Two will enter, one will leave: The Thunderdome Thunderdome

[Regulus]

When I first saw the Ragnarok v. Durandal matchup, my immediate reaction was pretty similar to what most other voters have been saying; fightercraft from Macross certainly seem way more maneuverable. This is not terribly surprising, since one comes from an animated series and the other comes from a 2 dimensional shooting game.

As I've thought about it more, though (and let cognitive dissonance set in), I believe the Ragnarok is perhaps being sold short. Part of it is trying to reconcile game mechanics with "real world" performance. Even if we're strictly talking game mechanics, though, I think that the Ragnarok can get pretty nimble. But when it comes to more "realistic" flight performance, we don't have much to go on outside of this bit in R-Type III's ending. Assuming the camera is fixed to its original trajectory, it does appear to accelerate pretty quickly, at least.

We can also potentially compare it other R-series craft via the cinematic depictions throughout the series (and this lost-to-time minigame on Playstation Home), which perform pretty similar to how most "space fighters" do in fictional media. In other words, with their nose pointed in the general direction of flight. They do appear to have better access to the 6 degrees of freedom than, say, our contemporary VTOL aircraft do. The Ragnarok's predecessor, the R-9C "Warhead" (R-Type II) is purported to have such high performance that a normal human pilot is unable to fly it without special accommodations; the (unconfirmed and "officially denied in-universe") rumor is that pilots are surgically altered and must be integrated with the ship's systems directly in a special pod called the ANGEL PAC in order to fly the craft (this is mentioned in an artbook that came out a few months before R-Type III in Japan). The Ragnarok itself is supposedly developed from data acquired from the 2 previous Bydo missions, but it's unknown if its performance was dialed back or not. It's one of the later-gen designs in the series chronology, so it is presumably on the higher end. The craft itself rumored to be piloted (per the Japanese version manual) by a genetically modified 23 year old woman. Unfortunately, R-Type Final 2 has yet to be updated with the Fighter History for the Ragnarok, so there's not much "modern" insight available. The Fighter History entry for the Warhead does make some allusions to the craft's hostility to pilots, lending some credence to the info from that artbook.

In addition to "better than expected" mobility, the Ragnarok has pretty extensive defensive capabilities due to its largely indestructible Force unit, which can be attached to the front or rear of the ship as necessary as well as operate independently. The same Force unit also greatly expands the attack capabilities of the craft, allowing it to fire at unexpected angles and with different laser types depending on the current loadout and configuration -- the fully manmade Shadow Force, for example, is specialized in 360 degree weapons coverage and high speed deployment. These weapons can also be used defensively; the Round/Standard Force's bullet spread spews out enough bullets that it's wonderful at neutralizing entire volleys of solid projectiles like missiles.

Armament-wise, in addition to the versatile Force lasers mentioned above, the Wave Cannon mounted on R-series fighters is described as essentially having the same firepower as a "frontline battleship's main battery", and the Mega Wave Cannon mounted on the Ragnarok itself is even more excessive. Unlike most other R-craft, however, it has a secondary mode; by integrating the fighter's hyperdrive system into the wave cannon, it's able to rapid-fire the wave cannon. The strength of these individual shots is comparable to that of the original R-9's charge shot, but delivered at a rate of fire roughly equivalent to the ship's vulcan. In this mode, the Ragnarok's bits orbit the craft at high speed while sheathed in wave-motion energy, improving their defensive coverage significantly.

It's also worth noting that the Ragnarok was used to strike at the heart of the Bydo Empire single handedly, just like the two previous "Illegal Mission" fighters in R-Type 1 and 2. If Max Jenius is a prodigal Mary-Sue type, I'd argue that the unnamed pilot of the Ragnarok probably is as well.


Uh... I wrote more than I probably needed to. If it's not obvious, I like R-Type. I'm not actually particularly familiar with most Macross, but after reading about the Durandal on a fan wiki, I'm actually kind of struck by how similar to the R-Type universe the techno-babbly explanations for the ship's capabilities are. And the Vajra have some vague similarities to the Bydo as well.

Anyway, I'm voting for the R-90 (that's "R Nine Zero", not "R Ninety" for those unaware) "Ragnarok" Hyperdrive System Fighter for totally objective and unbiased reasons.

 

[Johnny Unusual]

The Foot has a certain omnicience of dropping in center frame and then the scene ends, so no amount of speeding away can really save one.

But that wouldn't be the Luggage's strategy. I think it would just open it's mouth.

 

[Kirin]

Still someone who is familiar will have to help me; is Valkrye super maneuverable (which is to say is it ever seen dodging a near literally cascade of enemy fire, with intent), withstanding strong blasts or having strong shields? I'm sure it's come under enemy fire but I need to know what is the MOST bullets it ever had to dodge at one time.

Max is specifically really really good at dodging a metric crap-load of homing missiles and lasers while returning fire with his own. He might take some grazing hits as a sacrifice for better positioning, but his unparalleled dogfighting skills would eventually land a hit on the R90 and give the match to the Durandal.

Luggage noms on toes until the foot leaves to stomp on something less painful.

Mothman flits out of the lines of fire until Bomberman eventually gets tagged by one of his own increasingly extensive explosions.

 

[Olli]

Based on what people say about Max, and my surface level knowledge of R-Type games (I have beat the first one), I'll go with the Valkyrie on the first one.

Luggage eating the Foot's toes is funnier, as it was said, so Sapient Pearwood wins.

Bomber vs Moth is a tough call. Bomberman has the obvious offensive power advantage, while Mothman is mostly known for being mysterious and elusive. Still, if Bomberman games are known for anything, it's the ease of bombing yourself by accident, so I feel like Mothman can win simply by out-lurking his opponent.

 

[Exposition Owl]

All of your analyses are more fun and creative than anything I could come up with! Thanks for writing!

 

[Mogri]

All of your analyses are more fun and creative than anything I could come up with! Thanks for writing!

+1. I really wasn't sure how this whole deal would go over, but I've been pleasantly surprised. I love reading the write-ups.

@Olli please bold your votes!

 

[WildcatJF]

Yeah, I am enjoying how people are jumping right into this, even tho I currently don't have the energy to. It's a fun idea and I hope I can write something in later rounds!

 

[Johnny Unusual]

Based on the arguments, I guess I'll vote Valkyrie then.

 

[Mogri]

Today's the last day for this bracket. Get your votes in!

 

[Mogri]

Max Jenius and the Durandal outmaneuver the Ragnarok.

The Luggage chomps the Foot.

Mothman foresees a win over Bomberman.

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G1 Powermaster Optimus Prime (Transformers)

Leader of the Autobots, capable of transforming and rolling out, Optimus Prime is more than meets the eye.

Transformers can engage in binary bonding forming symbiotic relationships with humans or Nebula's (human-like aliens with advanced technology) who have been augmented to be part of a Transformer. Powermaster Optimus has a Nebulan partner, Hi-Q, who serves as an additional power source.

Powermaster Optimus has his standard vehicle form (with trailer) and his standard weapon in his base robot form. He can transform his trailer into an assault base which has a gun mount for his rifle and a duplicate of it and it also has 2 twin particle beam cannon turrets which can be manned by Hi-Q and other binary partners or human-sized Transformers.

When powered up by Hi-Q while in vehicle mode, he can mount both rifles and those cannons on his trailer to enter Attack Mode. He can also merge with his trailer to enter into a Super robot mode that can dual wield his rifle and mount those cannons to his shoulders.

Powermaster Optimus has a 10/10 for all stats except for Firepower (9/10) and Speed (6/10).


Godzilla

Godzilla loves snacking on nuclear radiation, which might be why he's such a beefy boy. His abilities include atomic breath, which is powerful enough to drill a hole in the ground; a nuclear pulse, which is a shockwave that can launch even other kaiju into the air; telepathy with other kaiju; and some sort of ill-defined ocean sense. Additionally, Godzilla is incredibly strong and durable. He seems to have better-than-animal-but-still-subhuman intelligence, and he's not particularly agile. He has an overwhelming size advantage in this fight, weighing in at somewhere between 200 and 400 feet in height depending on the movie.

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Haruhi Suzumiya (The Melancholy of Haruhi Suzumiya)

A 15-year-old Japanese schoolgirl. Also possibly a god of some sort. Not actually melancholy at all. Haruhi can reshape reality to fit her whims, although she is not totally aware nor in control of these abilities. She is rumored to have destroyed and then re-created the universe.


Samus Aran (Metroid)

Even though she's a bounty hunter by profession, Samus spends an alarming amount of her time genociding various dangerous species. (This is very probably because Nintendo didn't know what a bounty hunter is; they picked it because they thought it sounded cool.) She was raised and genetically altered by the birdlike Chozo, enabling her to do stuff like jump eight feet in the air. Samus is equipped with a Power Suit that can fire energy blasts and missiles. It can also transform into a ball (don't think too hard about what this does to poor Samus) and lay bombs. The suit's exact powers vary from game to game, but it invariably allows Samus to retain her natural agility.

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The monster at the end of the book (There's a Monster at the End of This Book)

Who or what is the monster at the end of the book? We don't know, and sometimes, not knowing is the scariest thing of all.


Missile (Ghost Trick)

Pomeranian. A boy so good that his goodness transcends time, space, life, and death.


Votes due by end of day Sunday, September 3.

 

[Daikaiju]

Oh hell. These are some tough choices.

 

[Torzelbaum]

I hate to be that guy but who/what I actually nominated was G1 Powermaster Optimus Prime.

 

[Mogri]

Unfortunately, not only are you now that guy, but you must also explain the difference, because I sure don't know it.

 

[Torzelbaum]

Transformers can engage in binary bonding forming symbiotic relationships with humans or Nebulas (human-like aliens with advanced technology) who have been augmented to be part of a Transformer. Powermaster Optimus has a Nebulan partner, Hi-Q, who serves as an additional power source.

PM OP has his standard vehicle form (with trailer) and his standard weapon in his base robot form. He can transform his trailer into an assault base which has a gun mount for his rifle and a duplicate of it and it also has 2 twin particle beam cannon turrets which can be manned by Hi-Q and other binary partners or human-sized Transformers.

When powered up by Hi-Q while in vehicle mode he can mount both rifles and those cannons on his trailer to enter Attack Mode. He can also merge with his trailer to enter into a Super robot mode that can dual wield his rifle and mount those cannons to his shoulders.

Powermaster Optimus has a 10/10 for all stats except for Firepower (9/10) and Speed (6/10).

 

[Purple]

These are all pretty easy calls, but tragic.

There's a lot of characters I could see pulling off some kind of plucky underdog David and Goliath victory against Godzilla, but Optimus Prime has never been a tactician. He kinda just relies on being big and tough and having straightforward fights, needed the aid of dinosaurs to fight a larger opponent, and died trying to get a dumb kid clear of an area. All of these make an easy win for Godzilla.

Haruhi's whole deal is weird and all, but only dangerous to people who don't want to live in a world she wants to live in. I don't see how this would be any threat to Samus, who I could see being brought in to deal with a threat like that. And like... Samus has missiles and stuff?

I kinda can't favor (spoiler for those who haven't read the book) Grover in any matchup not involving that one blue guy. He's just kind of naturally wimpy and easily flummoxed. Meanwhile I know basically nothing about Ghost Trick (even what's up with the new release that'd let me fix that, is it on the Switch?) but... yeah, gotta give this one to a tiny dog on principle. They know no fear.[/ispoiler][/ispoiler]

 

[WildcatJF]

Yes Ghost Trick's on the Switch and an excellent port.

I'll try to write up something related to this thread later lol

 

[Johnny Unusual]

It's been a looooong time since I watched the first Haruhi. I remember she's God mode but secret to herself and knowing this is bad news for creation. Aaaand she's sort of created occult/paranormal she loves but I believe there are consequences if she learns about actual paranormal. Soo... if a lady in armor pops in, what would that have. If it turns out none, here's how I think this shakes out. If Samus knows Haruhi's deal, I think she would know not to kill her and... like, just push her over. In plain clothes. If she doesn't, then she's not going to blow up a rando kid, she's probably going to just incapacitate her. So it all comes down to if Haruhi sees a robot lady and reacts by destroying the world (again, it's been a long time since I've seen this one.)

Tiny dog. Basically The dog will jump on Grover and incapacitate him with doggy kisses. The dog wins dominance but really both win in every other capacity)

I'm largely familiar with Gen 1 Transformers. If this was an entire Autobot team, this would be a much closer battle but I feel like while Optimus would hold his own admirably, Godzilla is just THAT much more powerful, not just in size but in ATOMIC BREATHE!!!

 

[Torzelbaum]

Optimus is strong (but is his blood radioactive?), an inspirational leader, an excellent orator and his Powermaster super robot mode has an incredible amount of firepower. But none of that matters because Godzilla has faced entire militaries worth of firepower that did nothing more than slightly annoy and inconvenience him. Godzilla wins. I think the best that Optimus can do in this case is to evacuate people out of the danger zone.

I have no idea how to decide for Haruhi versus Samus.

The monster at the end of the book is inexorable and inevitable. There is no way to avoid it if you want to finish the book. Missile is a very good boy but is not able to read so he is immune to the power of the book and the monster.

Now if somebody happened to read the book and summoned the monster then I still think it wouldn't matter because the monster is just Grover. And I don't think that monster could resist petting and playing with a good boy like Missile. So what I think will happen in that case is that monster will end up on his back with Missile on top licking the monster's face. Either the monster will cry uncle or his shoulders will remain down long enough for the referee to just shrug and declare Missile the winner. The monster will be sad but Missile will try to cheer him up after the ref has shooed both of them back into the locker room / waiting area.

So in conclusion Missile is a very good boy who transcends to the next round.

Optimus Prime has never been a tactician

None of the Transformers seemed to be good or even consistent strategists/tacticians. Must have been why the Autobot and Decepticon war raged on for so long. (Well, the million year long nap they took probably didn't help with that either.)

 

[Daikaiju]

It's been a looooong time since I watched the first Haruhi. I remember she's God mode but secret to herself and knowing this is bad news for creation. Aaaand she's sort of created occult/paranormal she loves but I believe there are consequences if she learns about actual paranormal. Soo... if a lady in armor pops in, what would that have. If it turns out none, here's how I think this shakes out. If Samus knows Haruhi's deal, I think she would know not to kill her and... like, just push her over. In plain clothes. If she doesn't, then she's not going to blow up a rando kid, she's probably going to just incapacitate her. So it all comes down to if Haruhi sees a robot lady and reacts by destroying the world (again, it's been a long time since I've seen this one.)

Tiny dog. Basically The dog will jump on Grover and incapacitate him with doggy kisses. The dog wins dominance but really both win in every other capacity)

I'm largely familiar with Gen 1 Transformers. If this was an entire Autobot team, this would be a much closer battle but I feel like while Optimus would hold his own admirably, Godzilla is just THAT much more powerful, not just in size but in ATOMIC BREATHE!!!

Yeah, I think you have the right of it here. I 2nd Johnny's take.

 

[Olli]

Optimus Prime's never been about being the biggest or toughest warrior, he's a hero at heart and thus vulnerable and self-sacrificing. Godzilla wins (but probably decides to save humanity thanks to Optimus's sacrifice)

I haven't read Haruhi but reality-altering god power sounds stronger than a space cyborg bounty hunter.

Missile will win with his bravery and heart over the scary but not very dangerous monster.

 

[Regulus]

For the first match, I'm going to have to with Godzilla - the difference in scale is hard to ignore here.

For the second... I nominated both of these, lmao. To be honest, my knowledge of the extent of Haruhi's powers is actually pretty limited, having only seen the first season of the anime adaptation and a decade ago at that. The only thing I think Samus could potentially do is end Haruhi before the schoolgirl is even aware of what's going on. But the question of whether or not Haruhi can even be killed is kind of up in the air for me. And on top of that, Samus doesn't seem like the type that would resort to that against a target that seems helpless. I'm going to give it to Haruhi. Samus ends up in a reconfigured universe where she's Haruhi's homeroom teacher who is secretly also an intergalactic bounty hunter.

 

[YangusKhan]

 Godzilla wins because like... of course he does. Optimus Prime just on his own a) wouldn't have the firepower to defeat Godzilla, and b) wouldn't want to defeat Godzilla in the first place. It would probably be a stalemate tbh because Godzilla wouldn't see Optimus as a threat I don't think.

Haruhi wins by default. Samus wouldn't really know what to do with her. Even if Haruhi was the bounty Samus was hunting, we already know she's capable of empathy for a baby Metroid, so she doesn't stand a chance against a high school student.

Uhhhh the third idk really so let's go with  Missile.

 

[RT-55J]

hmm...

...looks like Haruhi's powers are unmatched

 

[WildcatJF]

These are all pretty easy calls, but tragic.

There's a lot of characters I could see pulling off some kind of plucky underdog David and Goliath victory against Godzilla, but Optimus Prime has never been a tactician. He kinda just relies on being big and tough and having straightforward fights, needed the aid of dinosaurs to fight a larger opponent, and died trying to get a dumb kid clear of an area. All of these make an easy win for Godzilla.

Haruhi's whole deal is weird and all, but only dangerous to people who don't want to live in a world she wants to live in. I don't see how this would be any threat to Samus, who I could see being brought in to deal with a threat like that. And like... Samus has missiles and stuff?

I kinda can't favor (spoiler for those who haven't read the book) Grover in any matchup not involving that one blue guy. He's just kind of naturally wimpy and easily flummoxed. Meanwhile I know basically nothing about Ghost Trick (even what's up with the new release that'd let me fix that, is it on the Switch?) but... yeah, gotta give this one to a tiny dog on principle. They know no fear.

I agree with all this and can not write it any better, haha. Altho I have played Ghost Trick, and believe in the power of the Pomeranian.

 

[Mogri]

hmm...



...looks like Haruhi's powers are unmatched

They said it was a content policy violation, or some garbage like that

 

[RT-55J]

That's what Haruhi wants us to think.

 

[Mogri]

Godzilla and Missile take undisputed wins. Meanwhile, it would seem that Haruhi has willed her opponent out of existence.

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Wolverine (X-Men)

Omega-level mutant. Wolverine is best-known for his adamantium claws, but his skeleton is also coated in adamantium, and his actual mutant power is his healing factor. He also has a superhuman smell for no good reason.


Darth Vader (Star Wars)

Dark Lord of the Sith. Darth Vader has a lightsaber, whose effectiveness varies widely between adaptations, and is a powerful user of the Force, whose effectiveness varies widely between adaptations.

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Sherlock Holmes

A peerless detective as well as a competent pugilist. Holmes tends to avoid direct confrontation but can hold his own in a brawl as well.


Egg Shen (Big Trouble in Little China)

Tour bus driver of Egg Foo Young Tours and practitioner of Chinese Black magic. I don't know very much about this character!

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Ash (Evil Dead)

A zombie hunter who had his hand severed by a chainsaw. He went on to replace his hand with the chainsaw. He is also quite fond of his shotgun.


Link (Tears of the Kingdom)

A Hylian knight who had his arm severed by evil magic. He went on to have his arm forcibly replaced by, uh, different magic? IDK, I haven't played much of this game. I know his magic arm lets him build tanks and rockets and stuff, though.


Votes due by end of day Thursday, September 7.

 

[Torzelbaum]

Wolverine's

claws are famous and iconic, and he does have mid-tier Super-Strength and Super-Reflexes to back them up

all of [his] senses are superhumanly keen

Because of his Adamantium laced skeleton Wolverine weighs like a hundred pounds more than the average man. I think that would make Vader's force push/pull less effective but would not completely stop it.

With their enhanced senses I think it would be hard for either combatant to sneak up on the other one and that really isn't the usual/go-to strategy for either of them.

If Vader didn't have Force powers the battle would be somewhat more in Logan's favor but I think removing those is too much of a handicap.

I think Vader could play keep away long enough to put his opponent down but not out and he might have to sacrifice his robotic left forearm to a claw swipe in order to slip in a knockout blow (probably in Logan's abdomen or up under his ribs). Hokey religions and ancient weapons are a match for adamantium claws so Vader wins.

Here's a video showing what Egg Shen can do. All that being said I don't think Egg would use his magic (or a handgun) against Sherlock and Sherlock wouldn't start Baritsuing Egg. Instead I think they would both sit down with a nice cup of tea and engage in a battle of wits playing chess or something and maybe some gambling. I think Egg could get the upper hand early with a little bit of non-magical cheating but Sherlock would figure it out and ultimately prevail. But at the end they would both go out, enjoy an alcoholic drink together, wish each other well in the Thunderdome and talk about meeting up again in the future.

Ash versus TotK Link is another matchup that feels so dependent on exact equipment load outs. I am assuming that Link doesn't have any health potions and has roughly equivalent health to Ash. Ash can take quite a beating and can do a lot of damage but the same is true of a well-equipped Link. Link is used to fighting a wide variety of enemies while Ash only fights demons and Deadites. I think Link could figure out Ash's "patterns" and use his different weapons and tools to take down Ash (but Link will take some damage in the process). The victory fanfare plays for Link.

 

[Johnny Unusual]

I don't know if a light saber can cut adamantium. I know there are energy fields that can stop it like vibro shields or something but is there a sufficiently dense metal that cause a challenge? Well, that will only tell me how quick this is. In terms of Earthly strength, Vader and Wolverine are on equal terms but Vader has the force, which can be comparable to telekinesis and that's pretty hard for Wolverine to counter. Vader can hold him in place in one hand and cut him down with the other. Now Wolverine can use this to his advantage, because his healing can allow him to take Vader by surprise but I feel like Vader might just fuck him up a little too much to work. And if sabers can cut adamantium, all the worse.

Slight edge to Vader

Here's a video showing what Egg Shen can do. All that being said I don't think Egg would use his magic (or a handgun) against Sherlock and Sherlock wouldn't start Baritsuing Egg. Instead I think they would both sit down with a nice cup of tea and engage in a battle of wits playing chess or something and maybe some gambling. I think Egg could get the upper hand early with a little bit of non-magical cheating but Sherlock would figure it out and ultimately prevail. But at the end they would both go out, enjoy an alcoholic drink together, wish each other well in the Thunderdome and talk about meeting up again in the future.

I was going to give this to Egg simply because Sherlock is just... not ready for magic. But then I remembered Ruse, a comic by Mark Waid with a Holmes-type protagonist. In it, magic exists but he's unaware and his sidekick works to keep him in the dark. But despite this, he still uses his wits to defeat magic uses, despite not fulling getting it. I think this all depends if this is an impromptu meeting or not. If not... a lot of Egg's magic are dependent on resources and I think if Sherlock figures that out, he might go out of his way to find a way to make the majority of his resources unavailable to him. But I agree with Torzel, whatever happens, I don't think it will actually come to blows.

Slight edge to Sherlock (unless he has no... ugh... prep time).

Love Ash but Link has the advantage of fighting more and varied monsters and threats, a larger armory and variety of weapons and doesn't he get this thing that makes him make other things? Making prostectic gauntlets is actually REALLY IMPRESSIVE for Ash but this is several notches above that.

 

[Purple]

My understanding is that Wolverine's approach to combat involves a lot of wrecklessly flinging himself forward and hacking away at his opponent, and the big famous time he was defeated effectively revolved around him telekinesing him around basically. Meanwhile Darth Vader's kind of all about dealing with people trying exactly that, being really good with telekinesis, having the supernatural ability to always know when someone's coming for him, and also like, having a planet destroying deathray. So, gotta give this one to Darth Vader.

Next, gotta go with Egg Shen on the principle that actual wuxia stuff is inherently superior to made up British kung-fu.

Meanwhile this is a weirdly even match-up between Ash and Link, because I mean they both even have experience bashing together ridiculous vehicular contraptions that probably don't survive testing, but Ash has one very important edge over Link- A profound ability to get anyone around him trying to act properly heroic killed through comedic blunder or irony! Also Link tends to freeze up in the presence of weird zombie types whereas Ash eventually wised up into preemptively attacking jump scare sources. That's not nothing.