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Paul le Fou

24/7 lofi hip hop man to study/relax to
(He)
I finally caved to peer pressure from a chat group at work and got Gnosia and have been mainlining that since Thursday or so. It's a single-player Mafia game (or Werewolf, or Among Us, or however you identify "impostor deduction" games.) To sum up how it plays in an elevator pitch, it's kinda like a roguelike visual novel. Each "game" takes 5-15 minutes, and you have multiple loops (usually over 100) to see all the events and finish the game, as you try to find the impostors or kill the uninfected crew, with 14 other characters and their distinct personalities, quirks, and play idiosyncrasies.

They build a one-player Mafia game mechanically by giving you EXP each loop that you use to level up and increase your stats, which effect how well you do things in the games. Charisma, Intuition, Charm, Stealth, Logic, and Performance - each help you mechanically in the games. High charisma makes it more likely that people listen and are convinced by your doubting or covering for someone. High intuition and you might get a flash knowing that someone is lying. High stealth, you're less likely to stand out to the bad guys and get targeted at night, or get doubted for not speaking up enough. High charm makes you more likeable, and less likely to get dogpiled on/more likely to be defended when doubted. Performance makes you a better liar and actor.

You play via commands, and can get more of them—special skills essentially—by getting stats high enough. The basic commands are Doubt (That person is suspicious), Cover (That person is not suspicious,) Deny (I'm not suspicious!), then context-specific ones for agreeing or disagreeing when other people are doubting or covering others. You can also claim a role if you have it or if you're a baddie.

Then, raising certain stats unlocks new commands. Seek Agreement is a "This person knows what's up, listen to them!" skill to boost someone else's arguments much more than the normal "Agree" command. There's "Don't be fooled," to turn it around when someone suspicious is doubting you (Like when you're the engineer and the other person claiming engineer is trying to get you iced). There's Regret, to act really sad and hurt when someone suspects you and get other people's sympathy. Let's Collaborate, to propose an alliance with another character. There's even Grovel, where if you get voted out, you might be able to beg and cry really hard and have them decide not to sleep you after all. Et cetera. How effective each one of these is at moving the (invisible) needles is based on your values of the related stats.

There are also the basic Mafia roles. Engineer - examine a character. Doctor - identify the person who was voted out. Guardian Angel - pick a person to be protected against the bad guys' night kill. Guard Duty - two people who are guaranteed crew but without special powers. AC Follower - a human, unknown to the Gnosia and vice-versa, but who's trying to help the bad guys win. Bug, who's on neither team but wins over either side if they survive to the end.

You also set each game's setup details specifically after a while - for each loop you can set however many crew members and gnosia there are, which roles you want active, and which role you are (you can also choose random for the last one). There's also an event finder that automatically sets the things to allow for base conditions for events you haven't seen yet.



The actual games play out mostly through canned dialog lines ("You point out suspicious things about Setsu's behavior.") with each character having a few basic lines for each situation ("So I'm in the way, huh...?") ("No, I trust Comet over Otome.") It gets repetitive if you're actually reading it like dialog, at the beginning. But I think the repetitive nature actually makes those simple, repetitive lines work in the game's favor, especially after 50 or 100 loops. After a while the dialog kind of falls away and you proceed through it as a kind of series of long ideograms/logic signs. I dunno, it doesn't bother me too much.


In between each day of the "games" you can go see one of the other characters on the ship. This might just be a very simple line of dialog, depending on whether they trust or distrust you, but you can also trigger events - this is where you learn those special commands mentioned above, where a fellow baddie gives you advice on who to take out, where someone might tell you they want to collaborate or tell you someone they think is lying. But most importantly, it's where the story develops. Each character has a number of bits of their backstory, and progressing through and finishing the game is mainly through story events revealing those bits. Sometimes it's just random, sometimes it's based on who's alive or who's in what role, or whether you survived with X character until the end of the game. Like "if X and Y are on guard duty (guaranteed crew but with no special powers) together, this story event happens" or "if you and X are both Gnosia and both survive til the end," and so on. There's a pretty decent chunk of backstory, though the characters' stories can be a little fragmented from each other, and some really cool/shocking/interesting twists and revelations along the way.

Anyway, it's a weird, very unique game that does something really neat and, mostly, succeeds pretty admirably. It's pretty cheap too, it's on Switch, and y'all should try it out. Or talk about it here if you have. Mark your story spoilers because there are some big ones!
 

Paul le Fou

24/7 lofi hip hop man to study/relax to
(He)
Sorry, forgot an important point. This is Otome:

chara_full_otome.png


She's a sentient beluga and she is baby.
 

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
I am intrigued by your description and wish to learn more.
 

MrBlarney

(he / him)
I picked this up shortly after launch on good word from a different forum, and I've put about sixty loops into the game so far. I set it aside for a few weeks due to distractions from other games, but I'd like to get back into it. It's indeed a very interesting peanut butter and jelly mix of visual novel storytelling with Mafia / Werewolf gameplay mechanics.

The way actions and statistics work in the Mafia gameplay sections are surprisingly well executed. While the action flow is fairly regimented and text quips limited, it still conveys the essence of the social deduction game as a whole. One thing that I've enjoyed is the fact that the fourteen other crew members have their own play styles, statistic spreads, and command abilities. Over time, you learn each person's quirks and tendencies, and it's like getting to know your own Mafia game group.

One little thing that has bothered me is the fact that you don't get to see what happens in the rest of the game if you get eliminated. In a real life game of Mafia, it's sometimes good to act in a way that gets yourself killed, if it'll let the rest of your team eke out an eventual win. But the reward structure of the game incentivizes personal survival, making it difficult to play Guard Duty, AC Follower, or even Gnosia roles. I understand the narrative reasons for a loop to cut off with personal elimination, but it would just be nice for the game to still reward EXP for making plays that lead your team to victory, even if you personally got eliminated.

The difficulty of the game is a bit uneven from what I've played so far. Early in the game, your stats will be low, so your influence on the game will be limited and other players will be more eager to view you suspiciously. But as your stats grow, your character gets to be a lot more influential without nearly as many negative repercussions. The game states that the crew members' stats will grow as you learn more of their backgrounds and secrets, and they do indeed gain abilities over time, but it feels like the player stats increase faster than the crew. Outside of a small bump in difficulty around level 50, I haven't really felt that much threat from the game since my player level hit the 40s.

So in some ways, the game feels like a little bit of Mafia power fantasy. Certainly, there will times where I'll get taken out early or unfairly, but that's just the randomness of the game. Even in those instances, I know if I did something wrong but I still feel in control of the game flow. Although... sometimes it's hard to tell how much of the gameplay outcomes are a result of the player's own actions, and how much is the game secretly putting its thumb on the scale to force events to reveal something new to the player. Yes, the first dozen or so loops are clearly an introduction to the game with a high amount of predetermined outcomes. But even beyond that, there have been cases where I've felt like I've gotten more lucky than pure random chance would have gotten me. I don't know if that's particularly good or bad, but the lack of being able to tell for sure still results in a net positive feeling for me.

At this point, I'm mostly invested in the game for its story elements, with the Mafia gameplay a vehicle for unearthing narrative nuggets. The Mafia gameplay doesn't break down completely from focusing on the story, it just provides incentives for playing the game in different ways. But we'll see how well that holds up as I get into the second halfish(?) of the game. I have no idea how a game like this has mechanics for engineering an ending, so I'm still interested to find out how it'll accomplish that.
 
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Paul le Fou

24/7 lofi hip hop man to study/relax to
(He)
One little thing that has bothered me is the fact that you don't get to see what happens in the rest of the game if you get eliminated. In a real life game of Mafia, it's sometimes good to act in a way that gets yourself killed, if it'll let the rest of your team eke out an eventual win. But the reward structure of the game incentivizes personal survival, making it difficult to play Guard Duty, AC Follower, or even Gnosia roles. I understand the narrative reasons for a loop to cut off with personal elimination, but it would just be nice for the game to still reward EXP for making plays that lead your team to victory, even if you personally got eliminated.
Yes, this is definitely one of my 2 biggest Mafia-mechanic-related complaints. I wish it would at least give you a summary/end-state of the rest of the game; like "Crew won" after you did a sacrifice play and experience commensurate to that. Doesn't seem like it would be too hard to ad-hoc one with the game-state and character stats (of course it's always harder than one would think, but still).

For what it's worth, my other big complaint is that role-claiming can only happen once. So if I'm the engineer and someone claims engineer, I have to also claim it right at that moment or I never get another chance to reveal myself. In mafia it's often beneficial to stay quiet and work behind the scenes while keeping your eye on the opponent you know to be lying without revealing yourself to danger. You can do that, but you never then get to come out later in the game with "They're lying, I'm the real doctor, and here are all my scans."

What makes that even worse is that, if only one person claims for a role, they can become eligible for the logic command "Definite Human" only because they were the only one who claimed. I've had my crew logically deduce that the liar engineer (I was a still-secret engineer) must be human and trustworthy just because they were the only one who claimed, which made them basically invincible to doubt (I got iced for trying and lost the round). This is a problem because it completely ignores the very real possibility of another engineer who just didn't announce. It seems like a really big oversight to leave in a game that successfully covered so many other bases. (Although there is apparently an event you can trigger by not claiming your role while someone else claims and then winning the game anyway; it may or may not require their having logically deduced the liar to be a definite human too, but I don't know details for sure. A coworker just told me about its existence.)
At this point, I'm mostly invested in the game for its story elements, with the Mafia gameplay a vehicle for unearthing narrative nuggets. The Mafia gameplay doesn't break down completely from focusing on the story, it just provides incentives for playing the game in different ways. But we'll see how well that holds up as I get into the second halfish(?) of the game. I have no idea how a game like this has mechanics for engineering an ending, so I'm still interested to find out how it'll accomplish that.
Definitely. I'm very close to the end but I'm having trouble getting the last few (?) events to trigger for me, but there's some neat story stuff that picks up in the latter half to keep me interested. And also...I've come to just kinda like a number of the characters. For how sparse their dialog variety and interaction can be, they did surprisingly well giving each one a distinct personality (which informs and extends to how they play the game, too!).
 

MrBlarney

(he / him)
At least if you make the mistake of failing to claim a role in verity, you don't make the mistake again. The in-game guidebook (which is definitely worth a read through after getting through the first dozen or so tutorial loops) also alludes to failing to claim being a bad idea too.

The game probably doesn't allow for asynchronous claiming of roles for various mechanical reasons. The "Definite Human" and "Definite Enemy" commands would be a lot more limited if asynchronous role claims were possible. It's also possible that the AI system just isn't able to flexibly switch up their Hate, Amicability, etc. meters to allow for asynchronous role claims in a satisfying way. I've just taken it as a mechanical compromise in order to make the game work smoothly.
 

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
I picked this up and played an hour or so. I'm pretty sure I'm still in the tutorial. Enjoying it so far.
 

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
Finished the game tonight. The ending was really good: you spend the game learning all these things about the other characters, and the ending leans into everything you've learned to tie everything up very satisfyingly.

As a single-player Mafia simulator, it's surprisingly competent, but at a meta level, the Mafia is a vehicle for a visual novel in much the same way as Phoenix Wright. The game-within-a-game is figuring out how to trigger all the character events, and it's very fortunate that the game throws you a bone there. Even still, I'd never have found the last one I was missing without looking it up, nor would I have figured out what to do when the Silver Key stops working. The solution there is very clever; the event trigger, on the other hand, was needlessly esoteric: you need to Cover Remnan, triggering a night conversation with him, and have him survive to the next day for a second conversation. It's not the only thing in the game along those lines, but the other events that are hard to set up spell out the requirements for you (e.g. character A needs to be put into cold sleep even though he's human, and then you and character B need to survive and win). Actually, those explicit but hard challenges were some of the best parts of the game for me.

All I'll say aside from that is that this game really scratches the Mafia itch, even though their Mafia metagame is way different from any I've played (you routinely get two or three people claiming the same role, and people are mostly content to let all of them live for several days).
 

Paul le Fou

24/7 lofi hip hop man to study/relax to
(He)
Woo! I'm glad you enjoyed it. I'm hoping some more people pick it, since I think it flew pretty low under the radar, but I think it's definitely worth a look!

There were definitely a few events I didn't get to trigger until I looked up a guide or a friend told me how. That said, I felt the game was also fairly good about feeding you some of the more otherwise-esoteric or impossibly-random ones (like "X and Y are on Guard Duty together").
 

Mogri

Round and round I go
(he)
Staff member
Moderator
I think I would have enjoyed "single-player Mafia RPG" well enough on its own, but the metagame of teasing out events and the overarching narrative really push this game over the top for me. It was surprisingly good. Thanks for introducing it!
 

q 3

here to eat fish and erase the universe
(they/them)
I'm glad I decided to look up spoilers after beating this, because I never would have realized that there's a second ending let alone that it requires creating a new save file with the same profile information as your original save. How diabolical!
 

q 3

here to eat fish and erase the universe
(they/them)
It's a lot of fun, though I think it's best appreciated primarily as a one-player turn-based strategy game that just happens to have a veneer of werewolf/mafia and occasional story segments, as it completely lacks the social aspect of the former and spends less time on visual novel segments than even, say, Persona. I did enjoy the story, and while none of the characters individually are outstanding (except as enby representation) they do make for a good ensemble. And the ending has just the right amount of resolution without answering every single mystery (or unnecessarily expanding the scope of the narrative, like I'm pretty sure humanity is still doomed to fall to Gnosia eventually, and I even speculate that it's Setsu's fault for sending Manan into the past so she can become the Borg Queen).

I'm somehow still not burnt out on the gameplay and am doing self-imposed challenge runs now (15 crew, 1 Gnosia, all jobs active, play as AC Follower is maybe the most exhilarating I've found). Though I do wish there were a way to replay character events and story loops after clearing the game. There's an illustration viewer but it'd be nice to repeat the actual scenes and try different dialogue options, and some of the unique victory conditions were interesting (or aggravating in the case of a certain smug bug who likes to self-destruct). I'm actually tempted to start a brand new game anyway, as apparently your chosen gender affects some dialogue options?
 

Peklo

Oh! Create!
(they/them, she/her)
Spreading the word that this is now out on Steam, for those that missed it on Switch or were waiting for this release in particular.
 
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