I personally would be shocked if none did given the extreme difference in circumstance that arose in the main game.
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Final Fantasy VII Rebirth
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Did it? I've only played through half of it and haven't been able to finish the job, but so far it's all just 100% an adaptation of what happened in FF7 proper. I mean some of Zach's mannerisms and speaking style are pulled from Crisis Core, but a lot of *that* is still based on what happened in FF7. His squats, his cheery disposition, his fidgeting, it's all FF7 stuff.
We've already seen a lot of recurring characters from
Edit: messed up a few proper nouns
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I would respectfully disagree
4-So
Spicy
Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth to get visual upgrades before launch
An update to the Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth demo will improve the visual quality of Performance mode. The update is due 21…
www.eurogamer.net
We'll see how much this patch improves things.
I thought the story was fine. Gameplay wasn't great, but what shooter from the PS2 era by Japanese devs was?
Yes. Spoilers for Final Fantasy 7 as a media franchise: Zack only ever existed as a "person" with a discernable personality in Crisis Core. Other than that, we have OG FF7 where his only "confirmed" appearance is one optional flashback, Ehrgeiz: God Bless the Ring, where he is a literal color swap of Cloud, and Advent Children, where he is a well-meaning ghost for all of seven seconds. Final Fantasy 7 Remake, to my recall, only actively includes Zack as part of a teasing dénouement where he barely speaks. As many people here and elsewhere have noted, Flashback Cloud from the Rebirth demo is Cloud walking around in Zack's skin. He has Zack's standing, personality, and mannerisms. And if you can identify that, it comes from only one place: Crisis Core. If you see this Flashback Cloud and notice he is "playing Zack", it is only because Flashback Cloud is reminding you of Crisis Core.
... Or, like, three vignettes from Kingdom Hearts: Birth by Sleep. But that is less likely!
This is not a situation where Square Enix released this demo exclusively to goose sales of Crisis Core. There is no neon yellow paint leading you to the Playstation store. That said, in much the same way that I have no doubt Final Fantasy 7 Remake got people to say "Oh, I love hanging out with these characters, maybe I'll pick up the original Final Fantasy 7, currently available on all platforms," I believe there are people that played the Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth Demo, still had a month until the Final Fantasy 7 Rebirth release, and said, "Wow, this reminds me of playing that PSP Final Fantasy 7 game back in the day. Oh? It's currently available on all platforms? Maybe I'll give that a shot to tide me over."
"The Story (Compilation?) of Final Fantasy 7" is a bizarre ouroboros of plotting at this point, but there are vibes that are particular to certain games.
I would contest this. I've never played Crisis Core and I feel like I have a pretty decent understanding of what kinda person Zack is based purely on the original work he was in. Even that lone truck ride scene in the hidden flashback establishes a lot: his cheerfulness (very directly contrasted with Cloud, as both his "real" and assumed selves), his optimism, his goofiness, the habitual squats to pump himself up (just one mannerism that Cloud internalized for himself). Crisis Core to me seems like it existed--other than exploiting a property--because Zack had enough of a hook to anchor a game as its protagonist, as a distinct point of view from precedent, and they'd managed to craft that image of him with very little screentime. All post-FFVII spinoffs inform the remake series in some way but an aspect like this isn't conjured up whole cloth by them.
There's also the way Aerith talks about Zack in FF7. I don't remember the specifics at this point, but that's definitely admissible evidence for what Zack is like without directly showing the viewer Zack himself.
Also gonna agree here. Zack's basic personality is pretty well established in a number of places other than Crisis Core (which doesn't provide any major revelations about him, really, compared to what we learn in OG FF7. It's just detail.).
jpfriction
(He, Him)
Yeah, I just played through this bit in OG FF VII and even if you don’t identify him as Zack, flashback “Cloud” is clearly a whole different person and rebirth plays that the same way.
It's pretty clever, really. In FF7 you think "oh, this is Cloud as a kid, not jaded yet," etc. And only later realize that it was never him at all and that's why he was so different.
Yup. And one of the first tip-offs is that when you have a flashback to even earlier, when Cloud and Tifa are still kids and making their promise on the water tower, Cloud is dour and emo then too.
On a related note, this was already in the trailers so not necessarily big spoilers, but it is for a facet of the game we haven't seen yet and I'll still spoiler-tag out of courtesy:
I really like that in this game Tifa seems to immediately address with other party members that Cloud's story is whack. This has always been a major sticking point for me in the original game, because it's not only nonsensical, but it's kind of messed up for Tifa to say/do nothing. Having her do this gives her character more agency and is more respectful of her intelligence. I also assume it's more reflective of how the characters in this version of events are just more tightly knit right now, that she'd feel like opening up to them about something like this instead of just sitting on it like she did in the original game.
Adaptive triggers on the PS5 are ultimately a gimmick, but it’s a fun one in some of the ways Rebirth’s demo uses. Ratcheting up the tension on the triggers for certain QTE moments was a nice little touch, for example.
jpfriction
(He, Him)
It certainly beats “hold the button down for way too long to open every big door” from FF XVI
I messed around with the Junon demo for like an hour. This game is going to be a long one. I feel like I barely explored a tiny little fragment of that section of the worldmap and there was just so much stuff going on. I'm going to be playing this game for a long-ass time, aren't I
Square-Enix pushed out a patch for Remake. Not Rebirth, Remake. In it were a few cleanup things. One gave Tifa in the flashbacks to Nibelheim an outfit change more in line with what she'll be wearing in Rebirth. The other change, changed Aerith's final line as the party leaves Midgar.
Some people on the internet are "baffled" at this last change, because it takes her line from "I miss it. The steel sky." to "This sky ...I don't like it." But nobody should be baffled because the "original" line in the Remake localization was pretty editorialized, and one that never sat right with me back when I first played the game. Because the new line is now a much more direct translation of the actual original Japanese - where there is important ambiguity in her intent/what she means.
Some people on the internet are "baffled" at this last change, because it takes her line from "I miss it. The steel sky." to "This sky ...I don't like it." But nobody should be baffled because the "original" line in the Remake localization was pretty editorialized, and one that never sat right with me back when I first played the game. Because the new line is now a much more direct translation of the actual original Japanese - where there is important ambiguity in her intent/what she means.
The change of Aerith's line baffles me because it was an incredible localization that played on other apprehensive things she'd said before Wall Market in the same sort of apprehensive way while also conveying the original Japanese it got changed to by implication. I even remember seeing the typical hatred of the mere idea of localization being unusually seasoned with confusion about the original line because apparently many of that type of fan of the compilation dislike her opinion of the sky from Crisis Core almost as much for some far more baffling reason. But it's baffling in a "why was time spent on it at this stage" kind of way rather than a "why would they want to change it" way. I didn't even realize the brief look at Tifa from the flashback in Remake was different from what we see in Rebirth at all.
There's a huge amount of differences in character voices across the remake series's localization, often resulting in completely different reads on individual lines, scenes and even characterization. I would view it as a lost cause to pine for the "original" expression of such things, since the only way to really get that would be to learn Japanese and interact with the material in that context--something that applies to all localized media, but particularly present here in the amount of script differences that exist between languages.
what change to what line now
I honestly don't think it's that baffling, in terms of either the change itself or the timing.
Even given the general translation approach favoring reproducing the intended effect or nuance of a line over a word for word translation, the best approach to any given line will always be the result of a case by case judgement. I do think that the former line was more evocative, and in some cases it might be the more appropriate translation. However, "I miss X" is a very different sentiment than "I don't like Y" (i.e. "Y is foreboding"). You can easily imagine a discussion either within the localization team or between the writing team and the localization team occurring where they decided that, actually, in this case, the latter is more appropriate in this context, even if it's arguably less interesting when evaluated in a vacuum. This is especially true given that it's a line in such a prominent place in the game, so it will get extra attention by everyone involved.
In terms of timing, it's not hard to imagine that it took until this patch for all the various workflows to line up, even if maybe the localization team submitted the change a long, long time ago.
Even given the general translation approach favoring reproducing the intended effect or nuance of a line over a word for word translation, the best approach to any given line will always be the result of a case by case judgement. I do think that the former line was more evocative, and in some cases it might be the more appropriate translation. However, "I miss X" is a very different sentiment than "I don't like Y" (i.e. "Y is foreboding"). You can easily imagine a discussion either within the localization team or between the writing team and the localization team occurring where they decided that, actually, in this case, the latter is more appropriate in this context, even if it's arguably less interesting when evaluated in a vacuum. This is especially true given that it's a line in such a prominent place in the game, so it will get extra attention by everyone involved.
In terms of timing, it's not hard to imagine that it took until this patch for all the various workflows to line up, even if maybe the localization team submitted the change a long, long time ago.
I don't think you get it. It changed the meaning way too much. The original line in Japanese is very ambiguous and implies multiple meanings. The old English localization of the line, made one of those meanings very clear to the point of hitting the player over the head. But in doing so, it completely washed out the other meaning - implying her strong apprehension towards venturing forth towards an unwritten future where the security of the planet, and her friends lives, are now not just in question, but in serious peril. This second, other meaning is key, because it's likely the crux of the entire dramatic tension of Rebirth.
Because a lot of people - including myself - are replaying Remake right before Rebirth comes out right now. And further, Rebirth comes with Remake bundled in with the game, because there is a fair number of people who skipped the first game on account of it only being the first part of a trilogy, so there's also plenty of people playing that game for the first time as well right now, or in the very near future once Rebirth launches later in the week.
I've grown up over the years and am nowhere near as finicky as I used to be about wanting more literal translations for games. A certain amount of "localizing" is always going to be required to make the dialog comprehensible, and flow more naturally for gamers. Especially if that dialog is being spoken out loud. It's just a matter of striking the right balance. Sometimes, Remake struck that balance fine. I'm reminded of a scene where Cloud is asking around looking for the Mayor. In Japanese, Cloud is looking for the Mayor ('shichou') and someone mishears him saying no, they don't have any stew ('shichuu'). Changing that to Cloud looking for the 'Mayor' and the person not having any 'Mayo' is necessary to make the pun work and keeps the spirit of the original dialog intact. But like you noted, Remake frequently added tons of nonsense to the dialog that completely changed the tone of what people were saying, and even implies completely different personalities. Like, one moment comes to mind in Intergrade where Jessie simply says "sorry" to Yuffie, but the 'localization' has her saying "let me play you the world's tiniest violin" which is a baffling change in meaning. Jessie is often disingenuous in Remake because she likes to tease people, but it's always in a joking and light hearted manner, with the punchline coming in the form of a denouncement where she then proclaims she's just kidding. "Let me play you the world's tiniest violin" dips into a kind of bitter sarcasm that just isn't present at all in the character or really in the Japanese language to begin with. Any amount of laundering that kind of editorializing out of the localization is a win, tbh.
And clearly someone with a lot of pull thought the same. Either the JP side of things noticed how botched that line was and ordered a correction, or the Eng localizers realized that they glossed over important context in a key line leading into the next game. Either way, it's remarkable that this kind of change was noted and clearly deemed necessary.
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In what? I played FF7R recently and it was the first line. Did they patch it out of FF7R?
I don't like that at all. The old line was very fitting for a number of reasons.
OK. I don't though.
