• Welcome to Talking Time's third iteration! If you would like to register for an account, or have already registered but have not yet been confirmed, please read the following:

    1. The CAPTCHA key's answer is "Percy"
    2. Once you've completed the registration process please email us from the email you used for registration at percyreghelper@gmail.com and include the username you used for registration

    Once you have completed these steps, Moderation Staff will be able to get your account approved.

I'm playing through all of Final Fantasy, and everyone is invited (Playing Lightning Returns now)

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
The classic "crystal colors" are probably intentional as far as the Huge Materia goes, at least. You get Bahamut ZERO rather than a "Master Support" from blue, so I imagine it was a conscious decision.
Bahamut-ZERO was the only thing I got from those. haha. I got the one summon, and just assumed that was all they were for. Well, i'll take the accidental insight about crystal colors at least.

I'm sure I'm missing a ton of stuff in FF8 too. There's no gaps in my GF lineup, but there's a bunch of empty spots past Alex and I've pretty much stuck to the story, so there's got to be side stuff I've missed.
 

RT-55J

space hero for hire
(He/Him + RT/artee)
I mean, yeah, but technically you never kill the dude. You just forcibly advance his lifecycle to the metamorphosis egg stage, and presumably sometime after the end of the game he finishes transforming into a Moomba (or perhaps something else?).

Now, whether or not Moombas are free of sin is another question entirely.
 
despite the rather hackneyed writing in multiple spots
I'd be interested in an audit of FF8's original script versus the translation we got here in NA, and if that has anything to do with the perception of "hackneyed writing". The translations of Squaresoft games from that era was not the greatest, were often riddled with errors, and took far too many liberties with their 'localization' for my comfort. For FF8 specifically, I know that there was a lot of texture within just Squall himself that got lost in translation. There were dozens of instances where he would say/react/emote in some manner that all got reduced to a simple "Whatever" each time.

For my decades old memory of the game, I always thought that game's narrative was pretty inherently interesting and well written. A lesser game would have hit the player over the head with the revelation that Laguna was Squall's father, and yet FF8 had the restraint and narrative complexity to let the player come to that epiphany themselves without ever outright stating it to the player.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
FF8 complete and i've read the thread.
This is another game I thought I would not like, but ended up really enjoying.
The mechanics were confusing at first. I just don't love that cards refine into items that refine into spells that junction to stats. The multiple steps result in me forgetting what cards are desirable and what items are useful for different things. I think my junctions were probably suboptimal, but nothing but the final boss was in any way challenging, so good enough was good enough.

The final boss battle took me two tries. Definitely harder boss than the last few entries. FF4 was the last time I had to try more than once to beat the final boss. However, I engaged with any side content the least of all in FF8, so I may have been missing some tools for FF8 as compared to previous entries.

The story was confusing, but thanks to reading this thread and watching some videos of some scenes, i picked up on things i had missed. The Laguna scenes set up a lot and I didn't put the puzzle together and had to go back and review those via an LP to realize how Laguna kept stumbling into all these critical moments in the backstory. Our characters save the world, but a lot of the action is driven by the personal connections between the characters, so I'm okay that I was a little confused about the world history and lore at times. Its not like the info was not there, i just didn't take the opportunity to explore enough to find it.

I thought the writing for the characters was really good. I think FF8 did credit to the ensemble by keeping most of the focus on the main story and the primary couple and not having little scenarios for every character. Everyone gets a chance to shine and or lead the team for a moment, but it all feels more connected to the main scenario. I feel like this cast works together better than FF7 or FF6. I would agree with Felix that Irvine is probably my least favorite. I also agree that the final dungeon was the best final dungeon so far, other than i wish the party switching mechanic worked like in FF6 where each team was on a different path and had to fight some of the bosses. I really liked Seifer and Laguna as the foils to Squall. I'm glad Seifer got to go fishing with his friends in the ending and I liked that they did not have him turn back to the good guys side at the end like say Golbez in a turn that feels too sudden or cliche.

I was pretty disconnected from gaming it the late 90s. I didn't have a playstation. I knew of FF7 because i had a friend who was obsessed with it, but I didn't know anybody who talked about FF8 or FF9. Graphically, FF8 is such a leap forward in the series and feels modern. There's moments of old tech accidental humor like Rinoa calling Squall's pixelated form the best looking guy at the dance. Despite those kinds of things, I think FF8 (especially the remaster) can sit comfortably next to FF10/12/13 in terms of presentation.
 
I thought the writing for the characters was really good. I think FF8 did credit to the ensemble by keeping most of the focus on the main story and the primary couple and not having little scenarios for every character. Everyone gets a chance to shine and or lead the team for a moment, but it all feels more connected to the main scenario. I feel like this cast works together better than FF7 or FF6.
I think this, combined with the world building, is why FF8 has been consistently 1A or 1B of my favorite Final Fantasies historically, next to 10. (And why in recent times, I favor 15 and 7R so much more than a lot of people.) The whole cast is very likable and they do a great job characterizing them and getting them to interact meaningfully with each other, the plot, and their environment. I think FFX does a better job objectively, simply because they had more time and budget and technical horsepower to make all of those things easier, but FF8 hit me perfectly right in the middle of my adolescent years to really leave a big impact. I've also got romance-appreciative tendencies, so this game - coming on the heels of FF7 specifically - just felt kinda healing and warm/fuzzy to play.
 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
FF VIII has some extremely obscure side-content. I don't remember the details, but there is an LP on the LP Archive that does them all. In case it's not the one you consulted.

Did you miss Diablos, and the ability to stop random encounters? Generelly, did you level up normally? If you stay low level, the game is super easy, including the final boss (even though Ultimecia deserves to be the epic, hard boss battle she got).

The world and lore are just not the main focus of this game, and opt more as a scene for the characters to act out their stuff, I think. Which is a strong contrast to FF VII, where the world is an actual character. Not that VIII doesn't have any of that, but I feel like it's way less pronounced here.
 
The world and lore are just not the main focus of this game, and opt more as a scene for the characters to act out their stuff, I think. Which is a strong contrast to FF VII, where the world is an actual character. Not that VIII doesn't have any of that, but I feel like it's way less pronounced here.
FF8's world doesn't have literal agency/isn't a character in the same way as Gaia, sure. But I think it has a lot of character and there's tons of lore scattered all over the place that gives the whole setting a lot of personality. Be it the cinematic set-pieces that are still peerless in the franchise, (FF has still yet to top the Battle of the Gardens IMO) to the way each school has its own personality/vibe (to me - comparing it to my own life experiences - it's like the differences between University of California campuses) to the politicking between nations, to the little things like how magazines are the source of information/abilities for the characters. It's a world that feels lived in and connected versus a lot of games and many FFs where the setting can feel like a bunch of independent Mario zones vaguely connected by a world map or hallways.
 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
Yes, I agree. I just think that the focus is not on the planet, the same way as in VII. It's essentially background, while the world is a character in VII.

Read my posts from when I played the game. I think I got a lot of details out of what we got. But it's just less of a focus here. That's all I'm saying.

I want to write more, but can't really make it sensible, so I'll leave it. Just saying, I'm not saying the world building in VIII is bad or weak.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
FF VIII has some extremely obscure side-content. I don't remember the details, but there is an LP on the LP Archive that does them all. In case it's not the one you consulted.

Did you miss Diablos, and the ability to stop random encounters? Generelly, did you level up normally? If you stay low level, the game is super easy, including the final boss (even though Ultimecia deserves to be the epic, hard boss battle she got).
I did get Diablos right after Cid gave me the item. I did what they told me and saved my game and then tried it. Took me 2 tries to beat him just because I didn't know what to expect the first time. Squall ended up I think level 34. I remember i went into to Ultimicia's castle at 29 and I fought quite a few battles in the castle from all the running around. I only used Enc-None when exploring to get the layout of a dungeon, then i would turn it off again. I had all the GFs up to Alexander, but none after that.

In this particular game, i was really enjoying the main story and cast and the game was always pointing me the way to the next event and I never felt like I needed to stop and go do something to get more powerful. I did the Triple Triad Club thing where you play the different ranks of players. I never went to Shumi village or any of the Chocobo forrests. I saw a UFO once, but had no idea there was anything to that. I didn't pick up on any hints about a deep sea research station, so i missed that too. I talked to the Queen of Cards only one or two times.
The main side thing I did was Triple Triad. I got the Quistis, Seifer and Zell cards along with Ifrit and Diablos pretty early. I challenged most people i met. I eventually also got the Selphie and Edea cards along with both of the brothers and Quetzalcoatl and Cerberus. Beating Edea was the only time i had to save/reload a lot on Triple Triad. There's only so much I can do to play around Same/Plus when i can't see her cards. I will say its a testament to how good Triple Triad is that that card game was enough to satisfy my desire for side content all on its own.

All total it took me about 33 ish hours to roll the credits.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
I've started into FF9. I've made it to Lindblum.
I'm basically co-signing everything you all wrote that I've read so far, but a couple of things that stood out to me.
- Felix you mentioned a lot of references. I'll say the opening including a good old flying boat with propellers with the full FMV treatment immediately made me like this game.
- Then the icon for this game in the title looks like its a crystal, which haven't been around prominently since 5 also looks promising.
- And of course Vivi, who looks like a 3d version of the NES sprite. I sort of wish Zidane was in green instead of blue. Like you said, its nice to be back to a 4 person party.
- FF music is always good, but FF9 has some really good music so far. The sword swinging simon game took me a ton of tries to win, but the music being so good made it fun. And the band from Tantalus plays the Junon music just before you leave the crashed airship i think.
- I think I'm also a big fan of some of the sounds in FF9 too. I like Steiner's clanking around or just the sound of hubub in town or the cheers when Zidane and Blank clash swords in the minigame.
- FF9 feels so whimsical to start. Big cities with flying boats and strange races of characters. Steiner is portrayed as very comical. His ankles showing above his metal shoes is the funniest part of his outfit to me, but the whole thing is very goofy. It all reminds me of FF5.
 

Daikaiju

Rated Ages 6+
(He, Him)
I've started into FF9. I've made it to Lindblum.
I'm basically co-signing everything you all wrote that I've read so far, but a couple of things that stood out to me.
- Felix you mentioned a lot of references. I'll say the opening including a good old flying boat with propellers with the full FMV treatment immediately made me like this game.
- Then the icon for this game in the title looks like its a crystal, which haven't been around prominently since 5 also looks promising.
- And of course Vivi, who looks like a 3d version of the NES sprite. I sort of wish Zidane was in green instead of blue. Like you said, its nice to be back to a 4 person party.
- FF music is always good, but FF9 has some really good music so far. The sword swinging simon game took me a ton of tries to win, but the music being so good made it fun. And the band from Tantalus plays the Junon music just before you leave the crashed airship i think.
- I think I'm also a big fan of some of the sounds in FF9 too. I like Steiner's clanking around or just the sound of hubub in town or the cheers when Zidane and Blank clash swords in the minigame.
- FF9 feels so whimsical to start. Big cities with flying boats and strange races of characters. Steiner is portrayed as very comical. His ankles showing above his metal shoes is the funniest part of his outfit to me, but the whole thing is very goofy. It all reminds me of FF5.
*taps the video*

 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
Steiners outfit is so great and so dumb, it's awesome. Good catch on the sounds, I'm sure they are a big part, why this game feels as cozy to me, as it does.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
Disk 1 is complete.
I really like Freya immediately. Then when we get to Burmicia and you see that it rains all the time and its like, oh well makes sense that her dragoon outfit is a raincoat. I said before that i wished there was more similarity to the old color schemes, but I'm going to retract that. I like these designs and how they are different.
I also like getting Zidane and Dagger some time apart. I like Zidane when he's being a supportive friend a lot more and I also like Dagger (and Steiner) getting some time to develop a broader world view.
Kuja really gives off some Kefka vibes and Beatrix is like Celes without a conscience. I don't like Queen Brahne's chances. I would not recommend she stand near any cliffs.
Sound design continues to be good. The rain sounds in Burmicia help the sad mood.
The opening interlude to disk 2 with the gate guards made me smile.
I just got to Treno and hey its like Jidoor from FF6.
I did a little bit of Hot and Cold and caught some frogs. I don't really look forward to either one, but then i get a nice little reward and it didn't take that long. I like that both are pretty easy to bump into and have a nice little introduction and then leave the rest open.

I agree with Sakaguchi. I like 9 too.
 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
You don't need to play the minigames, if you don't want to. The prices are nice, but not necessary.

Without spoilering much, buy equipment when it's available, because it might disappear, making you lose out on abilities. I don't think it's a big problem, but Vivis highest-tier elemental spells were abilities I missed my first time, due to that. They are the only ones that come to mind, though, so don't go paranoid about this. Even if you miss some abilities, the game is still very doable. Just a heads-up, if you like using Vivi.

Also, I'm very glad you enjoy this beautiful game, and that you like Freya. I think she's great.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
I know this is the game where you steal good equipment from bosses. I have been stealing equipment from bosses so far, though if I run into a tough enough boss, i'm willing to skip stealing something rare. I used the Synth shop to make two new weapons for Zidane and some armor and so I've been hoarding equipment instead of selling old pieces, assuming some of this stuff might get used for synths.

Hot and Cold only drives me crazy when it feels like I'm standing right on the spot and its not quite right and i feel like I'm digging all around the exact right location. That being said, its only 60 gil a pop and I don't know how much some of the items sell for, but i'm guessing even on an unlucky run, I'm probably either breaking even or making money. I like the hunting for the spot on the map part. It gives me a reason to explore the whole map and rotate the camera around to match up with the screenshot.

Speaking of the map, give this game some credit for best use of the 3d map so far. FF7 having a truly round and 3d map was fun. FF8 had a nice looking map, but I wouldn't say that was a big focus of that game. FF9 world map is really using that 3rd dimension to create cliffs and valleys. I'm guessing we're going to have an FF3 style map zoom out at some point and I can't wait to see what else is out there.
 

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
FF9 also has the famous Cotton Robe exploit, where the components cost less than the sell price. I'm not sure money is ever tight enough to bother with it, though.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
I finished Disk 2 of FF9.
I found Disk 2 full of some fun locations and settings (and music and sounds). The Fossil Roo with the gargants was a fun puzzle dungeon and it wasn't too hard to find my way around. Conde Petie is so strange, but i like that the dwarves aren't in a cave, but on a bridge and do the wedding ceremony in the sunlight. And they have fun accents. (I feel like this game if it was voice acted, would add some nuance with the way I imagine different characters talk). Black Mage Village has the fun little hat houses and the strange forest it hides behind. Going under the Iifa tree feels so ominous. A very FF7 vibe.

Disk 1 was really action packed and had a lot of world events going on. Disk 2 has a much more character focused element. The outer continent feels like a mostly uninhabited backwater and Alexandria doesn't show up until the finale. Its mostly about learning more about the black mages and the summoners and the mist. I interpreted Eiko's advances on Zidane as Eiko having some lack of social understanding. I'm assuming she has mostly been living with her grandfather and the moogles. She doesn't seem to have a relationship with the dwarves, since she just steals from them and doesn't ask for help. Who knows, maybe being able to commune with Eidolons messes with your brain too.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
Boy oh boy, Disk 3 sure started strong. I referenced spectacle back when talking about the summons in FF7 with a joking conversation that even at FF7 the indulgence taken on summons was maybe already out of hand. Alexander said hold my beer. And I loved every minute of the spectacle. The angel wings wrapping around the castle and then how they dissolve. I surely did not expect the eye in the sky was a maybe spaceship with Garland on it.

I really liked the mini-intrigue on the love letter and it resulting in Beatrix and Steiner hinting at feelings for each other. Very black cat and golden retriever energy. I love it.

I felt like the smash cut to Lindblum at the end of the destruction of Alexandria was a bit jarring. How did Steiner escape and what happened to Beatrix? Apparently Cuja has an airship now? What happened to his dragon? Dagger can't talk? I understand that she would be pretty upset about her home being destroyed, but how that's manifested felt odd. She's not depressed or crying. She seems willing to go on another excursion, just can't talk. More questions than answers, so I'll just keep playing and see what happens next.

And now, i finally have a boat and I have my first chance to pick my party. I feel like everyone other than Vivi needs some screen time. Dagger has a lot of summons to learn. Steiner and Freya have been absent for a while and Amarant hasn't been with us long.

So, my question is this: with 8 characters, will the game at some point take the opportunity to split us into two teams of 4 like in Kefka's Tower? Or should I prioritize some characters skills over others? For now, i think my immediate future will involve catching some frogs, choco digging and a kupo nut delivery.
 

Daikaiju

Rated Ages 6+
(He, Him)
Make sure you synth the Save the Queen sword and keep it in your inventory for an extra bit during the ending
 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
There will be a time, where you have to use Quina. Don't forget her.

That said, I normally focus on one core group, leaving the others behind (I think Zidane, Steiner, Vivi, Dagger and Freya - no idea who I would leave out, I'm confused). Anyway, even with Quina untrained, I made it through the part. And through everything else. I don't think you need to worry. The same with skills. I just gave them weapon by weapon.

Another reminder to get the weapon that teaches Vivi his tier-3 elemental spells. It should be a store-bought item that will vanish after some time (and I think the window isn't that big). If you ever see it, buy it immediately. But even here, I missed it during my first playthrough, using Vivi, and still made it. But he did lag behind, iirc.

Aside from that, just keep playing. I don't think there should be any too nasty surprises.
 
I can't help but take advantage of the (quick grinding trick) Quina Level-5 Death thing with the dragons above Gizamaluke's Grotto so usually end up with a somewhat balanced team, level-wise.
 
The game extremely rewards using Quina by making them arguably the best party member if you take the time to teach them their Blue Magic.

Also, merits in battle aside, having Quina in your party is its own reward.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
I am in Mt. Gulug. Hello familiar volcano music!
I had a bit of trouble with the split party scenario on my first try. I did get the hint about magic vs non-magic. So party #1 was Zidane, Dagger, Amarant, Freya. That went smoothly. However, my 2nd party of Eiko, Quina, Vivi, and Steiner had issues. I found a map online, but still missed a couple orbs and died to the big stone slab. Second try went much better though

I did make sure to pick up the -aga staff for Vivi, along with a bunch of other equipment there. I had to sell off a bunch of phoneix pinions and ethers to afford it all though.
I'm currently taking a break after beating a pair of Red Dragons that took me 14 tries to beat. I did read that there were a couple blue magics to learn here, so i brough Zidane, Vivi, Quina and Steiner. About half the fights i lost to a twister or double twister killing someone on the first turn and just resetting. I reset twice when i failed to get the HP threshold right for eat. Several times, i had it all worked out and would have almost won before twister would kill the whole team.

I've also read the Felix posts. I have noticed a lot of the same things you did. I was also disturbed by the revelation that the previous king of alexandria had dagger's horn removed. I also enjoyed the little love note mix up that brings Steiner and Beatrix together. Kind of out of left field, but maybe they've both been all about their duty first and just haven't ever had time to think about their personal feelings until then. It was cute i thought.
 

nataeryn

Discovered Construction
(he/him)
Okay, Disk 3 is complete.

I agree with Felix that Cid's wife just being a well treated, but un-needed captive of Kuja felt like a let down. They set her up early and I was excited to learn what happened to her. I was disappointed that she was completely unconnected to the plot, other than she heard Kuja's plan so she tells us what to do next.

I liked the upside down castle, though I was expecting some mechanic to flip it over or something. I like the arc with Amarant. The PS1 FFs have mostly kept the ensemble cast connected to the main story, instead of the vignette style of FF6. FF9 does have a bit of a blend. Freya is the one who most has her plot early and then just hangs around. I think this game does a good job of establishing that there characters were brought together because of the plot, but they stick together because of the bonds they've formed. Amarant, because of the character arc here has established he'll be with the group from now on, not because he has to, or to solve a particular problem. I thought it was well done.

I got real excited about the 4 seals and having a good old fashioned elemental themed big party split up. Like Felix, i thought the pairings were interesting. I like that you don't get to pick. The game has been going for a while, so i don't mind that the locations are more shrine than dungeon. I was disappointed that I didn't get to fight all 4 bosses. I wised up since the Red Dragons and made sure Quina and Zidane had on earth elemental protection and from now on, will be paying closer attention to what equipment does. Between the teaching abilities, changing stats and providing elemental buffs and resistances and weapons having Add Status effects, there's a lot to keep track of.

I thought the plot dump in Terra was pretty well done. I think it establishes Kuja's motives well and makes his decent believable. I like Zidane almost falling into the same void, trying to push away his friends and a series of battles and cutscenes to show his friends are fighting to bring Zidane back from the brink. Like Felix, I enjoyed seeing Steiner acknowledge Zidane.

For the disk 3 finale, i brought Zidane, Vivi, Eiko and Amarant. Zidane did a bunch of stealing. Eiko mostly was healing and buffing, plus a few Holys. Vivi was throwing half-mp Flares. Amarant used Chakra to help keep Eiko and Vivi's MP going. I gave him Return Magic which paid off nicely. The fight was slow, but the team was very magically durable and back row capable. I like how every character has nice support utility. I don't really want to bench anyone. Oh, and I shouted out when Kuja kicked Garland off the edge. I expected Kuja to do that as a call back to Kefka so when it happened and I was reading out loud my "ARRGGGHH!!" for Garland was extra loud.

Lastly, i liked the Genomes scenes with the Black Mages. They might not live long, but they have purpose now. They can teach the Genomes and help raise the baby chocobo.

I'm anxious to put a bow on FF9, which is going to run longer than any FF game so far for me. I've engaged with many more side activities than FF7 or FF8, but I haven't finished them. I have missing chocographs (i have the dark blue chocobo). I have like 70ish frogs. I used the Cotton Robe trick a bunch and was able to buy a lot of equipment. Everyone could use more AP, though everyone has most of their active abilities learned now. Everyone is in the late 30s on levels. I've definitely enjoyed FF9 as a world more than the other PS1 FFs. I think i'll try to wrap up the chocographs and figure out how to wrap up whatever i've been doing with moogles and delivering letters all game if i can. I'm just excited to get to FF10...
 

FelixSH

(He/Him)
As a warning (which probably comes too late, sorry), the letters kinda make a guide necessary. I didn't mention them, because you don't get anything essential, but some of them are missable. I remember one, where you have to get back to a place with no obvious reason, with only a short time window. The game is a bit guide-baity, but thankfully not in any important way.

I don't think I ever got enough frogs. That at least felt too grindy. I might be wrong, maybe I did it last time, I can't remember. But it's not a fun activity. I always enjoyed Chocobo Hot'n'Cold, though.
 
Top