• Welcome to Talking Time's third iteration! If you would like to register for an account, or have already registered but have not yet been confirmed, please read the following:

    1. The CAPTCHA key's answer is "Percy"
    2. Once you've completed the registration process please email us from the email you used for registration at percyreghelper@gmail.com and include the username you used for registration

    Once you have completed these steps, Moderation Staff will be able to get your account approved.

  • TT staff acknowledge that there is a backlog of new accounts that await confirmation.

    Unfortunately, we are putting new registrations on hold for a short time.

    We do not expect this delay to extend beyond the first of November 2020, and we ask you for your patience in this matter.

    ~TT Moderation Staff

Bongo

excused from moderation duty
(he/him)
Staff member
But the door-lock that really irks me is Grapple. It already had blocks to manipulate, but not only do you have to stop your movement to unlock a grapple door, these doors and only these doors don't revert to a normal beam door once opened. When they close, they revert to a grapple lock, which is just a baffling decision. Of all the door locks to be inconsistent with, they pick the most annoying one.
Those are there to make it impossible to build up a shinespark charge through the doorway.
 

SpoonyBard

A Bard Named SPOONY
(He/Him)
There's only like one puzzle that does that though. They could have just let those doors stay open and obstruct that one shinespark some other way.
 

Becksworth

Aging Hipster Dragon Dad
Okay, finally beat it. I'd probably rank this as my 2nd favorite Metroid. Super still probably beats this one out in terms of replayability, because hoo boy this one gets hard.
 

RT-55J

definitely not a robot
(He/Him)
I mopped up my savefile and beat the last boss again with 100%. I gotta say, now that I know the patterns, the fight isn't that hard.

I'm replaying this on hard mode, and I found it interesting that the opening cutscene shows how to dodge some of his attacks. Also, I died to the first boss several times like a chump. (Can't wait to eat crow later when the final boss wrecks me.)

Also, I'm replaying it in Spanish and I would just like to note that the line in the intro about the EMMIs being made of "the strongest stuff in the universe" uses the word "material" instead (lol).
 

sfried

Fluffy Prince
I love the Shine Spark puzzles in this game. They are way more manageable, and at least they aren't as irritating as some of Zero Missions toughest ones which require you to remember to "Spark & Charge" several times using 5 slopes across 2 rooms. The cool down period for the charge being more lenient helps as well.

Easily tops Zero Mission for me. (And don't get me wrong, I love Zero Mission!)

  • Dread is the most linear the series has ever been. Side paths basically don't exist, and backtracking with your new toys is normally impossible: paths are typically designed to be one-way— you'll flip a switch to open a door, at the expense of closing the one you came through— and if not, the game will hurriedly throw up new barriers to stop any unwanted exploration (a flaming tree will spontaneously sprout; a small tunnel will collapse). For much of the game, you never have more than, like, three rooms available to visit. I don't think that being linear is an inherent flaw— I am on record on here (well, 2.0) as a fan and defender of Fusion, after all— but it sticks in my craw here because Dread doesn't frame itself as some sort of push-forward gauntlet, but a grand adventure. And yet the player never has any option than to move from one locked door to the next.

  • Samus is more Badass than ever, and I hate it. She's just the Doomguy now. Sure Other M was a mistake, but the idea she should be an unstoppable force of destruction is just as big a misread to me, just from the other direction.
  • ...But it doesn't actually follow up on Fusion in a meaningful way. Fusion told us that the Federation was running a Metroid cloning program, and that maybe they aren't the squeaky-clean good guys after all. But here Samus is working for them again with no qualm. It's not even the Federation that's after Samus' metroid DNA here! Not even the effects of being part metroid are explored here, since Samus' metroid DNA doesn't actually mutate her or give her any "metroid abilities" until the very end of the game— and only in cutscenes and setpieces. "Samus now gets powerful plot abilities" isn't anything.
I will have to disagree with you here.

Dread does this philosophy of nudging or funneling the player in the intended direction but I wouldn't say it completely takes away the opportunity to find side paths: Already there are tons of skips and sequence breaks being discovered and the methods of trying to obtain them are not something that's made readily apparent, such as the method to get early Grapple Beam, Gravity Suit, and Morph Ball bombs. Super had the benefit of years of experience players breaking the game open and we've only begun trying to crack Dread in many ways as possible, but already we could see signs that the developers tried to take this into account as well, even if they may not be intentional.

I always found myself wanting to go back to previous sectors and wondering if I was intended to proceed here to begin with given the item upgrades I acquire, but I generally think Dread manages to really keep everything at a good pace regardless of what stage of item completion you're in.

Also hard disagree with the second point: Samus becoming an unstoppable force of destruction but coming at a cost of her losing control is the "Metroid Dread": She has now become her own worst enemy and it takes Quiet Robe and his additional Thoha DNA for Samus to be able to contain her Metroid side as she function as a regular person without draining anything she touches of its energy. The lead up to the theme isn't uncalled for, either.

Which leads me to your third point: If Metroid Fusion was Samus facing herself in a physical sense, then Metroid Dread is about Samus facing her own internal struggle with becoming The "Metroid" (i.e. "Ultimate Warrior"), and not because of the DNA in her too, as Raven Beak suggests; rather despite the fact that she has it, she didn't need to use it when overcoming the EMMI (and only discovered she could duringthe last one). Also I kinda find it neat that having a clone army of Samuses would perhaps be the best way to take over the galaxy instead of just scattering energy-sucking jellyfish around.

Edit: GDQ is going to get a whole lot more interesting when they start doing speedruns of Dread:
 
Last edited:

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
No chance there's not a Dread run in the January GDQ, right?
 

SpoonyBard

A Bard Named SPOONY
(He/Him)
People have already got down to under 2 hours, wouldn't be surprised to see it get close to or even lower than 90 minutes.

Think a GDQ showing is a given.
 

Sarcasmorator

Same as I ever was
(He/him)
How do you reliably Shinespark sideways? I always end up either rocketing upward or nothing at all, except for once or twice.
 

Sarge

hardcore retro gamin'
I mopped up my savefile and beat the last boss again with 100%. I gotta say, now that I know the patterns, the fight isn't that hard.
I agree with this. Some of the discussion had me terrified, but after taking several deaths learning the patterns, it's all very doable. Power Bombs are really useful for the couple of energy orb attacks, for instance (unless there's an even easier way), and the counters are pretty scripted so the first phases fly by once you get them down.

Final time was 9h12m14s. 63% items. Fantastic, fantastic game. Not sure this displaces Super Metroid, but dang if it doesn't try.
 

Phantoon

I cuss you bad
I'm slowly playing this when I get free time and it's excellent fun. I bounced off Samus Returns but this doesn't have the same problems thank goodness
 

sfried

Fluffy Prince
How do you reliably Shinespark sideways? I always end up either rocketing upward or nothing at all, except for once or twice.
Press B without any directional input when you have a charge. A "windup/spinup" animation will start and during that brief period, input the direction you want to Shinespark to.

To Shinespark consistently while falling, apparently you have to press Y + B, but I've never had an issue pulling it off midair by just pressin B provided you have enough airtime. I guess pressin Y cancels out your direction to allow you to be in "neutral" when you press B to Spark.
 

Lokii

It's always time for burgers
(He/Him)
Staff member
Moderator
Too much of an old man for gamertown, too much a gamer for oldsburg
 

Sarge

hardcore retro gamin'
Yeah, that's how I've been triggering it. Hit down to store charge, roll into ball, and trigger. There was one in the last area that needed some blocks bombed out first before sparking, and then I just triggered spark from ball form.
 

Falselogic

Techno-Threadcromancer
(they/them)
10:25 clear time w/ 84%

I went back through every zone after getting to the last boss and picked stuff up I probably could have come in under 9 hours on my first play through otherwise.

Really happy with this one. I really bounced off of the Metroid 2 remake and so was worried this wasn't going to be it, but it really was!

After the clear screen what splash screen did you get? I got Zero Mission. I'm wondering if they change based on clear time or something else?
 

SpoonyBard

A Bard Named SPOONY
(He/Him)
The gallery and ending unlocks seem to be as follows: The eight gallery images are all unlocked as you 100% the items in each zone, and you get a bonus ninth image once you get all of them. The ending images are broken up between Normal and Hard. Beating Normal gets you the first image (Zero Mission), Normal under 8 hours gets you the second, Normal under 4 the third, beating Hard gets the fourth, Hard under 8 hours the fifth, and Hard under 4 hours the sixth, and getting all ending images unlocks a bonus image.
 

Juno

The DRKest Roe
(He, Him)
Got 100% and beat the game. It's really great! Probably my favorite 2D Metroid.
 

chady

(He/him/his)
It feels like I'm about halfway through the game ... maybe a little less. I just encountered Quiet Robe, and defeated the robot Chozo afterwards.

I'm a little conflicted on the game itself. The controls are exceptional, combat feels good, the abilities I've acquired all feel great to use, with one or two small exceptions (aiming the grapple just after aiming and charging the omega beam made my hands feel like lobster claws). Early on the game feels pretty hand-holdy, in that it gives the appearance of letting go of the control of where to go without actually doing it ... I defeated the first two EMMI, and I wanted to go back and explore those areas a bit more to look for powerups but it wouldn't let me do that, until I did something else first. You know how in Super Metroid, sequence breaks aside, all of the original areas you go through are accessible until you get past that one way gate in Brinstar? This game sends you through one-way gates constantly, especially in the beginning. It's like the game doesn't trust the player to find the way forward, so it blocks off a lot of the previous avenues.

I surprised myself, because I was able to sequence break some things (and get the quick kill on Kraid) which was cool to do. But I was only able to do that this first playthrough because I heard it was possible, so I spent an extra few hours intentionally avoiding the direction I thought the game was leading me and tried to break some things. And it's neat they allow you to do that! But there's still something about the exploration for me that isn't really hitting as much as I would like it to. For example, I was also able to get a pickup early, and it said I wasn't allowed to use it yet, which was kind of a bummer. I think a lot of it comes back to they keep trying to add story into these games. Which isn't a bad impulse, necessarily, but I think for Metroid it's not great. Super Metroid is a masterpiece of understated storytelling, but aside from the very beginning and the very end there's no plot that isn't gameplay.

And then there's the EMMI, which, I get it. They're trying to spice it up a bit. But those sections add nothing for me. I don't play them as much as I suffer through them. Sometimes I'll do the exact thing I did before, but EMMI will go the other way. Sometimes I'll drop down a few screens and EMMI will just be there and then I'm dead. And while the longer I play, the more they lose their teeth, I also find myself wondering why there's so much of that stealth element in the game.

I'm enjoying myself though. It's as least as good as Fusion, and probably better, though we'll see how the difficulty spikes in the second half. I very much enjoyed the very first boss fight, with the cloaking scorpion thing, and figuring out I could shoot missiles at it during the counter cutscene was very fun. I hope there's more stuff like that.
 

Phantoon

I cuss you bad
You know how in Super Metroid, sequence breaks aside, all of the original areas you go through are accessible until you get past that one way gate in Brinstar? This game sends you through one-way gates constantly, especially in the beginning. It's like the game doesn't trust the player to find the way forward, so it blocks off a lot of the previous avenues.
Yeah, I noticed this but I think there's a legitimate reason - the map is vastly bigger than Super and I think if they gave people carte blanche to wander about at will they'd get horribly lost.

As an experienced Metroid head it was pretty irritating, but I imagine the scope for going wildly off the plot is huge. Also as the map is bigger the proportion of new places power ups unlock is smaller so it saves old bits for when you'll have more stuff to do.
 

gogglebob

The Goggles Do Nothing
(he/him)
Hi,

I'm the guy who, at the tender age of 12, did not understand I had to power bomb that one glass tube in Super Metroid, and subsequently spent (without exaggeration) eight hours bumping around the whole of accessible Zebes, looking for where I was supposed to go next. If some cave-in, fire plant, or x-parasite cocoon (a favorite of Fusion) had limited my traversal to a more focused area, I may have puzzled out that solution before (begging my grandma into) ordering the official Nintendo Power strategy guide. Bring on the blocked areas. Cut off all exits. I am a dummy. Please help me, inability to backtrack.

(Though I still think there should just be one x-ray viewable power bomb block around the Super Metroid tube. I would have tried to break that.)
 

karzac

(he/him)
I've been playing this! It's really good! Just got the morph ball, and man, feel like the game was trolling me with how long it took to get it. Every upgrade it was like oh boy, here's the morph ball - then nope! Now all is right in the galaxy.

I was finding the EMMI segments equal parts annoying and irritating, but now that I've got a better sense of the counter timing, I think I'll find them more fun.

Also, I'm like gogglebob - bring on the blocked off areas. I've already gotten stuck a couple times, and wouldn't have been able to progress if more areas had been open to me.
 

Becksworth

Aging Hipster Dragon Dad
The Super Metroid glass tube in retrospect is a serious design issue I'm willing to admit. I knew what to do there as a kid because every game magazine on shelves went out of their way to provide a tip for it when it initially released. I think those of us who grew up with the game just assume it's common knowledge.
 

Regulus

Sir Knightbot
At most I would provide a few more hints (maybe a few cracks in the glass or a leak?), but I think the tube is fine. There's another broken tube nearby which provides a clue. It was enough that I was able to figure it out on my own back in the day.

I think the save points in the Etecoon pit and Tourian are more serious design flaws.
 

Peklo

Oh! Create!
(they/them, she/her)
An article on MercurySteam's working conditions, worth reading even if you have to machine-translate from Spanish. It's not remotely good, and sounds like nothing has changed since the Castlevania days, where the workers continue to pay the price for upper management's decisions. I doubt it will change too, with Álvarez and others as firmly entrenched as the company heads as they are. The only difference from before is now they have the Nintendo PR machine backing them, and a more critically and popularly acclaimed game to shield from scrutiny in the discourse.

One thing that jumps out is that the game was apparently planned to have twice the bosses and cinematics than ended up shipping. It seems preposterous, as the game is severely overstuffed with boss encounters as it is, but it really underlines the kind of game they were fundamentally making here, where that aspect is the centerpiece of all relevant design: big setpieces, big action focus, a Samus toolset where the mobility functions are tuned for combat over exploration purposes. It really just felt like a Treasure-style boss rush game to me; a diluted Alien Soldier with a belaboured hub world that never began to justify its existence as a setting. It also might retroactively illustrate how they approached Samus Returns, where the original game's structure was reoriented around the "fifty bosses! Wow!!" premise, taken literally to its extreme ends.
 
Top