s definitely up there with the most satisfying and unsettling reveals ever.
This is one of the main reasons why, despite wanting to see the next episode asap, I'm happy there are still shows like this that stick to a weekly release schedule. An event like this has meaning and is something we can have the time to think about, discuss, and appreciate for this week until the next one comes out. And we're all on the same page and can discuss it as it happens too. If Disney+ just decided to poop out the whole show at once like Netflix insists upon, that moment would have been shocking for all of 15 seconds until the next episode loaded and then we're on to the next thing. We'd have had no time to sit and think about or digest any of this, and that moment would have been lost in the shuffle as just one of many. I think some shows definitely work better being able marathon them, but there are still many that work best like this. Especially on a first-watch experience versus something you've seen before many times.
Either telepathy or invulnerability, but only one at a time, but yes.
If they’ve gone this far, perhaps
If they’ve gone this far, perhaps
Emma Frost is a telepath/telekinetic who also has the ability to transform her body into diamond. She started off as a villain who shifted into a more anti-heroic and then into conflicted heroics over the years, and is a pretty major X character nowadays.
She does, but I don't think it's her. Both Dottie and Emma are blonde and mean, though. And it would further honor the X-Men cinematic universe to introduce a version of Emma Frost that that doesn't stick or that closely resemble her comic counterpart. (there have been two so far)
I really do appreciate this. I've fallen off the anime habit despite keeping up with news and media about it, so I don't really discuss many shows at all in real-time anymore (and I dropped the couple that I picked up in the last few months for various reasons). I also missed out on the Mando discussion because, that one, I specifically wanted to watch it in two-episode spurts. So I'm really enjoying the weekly Discourse surrounding this show, and I'm looking forward for similar deals with Loki, TF&TWS, and Ms Marvel.
Something DID happen to Monica, which hints at things some people are guessing, but if we're right about our guesses, I'm definitely not going to spoil it for anyone and I'll let the show itself get there first
That would be a hell of a swerve if true, and the "characters" of WandaVision have different names than their in-universe real-life counterparts (now there's an awkward sentence) so it's definitely possible to hide her in plain sight like that, but it would be in conflict with all the theories surrounding Agnes. So, hmm.
But on that note, I also want to know if there's some significance in the in-show character being named Dorothy, like the one that got isekai'd to Oz. I'm not apologizing for that word.
OH! And I figured out why Wanda recast Pietro:
Because her real brother Pietro is still Sokovian, and Peter is 100% American down to the Uncle Jessie-like accent.
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cinematic Emma Frost rankings
4. X-Men: First Class (bad)
3. Wolverine: Origins (unmemorable)
2. Generation X telemovie (fine)
1. January Jones's Instagram Emma Frost shitposts (exquisite)
4. X-Men: First Class (bad)
3. Wolverine: Origins (unmemorable)
2. Generation X telemovie (fine)
1. January Jones's Instagram Emma Frost shitposts (exquisite)
I mean I know who Monica Rambeau is unless you're talking about something elseSomething DID happen to Monica, which hints at things some people are guessing, but if we're right about our guesses, I'm definitely not going to spoil it for anyone and I'll let the show itself get there first
And the tagline was something like "Lagos: For when you make a mess you didn't mean to." Harsh!
This was me too. I literally shouted WHAT THE FUCK at the screen. I'm so excited to see where this leads.
I'll have to watch the episode again, but I took that to be a hint to Wanda that Billy and Tommy have minds of their own that are to some extent exempt from her control, like Vision does, and not necessarily that all children are or would be immune. But then why would there be no children in (presumably previously normal) Westview? Maybe some part of Wanda realized the horror of what she was about to do and couldn't bear to involve kids in it, and ejected them from Westview before she took over? But then where are they? Presumably this will be addressed.
The reveal that that really is Vision's reanimated corpse and not some kind of sentient magical projection was truly horrifying. This is easily the darkest the MCU has gotten yet and I am here for it.
Husbands can clean up their messes too!
Speaking of which, one of the TVs showing the Lagos incident during the SWORD briefing displays a "Terrorist at large" chyron. Since it's common knowledge that Wanda nearly killed Thanos herself, I wonder how the public views her now, Westview notwithstanding.
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Yeah, the Wanda/Pietro issue is one of the more interesting facets of Marvel's licensing agreements, or at least it was before Disney bought Fox. The generally accepted wisdom is that they fell into a grey area in the original license, because they're about equally well known for being mutants as they are for being Avengers, which ended up being a moot point for many years because nobody was particularly itching to use them. So while Marvel and Fox worked out a shared custody arrangement that allowed both studios to use both characters around the same time, it also seems like it may have been decided that each would have the spotlight on only one of the siblings: Pietro gets killed off in the same MCU movie in which he debuts while Wanda goes on to bigger and better things, and on the Fox side, Peter has an unnamed younger sister who appears in one scene and doesn't speak. (At least in the movies I've seen. Maybe she's got a starring role in Dark Phoenix.) I continue to want to see the actual license agreements themselves to see how all this was even worded in the first place, but I don't expect that'll ever happen.
I think there's a good chance when based on trailers she'll dawn the classic Scarlet Witch costume or at least pay homage to with a joke by Darcy or something.
Sprite
(He/Him/His)
They’ve confirmed in interviews that the classic outfits will be Halloween costumes.
I feel like this is going to be one of those shows with an inevitable backlash to the ending. The amount of speculation they’re inviting with this episode means a lot of folks will be disappointed when their pet theories turn out to be false.
I feel like this is going to be one of those shows with an inevitable backlash to the ending. The amount of speculation they’re inviting with this episode means a lot of folks will be disappointed when their pet theories turn out to be false.
Something else to consider;
The dog didn't seem to mind things until Agnes showed up, at which point it immediately tried to commit suicide, and later it was dead in her garden.
And the captive townspeople are only saying "she" is controlling everything, they don't specify who.
I am 100% convinced that Agnes is the bad guy
The dog didn't seem to mind things until Agnes showed up, at which point it immediately tried to commit suicide, and later it was dead in her garden.
And the captive townspeople are only saying "she" is controlling everything, they don't specify who.
I am 100% convinced that Agnes is the bad guy