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America's Favorite Non-prehistoric Cartoon Family - The Simpsons Thread
- Thread starter Johnny Unusual
- Start date
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
A Star Is Burns
I remember watching the premiere of the Critic way back when. My dad was pretty disinterested by it but I remember really liking it and all the episodes that followed. A decade and change later, a friend got the series on DVD and we watched a lot of it and... I just didn't like it as much. On paper there's a lot of great jokes and great performances but I had such strong memories that whenever something was just slightly off of how I remembered a joke I loved, it failed to land for me. It was a real duketastrophe. OK, maybe that's overselling it but I was able to see more of its weaknesses: a lot of dated bits and despite the fact that I love film references, it felt a little too beholden to make a lot of them. If I ever watch it again, I might turn around but instead of an unfairly cancelled classic, now it lives in my mind as a flawed pleasure. Sort of like the original Animaniacs and Freakazoid!: still fond of the best of it but having to accept its limitations. I feel like I have to do the same with this episode a bit, despite it having not only some all time great jokes but a line that has become extremely important in the lexicon of political discourse, particularly as of late.
In this episode, the city of Springfield is chosen as the most undesirable city in America and in a town hall meeting, Marge suggests they show they are cultured and attract attention by holding a film festival. The town agrees and gets very excited. Marge decides to invite big city critic Jay Sherman as a judge and after meeting a man who is both as id-driven as he yet more intellectual, Homer is threatened. Homer wants to prove himself and insists he also becomes a judge. Meanwhile, Mr. Burns decides to use the festival to make a vanity film to sell himself as a hero but during the festival, the most acclaimed film is a confessional art film and quasi-documentary by Barney Gumble about his alcoholism, Burns bribes members of the jury resulting in a deadlock that only Homer can break but he'd much rather vote for "Man Getting Hit By Football", which is pretty much what you would expect it to be. After discussing things with Marge and Jay, Homer decides to give Barney's film another chance and the best film wins.
Obviously, this one is known for a couple things: a crossover with the Critic, for starters, a show created by Simpsons vets which at this point, just changed networks from ABC (who were never able to do the animated sitcom thing) to Fox. Matt Groening was so against an episode being used as marketing for another show he had his name taken off the credits and publicly criticized James L. Brooks. But I almost think a single joke might be the most notable moment in the episode: "Oops, I said the quiet part loud and the loud part quiet." The joke is based on the dramatic cliche of "asides" but man, in the last decade there have been people, primarily politicians, openly saying things that used to be the part you didn't discuss. Of course, weirder still is how little effect it seems to have on the careers of the people who do it.
But as a story... its fine. There's actually more promise and potential than there is delivery in terms of story. I'm kind of OK with Homer feeling threatened and wanting to prove himself as some kind of intellectual but I actually think there's a better story in here about Homer expanding his personal tastes that I think isn't explored enough. I do kind of cringe a little bit in some of the crossover jokes, even when they put a hat on it (mostly how many times the word "critic" is said to remind you there is a show to watch called the Critic). Humour wise, I also feel like there are a few too many weaker film parodies and jokes that rely on the inherent comedy of a celebrity impression, which was my issue with the Critic show itself. But at least they are smart enough to bring from the Critic not only Jon Lovitz but also master voiceman Maurice LaMarche, who was one of that show's most valued celebrity impersonators. Its not perfect but its definitely not nearly as embarrassing as it could have been.
But in terms of good jokes, this episode is stacked with classics that remain heavily memed. The other advantage is that its clear the creators of the episode are film nerds, which is usually also evident in the Critic episodes. The episode was written by Ken Keeler, who did a couple Critics and I feel like that strength is most evidence in mocking the self-indulgent, bloated vanity project of Burns film (which seems ridiculous but feels very much like the film United Passions, where real world FIFA villain Sep Blatter made a film about how awesome he was that got a zero on Rotten Tomatoes and came out just in time for Blatter to be indicted for money laundering.
Oh, Sam Neill, no...
The other side is Barney's film and it does look beautiful and actually makes the character's alcoholism truly tragic instead of a joke. I feel like it is also cribbing from specific art films I've never seen but even in doing that, it does make Barney's film surprisingly effective and I like that. So many works of art within works of art have to be presented as good simply through word of mouth and when they show it, it looks like crap. Its part of the reason I didn't like the movie The TV Set, a satire about a TV passion project getting overhauled into crass entertainment; the story as it is intended never looks like it would actually genuinely be good. Its tricky to make good art within art for some reason and it is often damning when it is bad and the entire story is predicated on its goodness. I feel like the Simpsons, a very goofy show, could coast on not doing that but in doing it, it does make you root for Barney's painfully confessional film. Where he suggests a girl scout meeting might have an alcohol problem.
A Star Is Burns is not the show at its best but its a competent one with surprising high points. As a "commercial" its not as crass as it could be but it does make it a little creaky in some spots. Worth noting is that Al Jean, the co-creator of the Critic, has been in charge of the Simpsons since season thirteen. Seems easy to blame him for the downturn but remember: the panda incident occurred before he arrived. Just something to keep in mind.
Other great jokes:
"You've stolen my soul!"
"That's the joke..."
"You must be the man who didn't know if he had a pimple or a boil."
"It was a gummi bear."
The happiest ending possible to this story.
"We both made shells for the Nazis. BUT MINE WORKED DAMMIT!"
"Yeah, well Scooby Doo can doodoo, but Jimmy Carter is smarter!"
Other notes:
I think Marge is fantasizing about Lee Majors again.
I remember watching the premiere of the Critic way back when. My dad was pretty disinterested by it but I remember really liking it and all the episodes that followed. A decade and change later, a friend got the series on DVD and we watched a lot of it and... I just didn't like it as much. On paper there's a lot of great jokes and great performances but I had such strong memories that whenever something was just slightly off of how I remembered a joke I loved, it failed to land for me. It was a real duketastrophe. OK, maybe that's overselling it but I was able to see more of its weaknesses: a lot of dated bits and despite the fact that I love film references, it felt a little too beholden to make a lot of them. If I ever watch it again, I might turn around but instead of an unfairly cancelled classic, now it lives in my mind as a flawed pleasure. Sort of like the original Animaniacs and Freakazoid!: still fond of the best of it but having to accept its limitations. I feel like I have to do the same with this episode a bit, despite it having not only some all time great jokes but a line that has become extremely important in the lexicon of political discourse, particularly as of late.
In this episode, the city of Springfield is chosen as the most undesirable city in America and in a town hall meeting, Marge suggests they show they are cultured and attract attention by holding a film festival. The town agrees and gets very excited. Marge decides to invite big city critic Jay Sherman as a judge and after meeting a man who is both as id-driven as he yet more intellectual, Homer is threatened. Homer wants to prove himself and insists he also becomes a judge. Meanwhile, Mr. Burns decides to use the festival to make a vanity film to sell himself as a hero but during the festival, the most acclaimed film is a confessional art film and quasi-documentary by Barney Gumble about his alcoholism, Burns bribes members of the jury resulting in a deadlock that only Homer can break but he'd much rather vote for "Man Getting Hit By Football", which is pretty much what you would expect it to be. After discussing things with Marge and Jay, Homer decides to give Barney's film another chance and the best film wins.
Obviously, this one is known for a couple things: a crossover with the Critic, for starters, a show created by Simpsons vets which at this point, just changed networks from ABC (who were never able to do the animated sitcom thing) to Fox. Matt Groening was so against an episode being used as marketing for another show he had his name taken off the credits and publicly criticized James L. Brooks. But I almost think a single joke might be the most notable moment in the episode: "Oops, I said the quiet part loud and the loud part quiet." The joke is based on the dramatic cliche of "asides" but man, in the last decade there have been people, primarily politicians, openly saying things that used to be the part you didn't discuss. Of course, weirder still is how little effect it seems to have on the careers of the people who do it.
But as a story... its fine. There's actually more promise and potential than there is delivery in terms of story. I'm kind of OK with Homer feeling threatened and wanting to prove himself as some kind of intellectual but I actually think there's a better story in here about Homer expanding his personal tastes that I think isn't explored enough. I do kind of cringe a little bit in some of the crossover jokes, even when they put a hat on it (mostly how many times the word "critic" is said to remind you there is a show to watch called the Critic). Humour wise, I also feel like there are a few too many weaker film parodies and jokes that rely on the inherent comedy of a celebrity impression, which was my issue with the Critic show itself. But at least they are smart enough to bring from the Critic not only Jon Lovitz but also master voiceman Maurice LaMarche, who was one of that show's most valued celebrity impersonators. Its not perfect but its definitely not nearly as embarrassing as it could have been.
But in terms of good jokes, this episode is stacked with classics that remain heavily memed. The other advantage is that its clear the creators of the episode are film nerds, which is usually also evident in the Critic episodes. The episode was written by Ken Keeler, who did a couple Critics and I feel like that strength is most evidence in mocking the self-indulgent, bloated vanity project of Burns film (which seems ridiculous but feels very much like the film United Passions, where real world FIFA villain Sep Blatter made a film about how awesome he was that got a zero on Rotten Tomatoes and came out just in time for Blatter to be indicted for money laundering.
Oh, Sam Neill, no...
The other side is Barney's film and it does look beautiful and actually makes the character's alcoholism truly tragic instead of a joke. I feel like it is also cribbing from specific art films I've never seen but even in doing that, it does make Barney's film surprisingly effective and I like that. So many works of art within works of art have to be presented as good simply through word of mouth and when they show it, it looks like crap. Its part of the reason I didn't like the movie The TV Set, a satire about a TV passion project getting overhauled into crass entertainment; the story as it is intended never looks like it would actually genuinely be good. Its tricky to make good art within art for some reason and it is often damning when it is bad and the entire story is predicated on its goodness. I feel like the Simpsons, a very goofy show, could coast on not doing that but in doing it, it does make you root for Barney's painfully confessional film. Where he suggests a girl scout meeting might have an alcohol problem.
A Star Is Burns is not the show at its best but its a competent one with surprising high points. As a "commercial" its not as crass as it could be but it does make it a little creaky in some spots. Worth noting is that Al Jean, the co-creator of the Critic, has been in charge of the Simpsons since season thirteen. Seems easy to blame him for the downturn but remember: the panda incident occurred before he arrived. Just something to keep in mind.
Other great jokes:
"You've stolen my soul!"
"That's the joke..."
"You must be the man who didn't know if he had a pimple or a boil."
"It was a gummi bear."
The happiest ending possible to this story.
"We both made shells for the Nazis. BUT MINE WORKED DAMMIT!"
"Yeah, well Scooby Doo can doodoo, but Jimmy Carter is smarter!"
Other notes:
I think Marge is fantasizing about Lee Majors again.
"Doesn't this family know any songs that aren't commercials?"
Argh... That Boo-urns clip cut off the best part...
Argh... That Boo-urns clip cut off the best part...
Ludendorkk
(he/him)
It remains deeply funny that this is the one episode Groening doesn't want his name on
Red Silvers
Pokemon Red w/ 1 Nidoran
Upon closer inspection, these are loafers.
For some utterly bizarre reason that I have, to this day, been unable to figure out, The Critic was the one animated comedy for grown ups that my parents wouldn’t let me watch.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
The sequel to the gentle classic short film "the Red Balloon", reframing the balloon as an action hero is a highlight.
I think its a fine episode, but a bit wonky. But yeah, the jokes that land land hard.
Did they let you watch A Star is Burns when it first aired?
They did not monitor my tv watching otherwise.
But when they saw Cartoon Jon Lovitz on the screen, hoo-boy
But when they saw Cartoon Jon Lovitz on the screen, hoo-boy
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
Is it be because he wore devil jammies on SNL?
I think it may have been an attempt at reverse psychology to make me appreciate Jon Lovitz more for being denied him at a formulative age
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
Lisa's Wedding
I consider myself lucky because I have a pretty good relationship with my family. Did my parents ever embarrass me? Sure, in some small ways. The only really awkward one that comes to mind is my dad making an ill-considered argument while discussing the micro-aggressions women in the workplace face. The other one is mom, knowing I was into anime, tried to make an anime girl cake. It was, and I'm serious, a Powerpuff Girl with tits. No, seriously. The breasts were Viva Puffs. But as awkward as the moment was, it was also charmingly silly. I know there are people who have much tougher relationships with their families. And as embarrassing as the Simpsons would be as a family, better that than being awful.
In this episode of the Simpsons, Lisa runs into a fortune teller at a Renaissance Festival who promises to tell her about her wedding. The tale begins with Lisa meeting a boy, Hugh Parkfield, at university and after butting heads, the two fall hopelessly in love. Hugh takes Lisa to meet his parents and proposes to Lisa, who accepts. They agree to have their wedding in her hometown of Springfield but Lisa is incredibly nervous about her family embarrassing her. And sure enough, Hugh is put through the wringer with their shenanigans. But despite everything, Hugh is determined not to let it get him down. But on the wedding day, Lisa confronts Hugh about not honoring a silly family tradition, as not doing it would hurt Homer's feelings. Hugh reluctantly agrees but mentions his intent to "not have to deal" with the Simpsons anymore. Lisa is insulted that he thinks so little of them because despite her complaints, she loves her family. Lisa decides she can't be with someone who can't understand that and calls off the wedding.
I'm actually a little surprised this episode happened in this season: I assumed this was an intended alternate take on the seemingly annual flashback episode tradition but it shares a season with "And Maggie Makes Three". This is the first "future" episode and EASILY the best, though the very late season "Holidays of Future Past" is actually surprisingly strong. One of the things I like is that it lets us see what we all knew: Lisa is going to be exactly the kind of person she wants to be. When Lisa describes her and Hugh's similarities, it seems like a list of things Lisa wrote about what she wanted to be like when she was older. Lisa gets out of Springfield and into greener pastures and a wider world than her parents. With her abilities, she can do what she wants and does. The Simpsons can be a cynical show but I feel like the writers took Lisa's future seriously despite silly airplanes and melting robots. Giving Lisa anything less than a stellar future would kind of feel like a betrayal. But that doesn't rob us of conflict here.
And the conflict is that Lisa left behind Springfield but in coming home, having to see how much she values them. In the last few seasons, Lisa has been so used to her family's antics that she's often sarcastic about it, and despite being the show's most optimistic and positive character finds herself rolling her eyes at a lot of this nonsense. She does in the beginning of the episode when Homer boasts about his gluttony. Her family is crass and embarrassing and she complains about her father a lot. But she still loves them and wants to treat them with respect, despite everything. Hugh, voiced perfectly by Mandy Patankin playing a Hugh Grant-esque lead, seems like a genuinely great guy, if a bit stuffy, but seeing him try to use an insult to her family as a complement to Lisa is pretty nasty stuff. Hugh thinks he respects Lisa but calling her a "flower who grew out of a pot of dirt" is an extremely ugly sentiment that disrespects her, her family and Lisa's love for her family. We don't see it but when Lisa leaves, she's probably only going to see them on Holidays for most of her life. She doesn't hate Springfield but there are other places for her to belong to. We last see future Lisa in tears but her story is going to move along with great happiness, or at least fulfillment from doing great things. But in this moment, the story about the future is looking back at what brought her there.
Lisa's Wedding is a truly sweet episode. It would be easy just to have fun with the Futurama-style gags (I love that 15 years in the future is ridiculously futuristic) but its an episode about Lisa seeing a sad part of her future but also a happy one in that she gets to see how much she loves her family and her father in particular. It helps that as obnoxious as he can be, Homer is in sweet, lovable pooch mode. He dumb and clumsy but spends the episode being a complete sweetheart. I also love his future design most of all: "thinner" hair (it points downwards now) one come over strand instead of two, a little tubbier and two Jetsons-style rectangles for buttons. I also love that for an episode with a lot of gags of an absurd future and a lot of chances for "where are they now", it never loses sight of its main narrative and in fact seems very focused. I like that the Simpsons actually get pretty happy futures. Homer is stuck in the same position in his dead end job but can you imagine Homer enjoying more responsibility? At least for an extended period? Meanwhile, I feel like later episodes give Bart at the very least a mildly shitty future. Here, Bart's made mistakes and there's a bit of sadness to him (and maybe some delusion), but he loves his job and seems to have a rich life outside of it. We want these characters to have nice futures and they have ones that are sort of fitting to who they are without being perfect. Lisa's Wedding is a strong one. You'll never stop the Simpsons, but here we get to have the best epilogue you could want. There are some tears, there's some laughter and two characters walking away as we always will remember them.
Jokes I missed before:
A lot of freeze frame gags I missed from the era where VHS wouldn't always hold still if you paused it. The best being "Senator and Mrs. Dracula" on the list of wanted celebrities.
Also,
Other Great Jokes:
Lisa and Hugh being "utterly humorless about their vegetarianism."
Homer's oblivious reaction to Milhouse threatening a performance evaluation.
"The only thing bruise in that fall was my spine."
"Fox turned into a hardcore sex channel so gradually, I hardly even noticed."
"Oh, Milhouse doesn't count."
You know what's great about you English? Octopussy. Man, I must have seen that movie... twice."
"And it never would have happened if it had been in a church with God instead of out here in the cheap showiness of nature."
Other notes:
Weirdly, Kent Brockman sounds wrong. I can't tell if its just a different voice actor or if they intended it to be some other newsreader and towards the end of animating it, someone said "couldn't it be Kent?"
I don't care if its a scam, this is a good two-headed doggo.
PICTURE PHONE IS NOW!
Future Maggie is fucking rad.
I consider myself lucky because I have a pretty good relationship with my family. Did my parents ever embarrass me? Sure, in some small ways. The only really awkward one that comes to mind is my dad making an ill-considered argument while discussing the micro-aggressions women in the workplace face. The other one is mom, knowing I was into anime, tried to make an anime girl cake. It was, and I'm serious, a Powerpuff Girl with tits. No, seriously. The breasts were Viva Puffs. But as awkward as the moment was, it was also charmingly silly. I know there are people who have much tougher relationships with their families. And as embarrassing as the Simpsons would be as a family, better that than being awful.
In this episode of the Simpsons, Lisa runs into a fortune teller at a Renaissance Festival who promises to tell her about her wedding. The tale begins with Lisa meeting a boy, Hugh Parkfield, at university and after butting heads, the two fall hopelessly in love. Hugh takes Lisa to meet his parents and proposes to Lisa, who accepts. They agree to have their wedding in her hometown of Springfield but Lisa is incredibly nervous about her family embarrassing her. And sure enough, Hugh is put through the wringer with their shenanigans. But despite everything, Hugh is determined not to let it get him down. But on the wedding day, Lisa confronts Hugh about not honoring a silly family tradition, as not doing it would hurt Homer's feelings. Hugh reluctantly agrees but mentions his intent to "not have to deal" with the Simpsons anymore. Lisa is insulted that he thinks so little of them because despite her complaints, she loves her family. Lisa decides she can't be with someone who can't understand that and calls off the wedding.
I'm actually a little surprised this episode happened in this season: I assumed this was an intended alternate take on the seemingly annual flashback episode tradition but it shares a season with "And Maggie Makes Three". This is the first "future" episode and EASILY the best, though the very late season "Holidays of Future Past" is actually surprisingly strong. One of the things I like is that it lets us see what we all knew: Lisa is going to be exactly the kind of person she wants to be. When Lisa describes her and Hugh's similarities, it seems like a list of things Lisa wrote about what she wanted to be like when she was older. Lisa gets out of Springfield and into greener pastures and a wider world than her parents. With her abilities, she can do what she wants and does. The Simpsons can be a cynical show but I feel like the writers took Lisa's future seriously despite silly airplanes and melting robots. Giving Lisa anything less than a stellar future would kind of feel like a betrayal. But that doesn't rob us of conflict here.
And the conflict is that Lisa left behind Springfield but in coming home, having to see how much she values them. In the last few seasons, Lisa has been so used to her family's antics that she's often sarcastic about it, and despite being the show's most optimistic and positive character finds herself rolling her eyes at a lot of this nonsense. She does in the beginning of the episode when Homer boasts about his gluttony. Her family is crass and embarrassing and she complains about her father a lot. But she still loves them and wants to treat them with respect, despite everything. Hugh, voiced perfectly by Mandy Patankin playing a Hugh Grant-esque lead, seems like a genuinely great guy, if a bit stuffy, but seeing him try to use an insult to her family as a complement to Lisa is pretty nasty stuff. Hugh thinks he respects Lisa but calling her a "flower who grew out of a pot of dirt" is an extremely ugly sentiment that disrespects her, her family and Lisa's love for her family. We don't see it but when Lisa leaves, she's probably only going to see them on Holidays for most of her life. She doesn't hate Springfield but there are other places for her to belong to. We last see future Lisa in tears but her story is going to move along with great happiness, or at least fulfillment from doing great things. But in this moment, the story about the future is looking back at what brought her there.
Lisa's Wedding is a truly sweet episode. It would be easy just to have fun with the Futurama-style gags (I love that 15 years in the future is ridiculously futuristic) but its an episode about Lisa seeing a sad part of her future but also a happy one in that she gets to see how much she loves her family and her father in particular. It helps that as obnoxious as he can be, Homer is in sweet, lovable pooch mode. He dumb and clumsy but spends the episode being a complete sweetheart. I also love his future design most of all: "thinner" hair (it points downwards now) one come over strand instead of two, a little tubbier and two Jetsons-style rectangles for buttons. I also love that for an episode with a lot of gags of an absurd future and a lot of chances for "where are they now", it never loses sight of its main narrative and in fact seems very focused. I like that the Simpsons actually get pretty happy futures. Homer is stuck in the same position in his dead end job but can you imagine Homer enjoying more responsibility? At least for an extended period? Meanwhile, I feel like later episodes give Bart at the very least a mildly shitty future. Here, Bart's made mistakes and there's a bit of sadness to him (and maybe some delusion), but he loves his job and seems to have a rich life outside of it. We want these characters to have nice futures and they have ones that are sort of fitting to who they are without being perfect. Lisa's Wedding is a strong one. You'll never stop the Simpsons, but here we get to have the best epilogue you could want. There are some tears, there's some laughter and two characters walking away as we always will remember them.
Jokes I missed before:
A lot of freeze frame gags I missed from the era where VHS wouldn't always hold still if you paused it. The best being "Senator and Mrs. Dracula" on the list of wanted celebrities.
Also,
Other Great Jokes:
Lisa and Hugh being "utterly humorless about their vegetarianism."
Homer's oblivious reaction to Milhouse threatening a performance evaluation.
"The only thing bruise in that fall was my spine."
"Fox turned into a hardcore sex channel so gradually, I hardly even noticed."
"Oh, Milhouse doesn't count."
You know what's great about you English? Octopussy. Man, I must have seen that movie... twice."
"And it never would have happened if it had been in a church with God instead of out here in the cheap showiness of nature."
Other notes:
Weirdly, Kent Brockman sounds wrong. I can't tell if its just a different voice actor or if they intended it to be some other newsreader and towards the end of animating it, someone said "couldn't it be Kent?"
I don't care if its a scam, this is a good two-headed doggo.
PICTURE PHONE IS NOW!
Future Maggie is fucking rad.
Last edited:
Nier: Automata (2017)
Red Silvers
Pokemon Red w/ 1 Nidoran
Will that girl ever shut up?
I did this exact thing with GIFs from that (and the robot programmed to feel pain) back on the old forum's video game screenshot thread.
Speaking of robots...
Last edited:
Who designed those robots?!
A true romantic
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
I just noticed that in his first appearance Frink mentions his wife. Then in the episode where Herb invents the baby translator, his baby plane escapes and he says "my wife is going to kill me." So at this point either they are separated or their marriage is so fractured that Frink is ready to cheat on him. Or maybe this is his wife? But this isn't a husband and wife vibe.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
The amazing stories of one of the biggest assholes to guest star who wasn't Elon Musk.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
The thing is Don Brodka is one of the best one off characters in the show. Who could have also been played very well by any number of non-jerks. Imagine Jonathan Banks (now) in that role.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
My one regret is that Marge Be Not Proud won't appear in time on my write ups for Christmas. Its the best Christmas ep, the funniest and it gets under my skin. "Good night, Bart." is heartbreaking.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
Oh, yeah. Haha. Holy shit. I feel like they made the mistake of glomming onto people they perceived as "liberal" "heroes" for a hot second for guest roles before their knowledge of their shittiness was more widespread. But making an ENTIRE EPISODE about how AWESOME YET TRAGIC Musk is still amazing. Like the season before I was disappointed in the show for doing a "Lady Gaga" is great episode but that was nothing.