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We're all just here for the deep Urza lore - Talking about Magic: The Gathering!

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
17 Lands data is showing WB as one of the three worst performing archetypes, which makes sense to me. Black's commons don't feel super strong or deep, and your deck has to be able to function even if the reanimator plan doesn't work out. It definitely can work, but you probably have to be the only person drafting it in your pod.
Yeah. I think the way you end up in reanimator is 1 of 3 ways: (1) you get like a 5th or 6th pick Shroudstomper or Vile Mutilator and nothing else is that strong otherwise; (2) lots of early picks of B or W removal and then maybe pack 2 you get a WB rare; (3) start out with GB Delirium and then the Green dries up?

That's interesting there's 2 Blue archetypes at the bottom when I feel like Blue has some of the best Commons in the entire set. But the top-end for UR and UB isn't very compelling for sure... Intruding Soulrager and Skullsnap Nuisance make me sad compared to any of the other multicolor 2-drops.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
That's interesting there's 2 Blue archetypes at the bottom when I feel like Blue has some of the best Commons in the entire set. But the top-end for UR and UB isn't very compelling for sure... Intruding Soulrager and Skullsnap Nuisance make me sad compared to any of the other multicolor 2-drops.
Yeah, I think you've pretty much hit on exactly why those archetypes aren't performing well. It's not that blue is bad, it's that the archetypes are bad. The good blue cards are just going to be better in your UW or UG decks, where the synergies and payoffs are all stronger.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
Man, my draft performance has tanked since Monday. I had a solid Bo3 trophy then, but I switched back to premiere draft since the season reset and got hit with an awful streak of bad luck. Just flooding or getting mana screwed all over the place. I might have to slum it in quick draft for a little bit tomorrow just to convert some gold back into gems.

That trophy I did get finally gave me enough Play-In Points to enter one of those tournaments, though. I figure I'll try it just for the hell of it, even at zero wins I think you get a handful of gems. Who knows, maybe I'll make it all the way to the Pro Tour (I won't).
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
That trophy I did get finally gave me enough Play-In Points to enter one of those tournaments, though. I figure I'll try it just for the hell of it, even at zero wins I think you get a handful of gems. Who knows, maybe I'll make it all the way to the Pro Tour (I won't).
Hey all that matters is you have fun! I played in a RCQ a couple months ago with Bloomburrow and only went 2-3 in the Sealed portion, but it was still super fun to play in that competitive environment. And I'm planning to go to another one this month!


Man, my draft performance has tanked since Monday. I had a solid Bo3 trophy then, but I switched back to premiere draft since the season reset and got hit with an awful streak of bad luck. Just flooding or getting mana screwed all over the place. I might have to slum it in quick draft for a little bit tomorrow just to convert some gold back into gems.
This is definitely part of what makes Drafting such a challenging format for me compared to Constructed; there's so many variables, it can be hard to tell where I need to focus on improving, between all the Bo1 variance on Arena + mana issues + unlucky draws + playing well in matches + draft picks and deckbuilding... sheesh!
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
Bo1 variance
It's such a shame that the only way to do ranked drafts is in Bo1. The game was just not designed to be played that way and I really don't like being forced into it. I'll generally only do premiere draft until I hit platinum (which doesn't usually take too many drafts), and then I'll switch back to Bo3.

As far as getting better at drafting, it's probably one of the most challenging things to learn in Magic, so don't feel bad! I've been focusing more and more on limited for at least a year now and I still have so much to learn. One really useful tool is the card data over at 17 Lands, which can tell you what cards are very strong in a vacuum (or, conversely, what cards are underperformers). Obviously there are plenty of times when you'll have to take a sub-par card to fit the needs of the deck you're drafting, but knowing what's good if you're choosing between two cards can help you if you're making your first couple of picks, or help you identify if you get passed a really clear signal that a particular color is open.

I do still play constructed, though, and lately I've really been enjoying the U/W Oculus standard deck that's popped up. The version I'm running looks a lot like this one, but I have a playset of Oculus in the maindeck and Monastery Mentors in the sideboard. I can definitely see the logic in running some Mentors in the main though, the extra threat diversity in game one can be nice against grindier decks.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
Well I did a quick draft tonight and went 6-3, so that was a nice change of pace. It wasn't even a particularly busted RW deck either; I had 1 Rare (Razorkin Needlehead) and not even most of the good uncommons in those colors (I had Midnight Mayhem and played it exactly once). I also had an opponent who played 2 copies of Chainsaw and I somehow won the game because they conceded when I'm pretty sure they were going to win? It was a very close match, but by no means was it over over at that time. Could've been technical reasons or something but it wasn't like they timed out a bunch or anything like that... and of course I lost my last match of that run to a turn 5 Shroudstomper in BW.


One really useful tool is the card data over at 17 Lands, which can tell you what cards are very strong in a vacuum (or, conversely, what cards are underperformers). Obviously there are plenty of times when you'll have to take a sub-par card to fit the needs of the deck you're drafting, but knowing what's good if you're choosing between two cards can help you if you're making your first couple of picks, or help you identify if you get passed a really clear signal that a particular color is open.
I looked at 17 Lands a lot more with Bloomburrow but not so much in Duskmourn. I've also been listenting to the Limited Resources podcast for a few months.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
I do still play constructed, though, and lately I've really been enjoying the U/W Oculus standard deck that's popped up. The version I'm running looks a lot like this one, but I have a playset of Oculus in the maindeck and Monastery Mentors in the sideboard. I can definitely see the logic in running some Mentors in the main though, the extra threat diversity in game one can be nice against grindier decks.
I'm not sure I've ever won the times I've played against this deck in Bo1. For my money, UW is probably the best color combination in Standard right now, but I would love to see how this deck fairs against Domain. I've been switching between Orzhov or Mono-Black Midrange, myself.

At this point I am strongly considering dropping the money to build a paper Standard deck; I have some minor aspirations to travel to the Spotlight series tournament in January. Mainly because I've never done anything like that before and it would be exciting to experience paper Magic outside of a LGS environment. But that also means I'd have to commit to a Standard deck, and Arena makes me too spoiled for switching around decks all the time!
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
I'm not sure I've ever won the times I've played against this deck in Bo1. For my money, UW is probably the best color combination in Standard right now, but I would love to see how this deck fairs against Domain. I've been switching between Orzhov or Mono-Black Midrange, myself.
I somehow haven't run into Domain yet (or any red Leyline decks, go figure), but I feel like the deck packs enough counterspells between maindeck and sideboard that you can probably cross the finish line before Atraxa comes down. My last three matches in a row, I've won through significant graveyard hate - one had double Leyline of the Void, one had double Rest in Peace, and the last also had a Leyline that just did not matter. The deck can be shockingly grindy. (For what it's worth, I'm also interested in the new Domain lists, but I don't want to craft a bunch of Overlords before I'm done drafting Duskmourn.)

At this point I am strongly considering dropping the money to build a paper Standard deck; I have some minor aspirations to travel to the Spotlight series tournament in January.
If you're thinking about this, then I have to recommend that you make the switch from Bo1 and focus on Bo3 instead. If you want to go to a tournament, the best way to prepare is to have a ton of experience with your deck and your sideboard plans for any given matchup. Arena makes it easy, but don't overlook playing at your LGS either! Getting a bunch of reps in with your deck will help make sure you catch all your triggers and things that Arena does automatically. Speaking from experience, it's super easy to miss a lot of that stuff in paper, especially if you've been playing for a couple of hours already.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
If you're thinking about this, then I have to recommend that you make the switch from Bo1 and focus on Bo3 instead. If you want to go to a tournament, the best way to prepare is to have a ton of experience with your deck and your sideboard plans for any given matchup.
I did start doing this by the way. It definitely feels like it helps my win rate overall. I also just finished a 2-0 game against Domain that had me feeling great! The first match must've taken like 20 minutes, it was grueling. One highlight was stealing their Atraxa with Cruelclaw's Heist and then never playing it. The second match was a bit shorter, and I could've totally won on turn 4 if I had the 4th land to play the Unstoppable Slasher + Bloodletter of Aclazotz combo.

However, in both games, the game winning card was the same thing: Unholy Annex/Ritual Chamber from Duskmourn. I'm so glad that card exists for Black right now... it just feels like "classic Black card" that also kicks ass. Makes me feel nostalgic for playing Promise of Power way back in Mirrodin Standard.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
Hey, nice! Welcome to the way Magic is designed to be played. And yeah, as a former (and probably future) Domain player, hand hate can be super effective against the deck. It already struggles to interact with the board early on, and I'm seeing some lists now that are cutting Leyline Binding altogether? That seems like a ridiculous mistake to me since that card is one of the biggest reasons you play Domain at all, but I'll admit I have yet to try any of them out.

Another new version of an old deck that's caught my interest is the latest Mardu Greasefang iteration over in Pioneer/Explorer. I'd only need to craft the two Duskmourn cards, which is slightly less of an ask than the multiple playsets of Overlords that Domain wants right now. A friend was running this last night and it sounded like a great time.

a 2-0 game
Minor thing, but you've got the terminology backwards here. A match is a series of individual games, not the other way around.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
Welcome to the way Magic is designed to be played.
I mean, I used to play Standard at FNM many many years ago. I just didn't really think about doing it much in Arena, and honestly I was kind of skeptical that it really made much of a difference between Bo1 and Bo3... but psychologically, at least, it definitely feels way better to get at least 1 more game against a random person. It also feels good to play Bo3 against Leyline of Resonance and just completely crush it after sideboarding, lol.

Minor thing, but you've got the terminology backwards here. A match is a series of individual games, not the other way around.
Aha! I've always felt like I get these two terms mixed up.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
I mean, I used to play Standard at FNM many many years ago. I just didn't really think about doing it much in Arena, and honestly I was kind of skeptical that it really made much of a difference between Bo1 and Bo3... but psychologically, at least, it definitely feels way better to get at least 1 more game against a random person. It also feels good to play Bo3 against Leyline of Resonance and just completely crush it after sideboarding, lol.
Yeah, sorry if that came off condescending! Not my intent at all. But I completely agree that crushing a match post-board is absolutely one of the best feelings in Magic.

I'm still trying to make up my mind about doing the Play-In event tomorrow. On the one hand, it'd be nice to turn these otherwise useless points into some more gems, but on the other hand...playing a competitive event as Bo1 is less than ideal. Unfortunately the Bo3 version is on Friday of next week, and trying to do something like that after I get home tired from work is going to be a bad idea. If only for that reason I'm leaning towards doing it tomorrow, I just don't love the idea of being completely at the mercy of variance (more than the usual amount that comes with any sealed event). I'm hoping that by going in with no expectations, I won't be disappointed.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
I went 3-0 at FNM draft tonight. It felt nice considering my track record with Duskmourn on Arena is pretty bad. My deck didn't feel too crazy, but I did have the Black Overlord and a Dissection Tools, both of which I drew fairly consistently. Otherwise it was a RB deck with the normal stuff there. It was also only a 6-person pod, so that probably improved my deck because not many others had been picking red.


I'm still trying to make up my mind about doing the Play-In event tomorrow. On the one hand, it'd be nice to turn these otherwise useless points into some more gems, but on the other hand...playing a competitive event as Bo1 is less than ideal.
I was planning to try the Arena Open tomorrow and do Bo3. It's too bad you can't use those play points for that... honestly the "pro" category of stuff in Arena is needlessly confusing. I do think playing Bo1 so much has actually made me feel less invested when I lose... but maybe not when the cost of playing in a thing is higher than normal like these events.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
Thinking about it some more, I'm not sure what it means that I lost game 1 in all of my matches and then won the next 2...
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
My deck didn't feel too crazy, but I did have the Black Overlord and a Dissection Tools, both of which I drew fairly consistently.
I mean, those are two of the biggest bombs in the format, but you still have to play well to get to first place. Nice job!
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
And my Arena Open ended with 1-1. Lost to a White Overlord. I guess I can't complain too much about it because my first match I won because of Valgavoth's Onslaught (maybe. I am confident that I played better than my opponent). I wish I could've played another set of matches with the same pool but an entirely different deck. I went with GW mostly because it had the most combination of creatures and spells (and my bomb card). But my Blue and Black were very stacked with removal and decent Eerie stuff... except I only had like 9 relevant creatures between those colors, but I wonder if that would've been okay. At least I only got land flooded in one game.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
I only had like 9 relevant creatures between those colors, but I wonder if that would've been okay.
In my experience, it never is. I've yet to meet a limited deck that doesn't want at least 14 creatures.

I've been trying out that Mardu Greasefang list posted above and it's just not working for me. You don't have a high enough density of vehicles to hit the combo consistently, and the rest of the deck is too fair compared to what everything else in the format wants to do. I don't understand how people are going 5-0 with this in MTGO leagues because I can't get above 30% winrate. Maybe it's just the difference between real Pioneer and the Pio-near version that Explorer is.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
You know what's funny is I talked to a guy last night who was wanting to build that deck too. He asked if I would trade him the Fear of Missing Out I drafted, since it goes in the deck, lol. (He left before it ended so that didn't end up happening, heh)
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
My Duskmourn draft winrate didn't really improve much last week, so both for the sake of my continued enjoyment of the game and in the interest of conserving some resources for Foundations next month, I decided to give up trying to draft to rare completion and open my 90-ish packs today. While I was losing with Greasefang yesterday I ran into a couple of people playing this new version of the old Enigmatic Incarnation lists, and happened to open enough Overlords today that I only needed to spend maybe 4 mythic wildcards to try it out. I'm glad I did because I had a blast playing it; I'd forgotten how fun these kinds of toolbox decks can be. I had an overall positive winrate, but I'm not sure if the manabase is quite right. I had a couple of games where I just couldn't find any white mana (including the green Overlord). Might try swapping a couple of the blue sources for white ones tomorrow.

As an aside, I'm starting to wonder if the Overlord cycle was maybe a design mistake. They're so powerful and they're already so prevalent in Standard and Pioneer. They may not be powerful enough for Modern (I have zero direct experience there), but I feel like it's going to take a lot to get these out of people's lists. Especially in an eternal format like Pioneer.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
lol holy shit that deck looks ridiculously hard to pilot. It's even playing the Blue Overlord which I haven't even really seen much in Constructed. I basically don't pay attention to non-Standard formats in Constructed so I have no opinion on how good they are there. But I can easily see how people are gonna find ways to abuse them. You know, any time they make creatures with ETB effects and really cheap alternative costs compared to their CMC, it seems to cause lots of... Grief.

I did 2 drafts today that were both very silly Eerie decks with a primary win condition of Scrabbling Skullcrab. 1st deck was UB and only got 2 wins; I basically forced the UB color because I was curious to try it and my pack 1 didn't have anything enticing enough to make me avoid picking Defiled Crypt/Cadaver Lab. I also got crap draws mostly and a couple bad mana issues so that was not a good showcase for those colors. I do really think UB has some legs on it and might be better than people give it credit for... but maybe not, like, a whole lot better.

My second deck was WU and I'm currently 4-1 despite having a really crappy version of that deck; I have no real top-end or bombs to speak of, and my previous 2 wins were entirely on the back of that Skullcrab. I even played against GR Delirium, its worst matchup, in both games and won entirely by milling.
 

lincolnic

can stop, will stop
(he/him)
I have tried really hard not to be a Magic doomer in the past, but making all Universes Beyond sets Standard-legal (and by extension releasing six Standard sets every year) really feels like the beginning of the end for me. Next year there won't be a single constructed format where you can avoid UB cards. None. I don't know what bigger way they can tell me "this game is no longer for you" than by turning it into Fortnite.
 

YangusKhan

does the Underpants Dance
(He/Him/His)
I can sympathize, but so far at least, it isn't bothering me that much just yet... but I can easily see that changing once things start to roll out next year. Something definitely feels kinda wacky when you could play Serra Angel in the same deck as The Green Goblin and, like, Aerith.
 

That Old Chestnut

A E S T H E T I C
(he/him)
HpwHxXx.jpeg


I GOT ONE

I FINALLY FUCKING GOT ONE





(granted, I could've just dropped the $40 to order one but I DID NOT WANT TO DO THAT)
 

Kirin

Summon for hire
(he/him)
Nice. I can think of some old school 90s decks I’d have stuck that right into immediately.
 

That Old Chestnut

A E S T H E T I C
(he/him)
Nah, I'm actually okay with them reprinting harder to find / more in demand cards. I don't even like spending $20 on a single, and never really did like the idea of it being a "rich man's game." That's just me, though, and I know that topic opens up a whole can of worms when it comes to accessibility v.s. power creep.

(It's probably still gonna end up being expensive as hell anyway...)
 
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