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YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
They are so good at teasing me with the Zack Content. My god. What does any of that meeeaaann!? New theory I just thought up: Aerith still dies in the "normal" timeline, but she lives in the Zack timeline. Maybe his story ends in this one with Aerith waking up after Sephiroth kills her?? I... don't know what the Cloud/Zack/Aerith trio would actually try to accomplish in that timeline...
 

4-So

Spicy
I wouldn't be surprised if Aeris doesn't die. It seems odd to me to go through all of this trouble to change vital pieces of the narrative as we know it but then leave THE MOMENT as the same. I can certainly buy into a dual reality thing where she dies in one and not in the other. Alternatively, I would not be surprised if Sephiroth does not kill Aeris because the Remake Sephiroth understands what OG Sephiroth sets in motion when he kills her, which is to say, his own death. So perhaps he lets her live. It would be wild for the scene to play out but instead of Aeris it's Cloud that is killed, ensuring that the linch pin character can't continue, and "ensuring" that things plays out differently re: Sephiroth's machinations. It would also fit into the defiance of destiny theme that Remake seemed to be going for.

In any case, come ooooon February 29th.
 
The game's director has gone on record saying multiple times that while the ordering of events may have changed, the same basic plot and themes will still remain. I think there is certainly a large level of ambiguity being played up in the trailers and promotional material making us wonder will they, won't they. But I think it will have to happen in some form because the entire central theme of FF7 is about how to deal with life after loss, and that is the seminal moment where the themes of the original game all center around. But! It'll sure be interesting to find out if that'll be the case or not.
 

Bongo

excused from moderation duty
(he/him)
Staff member
I'm just very impressed that they've created a situation where both newcomers and oldheads alike don't know what's going to happen.
 

gogglebob

The Goggles Do Nothing
(he/him)
Goggle Bob's Theory on What's Gonna Happen according to information released so far: So the trailer implies that there is a "timeline" where Zack survived to come home to Aerith, but with Zack alive, Cloud never reawakens, and with Cloud comatose, everyone in AVALANCHE but Charlie Sheen dies. For want of a nail. This presumably is a world that is thus not equipped to deal with Shinra/Sephiroth, and maybe the whole place gets meteor'ed without a single omnislash being thrown. And I think "our" timeline team finds out about this, and there is a clear parallel drawn that Aerith must die, because if she lives, everything is going to go to heck. And if I want to further guess what happens from there, the whole party (including Aerith) is going to agree this is for the best "for the planet"... and then Cloud gets cranky at the last moment, saves Aerith, and then something terrible happens. And, because this is part two of three, we won't get the full ramifications of "something terrible" until Final Fantasy 7: Cloud Returns.

And if I'm really being saucy with predictions: This leads to an ironic echo of the original Aerith death scene with "press X to let Aerith die" in the same manner that Cloud could not resist Sephiroth during OG FF7, but with Cloud disobeying all controller "orders" to let it happen.
 
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Sarcasmorator

Same as I ever was
(He/him)
It's modern times. It'll be L3 + R3 to Let Aerith Die.

I'm just very impressed that they've created a situation where both newcomers and oldheads alike don't know what's going to happen.
It's very exciting! Last time I felt like this was, for real, The Last Jedi. That throne room fight kicked off and I was like YESSSSS I have no idea what happens next.
 
As someone who is extremely far from a FF7 expert (played once years ago) and who is not keeping track of the previews for the next act of the remake, I am excited by the possibilities. Like the suggestions, but as a meta-narrative device it reminds me a little bit of Twin Peaks: The Return (maybe depending on interpretation, I'll try not to spoil it ahead, fwiw). Essentially, the game presents you an idea of this "timeline split" giving you a chance to write the wrongs. Build up everything to Aerith's death with a plausible escape, maybe even a completely innocuous one. Maybe Sephiroth just doesn't show up. You get through, maybe some eerie and suggestive dialog, then go snowboard your way into the rest of the game. Give some sense of achievement for people that know the original ff7, or at least people that know Aerith is meant to die (aka everyone), but even have some inclination that it should have happened and something is now wrong, even though you have by all accounts succeeded in protecting her. FF7 deals a lot obviously with recollection, how memory shapes a person, and how to deal with painful memories, being able to take the public recollection of a game that has had a huge calling for a remake for as long as remakes have been in fashion, being able to subvert that should be a necessity. Something like "Aerith has to die and fate has to be fated" is maybe a little cynical of a stance when it is filtered through that, but something like that makes the shock of Aerith dying shocking again. Now the player is helpless (press x to let her die works there) and sad and disappointed in the same way even knowing it's coming. Either way, the sense of "why did we ask to revisit this feeling" feels like a wonderful emotion to try to elicit. Then you get to have people online juggling about how the game is so bold to chastise the player for wanting to play. Big pr move for squeenix
 
The big narrative theme of FF7 was not, "this person must die for our happiness/prosperity!" It was more about coping with loss, valuing life, and embracing a spiritual view of there being life and meaning after death.

If the Remake games are holding true to those themes, then certain characters won't die because of some twisted sense of fate. If anything, that entire idea is far too close thematically to Sephiroth's entire M.O. - where fate has chosen him as the destined ruler of the planet, as the descendant of the Ancients/Genova. And the whole point of Sephiroth as a villain is that his worldview is twisted and wrong. Cloud's triumph over him is not just a physical one, but a spiritual one that rejects Sephiroth's bullshit.

What I think is more likely is that instead of demanding Aerith die to preserve some sense of timeline/destiny/favorable outcome, the parallel universe conceit will be like hey, somewhere out there in the great infinite, the lost ones you care for are still alive out there. Which would help mirror the original game's notion that Aerith dying isn't all that sad when you realize she's still alive in the planet.
 
i don't think people are saying anything about ff7 is about "person must die" rather than there is an existing ff7 story in which a person does die and a remake that has already made a large part of the narrative a self-referential bend towards denying the memories of that game (as in, the memory ghouls attempting to force the events of the game towards a certain direction) would be expected to make some focus and consequence about the most memorable part of that existing story. Having a rugpull of "previous events that you know happened need to happen again" could be considered fate excelling where free will cannot, but it could also just as easily be wrought to be the player accepting what they know happens.

e: sorry for original post if anyone saw it, cat jumped on keyboard
 

Bongo

excused from moderation duty
(he/him)
Staff member
In other words, it all depends on the details of what happens and how it happens, which at this point is not obvious despite being extremely, intentionally similar to a story we've heard before.
 
We're only a few weeks away! And Square-Enix announced yesterday that a demo is coming out later today! Supposedly it's the Kalm flashback chunk of the game, which leads me to believe - like the first game - you can import your save file from that into the game proper when it comes out on the Leap Day.
 

gogglebob

The Goggles Do Nothing
(he/him)
Legitimate, not-being-sarcastic question: Has Square-Enix released a demo of an RPG in recent years that didn't carry progress forward in some way?
 

4-So

Spicy
Finished the demo. It's as good as expected. Maybe even better? Who can say.

There are some fairly noticeable differences between Graphics and Performance modes. The framerate is buttery smooth in Performance as far as I can tell but there's a noticeable hit to some of the detail and lighting - things like hair, ground effects, etc. all have some "jaggies". Not terrible by any means but, as I said, noticeable. Graphics mode fixes those at the expense of framerate, as is commonplace in modern games. There is no middle-ground option like some other games have. A "Graphics+" mode would have been peachy. I'll likely play the full game in Performance, as I did for Remake, but I can already tell there are certain sequences I'm going to want to replay in Graphics mode.

The demo is the Nibelheim flashback, and it basically begins when Sephiroth and Co. arrive in Nibelheim and it ends with the burning of the village and Sephiroth going off to reactor to free Jenova. The whole demo is wonderfully executed and the scouring of Nibelhim is an effective sequence that solidifies the horror of the event.

Eagerly anticipating February 29th.
 
I watched the State of Play video that Sony put out yesterday. Don’t watch that video there is waaaayyyyyy to much in it.

That said holy shit, this game is fucking crazy. Like, it’s friggin nuts how much was crammed into it. I thought Remake was wild when it came out but this is just a whole other tier.
 

Peklo

Oh! Create!
(they/them, she/her)
I found performance mode to be intolerably blurry image quality-wise and couldn't really play the game with it.

I thought the segment covered by the demo was okay. Unlike Remake, the topography covered by Rebirth is going to include naturalistic, uneven surfaces, and judging from this the game design doesn't really interact with that facet all that well; movement feels clunkier than you might hope and fighting in such spaces can be awkward. I also had issues with general visual readability just because of how densely detailed everything is and how many particle effects are happening. It might or might not change once you get an opportunity to roam and left to your own devices, but I'm also a little tired of the game's tendency to so strictly govern your movement through it, either via enforced slow-walk stretches or genuine walk-speed limits, or whatever cinematic flourish it's currently engaged in. Some scenes diminished in efficacy because they just went on too long, but I guess that's just something inherent to this project in the way it's directed and adapting the material.

Piano mini-game feels great and challenging.
 
Finally had a chance to play the demo. Some of the combat changes are a lot bigger than I was expecting AND THEY'RE SO AWESOME. I agree that the movement over terrain feels clunkier than I was expecting it to, and at least in the demo a lot of the open space doesn't feel well-used though that could be something that improves when you actually visit Nibelheim. I suppose we'll see if it's a little better elsewhere in the game when they add the big explorable area to the demo in a couple weeks.

I'm also realizing these games are the only ones in ages that have me making loud excited noises. Maybe FFXIV isn't my favorite Final Fantasy at this point after all.
 
I’m not playing in English, nor would even have the appropriate context to know if this was the case.

But in Japanese, I’m really enjoying how in the Nibelheim flashback, Cloud’s speaking style, inflections, and mannerisms are all very carefully a clone of Zack’s. Takahiro Sakurai works his ass off to do a fantastic impression of Kenichi Suzumura, but in a subtle way that doesn’t give away the game or delve into parody. Just like the first game, it’s plainly obvious there is a truly ridiculous level of love, care, and consideration put into its production. Sometimes it’s just really nice to play a game where you can feel the love that the devs/actors/writers put into it in just about every level.
 

4-So

Spicy
In English, it is quite similar. Don't know if it's as pronounced; don't speak or understand Japanese. It's still an interesting scene to watch when you know who Cloud actually is in the flashback. Or maybe it just works for me because I finished Crisis Core for the first time last year.
 
Yeah in English he's still very much using Cloud's voice and intonations but the speaking style, mannerisms, and attitude are alllllll Zack. It really makes Tifa's own attitude toward him the entire time stand out wonderfully. Bonus points for the person who is actually Cloud having Zack's voice and saying things Zack said to Cloud at the town gate. The presentation is SO incredible.

I'm also seeing elsewhere everyone is kinda having graphics problems with Performance mode. I didn't but now I'm thinking it's because the monitor I'm using is a relic from like 2012-ish that can't do HDR or anything above 1080p.
 

4-So

Spicy
I'm also seeing elsewhere everyone is kinda having graphics problems with Performance mode. I didn't but now I'm thinking it's because the monitor I'm using is a relic from like 2012-ish that can't do HDR or anything above 1080p.

Could be it, yeah.

I have a TV capable of 4K, HDR, all the modern bells and whistles, and the game simply does not look good in Performance. After toying around with it some more, this may be the first game where I choose Graphics mode over Performance. Going to try Performance again on the real deal - maybe the demo is an old build or there will be a patch - but as it stands right now, going Graphics.
 

Peklo

Oh! Create!
(they/them, she/her)
Yeah, your monitor has a huge impact on which of the display modes has the more palatable tradeoff in comparison. Neither are great, with performance resulting in a soft blur, and graphics mode lacking any and all kinds of motion blur that would help a lot with the 30FPS camera panning you have to do--FFXVI suffered from the same until they later patched the option in. Unless a lower framerate has genuinely adverse effects on health like inducing headaches, it seems graphics is what to elect for since so much of this game's presentation and selling point is in pushing visuals, and Remake at least wasn't so reactively demanding to play back when the PS4 release was all it had and what I completed.
 

4-So

Spicy
Played around for a bit in the demo and grabbed two screenshots, one in Performance and one in Graphics. Spoilerin' just be on the safe side but there's nothing here that is significant, especially if you already know the Nibelheim flashback.

sxh6l9L.jpg

xGGzxra.jpg

You can click the Imgur links to take a betterr look. In action, the difference is quite noticeable; more noise in Performance mode than I'm comfortable with.
 

SpoonyBard

Threat Rhyme
(He/Him)
I finished FF7 Remake Intergrade last night, after finishing the main game a few days before, and while I thought about grabbing the demo of Rebirth I think I'll wait until it comes out.

I'm glad Rebirth is only looking for save data from Remake/Intergrade rather than going into finer details of whether or not you got every last secret thing because I ended up missing a couple weapons and Aerith's second limit break on my playthrough and I don't really feel like doing the whole Chapter Select cleanup.

Quick question about the end of Intergrade, though, who were the two dudes who showed up at the very end and seemed like a super big deal with no elaboration, Weiss and Nero? Were they from one of the other FF7 spinoffs I never played or are they just some Original The Characters?
 

SpoonyBard

Threat Rhyme
(He/Him)
Oh geez, then no wonder. I think I memory holed that that game even existed.

Neat that they're adding elements from it I guess, but hopefully they'll add enough context in-game so I don't actually have to go look up the lore from goshdanged Dirge of Cerberus.
 

gogglebob

The Goggles Do Nothing
(he/him)
I cannot imagine SE relying on people to remember a game from 2006 that (to my knowledge) has never been rereleased, and has no plans for a rerelease/remake. Like, the Rebirth Demo was leaning hard on "You played Crisis Core, currently available on our online store, right?" DoC has no such equivalent.

This is the scientific opinion of Dr. Labcoat.

doctor.png
 

SpoonyBard

Threat Rhyme
(He/Him)
Further on the Intergrade story characters, I wish the ending told us whether or not everyone else from the main Avalanche cell we encountered survived the destruction of Sector 7.

The whole side story just ends super abruptly, honestly.
 
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