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The Depressing Music Thunderdome - You're in Too Deep, There's No Way Out
- Thread starter Falselogic
- Start date
Huh, well this thunderdome more than others has made me consider how much my musical tastes don't seem to align with TT's. I already haven't been voting much because several of the matchups I just haven't felt like I can even begin to evaluate as depressing music.
For me Fine on the Outside fully embodies the kind of lifelong, internal, and existential bleakness with no particular cause that I personally associate with depression. Yes, the person changed circumstances but it didn't actually solve anything ("So I left home, I packed up and l moved far away from my past one day / And I laughed, I laughed, I laughed, I laughed / I sound fine on the outside.") Honestly without the context of the movie for me it almost reads like a song about suicidal ideation.
And maybe it's just the ace/aro in me talking but songs that are about feeling bad because your lover died or left you or betrayed you sound a lot more sad than depressed to me; they're literally about acute painful emotions that are understandably caused by a distinct traumatic event.
There's really no way to evaluate how depressive a music is. The lyrics will always hit on specific experiences, and in general I'm not even analyzing on them as I vote. No such thing as a more valid approach to depression, and I would even say on the topic of a song having hopeful resolution, it doesn't necessitate that a listener has the same outlook. Some things in life suck, even when you find ways to cope.
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Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
Adagio on the Outside
I'm with Pudik on this. Music and emotional states ARE so personal and there is so much that goes into both of them that I don't expect any song that someone nominated here to completely make sense to anyone else.
I know for my nominations its not the lyrics or the tune that are doing the work, but rather where I was when I first encountered them. There are several EDM songs I was very close to nominating but decided not to, because they don't really make any sense as depression songs except for the fact that I was in the trough of a manic-depressive wave when I encountered them and they'll always been associated with that state for me.
I know for my nominations its not the lyrics or the tune that are doing the work, but rather where I was when I first encountered them. There are several EDM songs I was very close to nominating but decided not to, because they don't really make any sense as depression songs except for the fact that I was in the trough of a manic-depressive wave when I encountered them and they'll always been associated with that state for me.
Adiago Drowns
Drowning Adagio
Adagio / Drown
Don't have a lot to say about my nom here besides that it's just pure emotion. This is one of those public domain pieces of music that gets pulled out for an easy musical shorthand for sadness and tragedy, and occasionally as a gag when some overwrought sadness is needed, really frequently. You've probably heard this track before even without knowing it's name.
Don't have a lot to say about my nom here besides that it's just pure emotion. This is one of those public domain pieces of music that gets pulled out for an easy musical shorthand for sadness and tragedy, and occasionally as a gag when some overwrought sadness is needed, really frequently. You've probably heard this track before even without knowing it's name.
I still need a tie breaker for this!
Samuel Butler and Orville Peck move forward.
Round 1
Match 15
@Johnny Unusual 's Dress Rehearsal Rag by Leonard Cohen and @pudik 's Nothing Important by Richard Dawson meet
VS
Match 16
@WildcatJF 's Joyful Girl by Ani DiFranco faces @Dark Medusa 's Carissa by Sun Kil Moon
VS
Match 15
@Johnny Unusual 's Dress Rehearsal Rag by Leonard Cohen and @pudik 's Nothing Important by Richard Dawson meet
Match 16
@WildcatJF 's Joyful Girl by Ani DiFranco faces @Dark Medusa 's Carissa by Sun Kil Moon
What is it you feel when listening to this music?
Violentvixen
(She/Her)
abstain
and
Ani DiFranco As an aside I have not thought of her in a long time. Probably not since I got one of her songs on the breakup mix tape from my first boyfriend...
I'm not great at emotions but I think the songs that really hit me hard are the ones about how it made everything feel bleak, or how it made their outlook on the world permanently be destroyed, how they could never trust again (romantically or not) etc. Also depression can definitely be triggered by a single event so the line between sad and depressed is very blurred (at least to me).
I remember a lot of people having similar questions when I ran the Stressful Music Thunderdome, and I said it's up to the voters what made something stressful or not. It's a very personal thing.
and
Ani DiFranco As an aside I have not thought of her in a long time. Probably not since I got one of her songs on the breakup mix tape from my first boyfriend...
Man, that's interesting to me. I don't get that from the song at all.
I'm not great at emotions but I think the songs that really hit me hard are the ones about how it made everything feel bleak, or how it made their outlook on the world permanently be destroyed, how they could never trust again (romantically or not) etc. Also depression can definitely be triggered by a single event so the line between sad and depressed is very blurred (at least to me).
Oh yeah, any song in the world can be permanently locked into one emotional state based on experience. And I think that's way more powerful.
I remember a lot of people having similar questions when I ran the Stressful Music Thunderdome, and I said it's up to the voters what made something stressful or not. It's a very personal thing.
I'd love to hear them if you'd still share. I nominated that one mashup but also had others in mind, I'll see if I can find them.
Dress Rehersal Rag / Carissa
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
On Carissa: Before anyone says anything, the guy behind Sun Kil Moon is a GIANT asshole. It's a real shame, too, because once in a while he spins out songs that truly tug at your heartstrings like Carissa. I mean, look at those lyrics! It's all about a second cousin who died before her time because of a freak trash fire... which is similar to how his uncle died. And he spends the song both waxing poetic about how he's called to talk about how her life had meaning, and also thinking about how his grief and love of his family fits into all this. It's both deeply sad but also a frank, raw look at how the writer processed his grief. And it's a beautifully put together song, to boot.
EDIT: In listening to some of the songs going against mine before, I missed this specific version of Joyful Girl (wasn't the version on the bracket different? I don't remember that intro). All the same it's a good'un, I wish it weren't going against my own entry!
On the other contest: Honest to god, it's so hard to top Leonard Cohen at his best, but I tip my hat to a really intriguing pick from pudik here in Nothing Important. I listened to the whole sixteen minutes! I really enjoyed it. But the choice is still Dress Rehearsal Rag.
EDIT: In listening to some of the songs going against mine before, I missed this specific version of Joyful Girl (wasn't the version on the bracket different? I don't remember that intro). All the same it's a good'un, I wish it weren't going against my own entry!
On the other contest: Honest to god, it's so hard to top Leonard Cohen at his best, but I tip my hat to a really intriguing pick from pudik here in Nothing Important. I listened to the whole sixteen minutes! I really enjoyed it. But the choice is still Dress Rehearsal Rag.
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Dress Rehearsal Rag / Joyful Girl
Richard Dawson
pass
minor apologies for a 16 minute song. Really want to highlight Richard Dawson though, as I think he's probably my favorite modern singer/songwriter kind. Really fragile style of plain speech with moments of sheer beauty. Really haunting when he wants to be, loveable all the time. There are more digestible (well, as digestible as a depressive music tourney would allow) that I was considering, like Wooden Bag, but Nothing Important is the first song I thought of here, and maybe the most impressive on a depressing front. It's personal, mostly stories of his family and largely focused around his brother's death, but the real brunt of the song is the terror of forgetting ("and I don't care about these things/Why do they remain so clear while the faces of my loved ones disappear?"). Haunts me in ways very few could (Cohen does approach it, unfortunately for tourney performance sake). But he also uses his unabashed nostalgia for more sweet moments, like the tender (well, maybe bittersweet, as I might have nominated it instead if it weren't so warm) We Picked Apples in a Graveyard Freshly Mowed or more multi-layered story of community in Queens Head or Two Halves, which rests on a bookended relation of a father equally demanding and comforting.
I'm not sure if Dawson is really obscure enough or anything to require a writeup, but I don't see him spoken of with near the importance I see in him (except maybe from The Quietus), so I'll take every opportunity
pass
minor apologies for a 16 minute song. Really want to highlight Richard Dawson though, as I think he's probably my favorite modern singer/songwriter kind. Really fragile style of plain speech with moments of sheer beauty. Really haunting when he wants to be, loveable all the time. There are more digestible (well, as digestible as a depressive music tourney would allow) that I was considering, like Wooden Bag, but Nothing Important is the first song I thought of here, and maybe the most impressive on a depressing front. It's personal, mostly stories of his family and largely focused around his brother's death, but the real brunt of the song is the terror of forgetting ("and I don't care about these things/Why do they remain so clear while the faces of my loved ones disappear?"). Haunts me in ways very few could (Cohen does approach it, unfortunately for tourney performance sake). But he also uses his unabashed nostalgia for more sweet moments, like the tender (well, maybe bittersweet, as I might have nominated it instead if it weren't so warm) We Picked Apples in a Graveyard Freshly Mowed or more multi-layered story of community in Queens Head or Two Halves, which rests on a bookended relation of a father equally demanding and comforting.
I'm not sure if Dawson is really obscure enough or anything to require a writeup, but I don't see him spoken of with near the importance I see in him (except maybe from The Quietus), so I'll take every opportunity
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
I knew I was either going to use Tom Waits or Leonard Cohen for this and choosing just the right one was tough but this is by far the grimmest, a bleak song about either a suicide or a strong contemplation. So I think the title is either life is just a dress rehearsal for death or the contemplation of that decision in a dark time is the dress rehearsal (I'm not super good at decoding music so if someone has another take, I'm interested)
This live rendition of "Joyful Girl" starts with a bit of humor, but the overall message of the song reads as a really strong statement on how women are viewed and view themselves. There is an expectation that women should smile, be happy, be content...but the actuality is often the opposite. They are judged, criticized, often forced to behave as the social boundaries have been defined for them without their say. And the internalized voice that was taught to act like society and nitpick its host adds to the complexity of life.
"Everything I do is judged
And they mostly get it wrong
But oh well
'Cause the bathroom mirror has not budged
And the woman who lives there can tell
The truth from the stuff that they say
And, she looks me in the eye
And says "'would you prefer the easy way?
No? Well, okay, then ...
Don't cry.'"
It's a brutally honest perspective that cuts deep into the heart of a woman's day to day. And yet, beneath that weight, there is some fiery hope about being that idealized force of joy in the song. To own who you are and move past those expectations. But to do it for yourself.
Ultimately I selected it because I always found the tone of the music and vocals in contrast to the lyrics. "Joyful Girl" is a call for something that she wishes to be, but has to overcome so much to achieve.
And since I think I made it to a vote for once, I'm abstaining from the first round and voting for "Joyful Girl" in the second.
"Everything I do is judged
And they mostly get it wrong
But oh well
'Cause the bathroom mirror has not budged
And the woman who lives there can tell
The truth from the stuff that they say
And, she looks me in the eye
And says "'would you prefer the easy way?
No? Well, okay, then ...
Don't cry.'"
It's a brutally honest perspective that cuts deep into the heart of a woman's day to day. And yet, beneath that weight, there is some fiery hope about being that idealized force of joy in the song. To own who you are and move past those expectations. But to do it for yourself.
Ultimately I selected it because I always found the tone of the music and vocals in contrast to the lyrics. "Joyful Girl" is a call for something that she wishes to be, but has to overcome so much to achieve.
And since I think I made it to a vote for once, I'm abstaining from the first round and voting for "Joyful Girl" in the second.
Nothing Important and Carissa
Leonard Cohen and Sun Kil Moon continue.
Round 1
Match 17
@Torzelbaum's Mad World by Gary Jules and @Dark Medusa 's My Dear Helen by Andy Shauf meet
VS
Match 18
@Violentvixen 's Hello by Adele faces @Falselogic 's I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry by Hank Williams
VS
If you've got thoughts please share them!Match 17
@Torzelbaum's Mad World by Gary Jules and @Dark Medusa 's My Dear Helen by Andy Shauf meet
Match 18
@Violentvixen 's Hello by Adele faces @Falselogic 's I'm So Lonesome I Could Cry by Hank Williams
Mad World
and
pass
Please note that I had the credits wrong when I nominated that entry - it's performed by Michael Andrews and Gary Jules. It's a cover of the original by Tears for Fears.
and
pass
Please note that I had the credits wrong when I nominated that entry - it's performed by Michael Andrews and Gary Jules. It's a cover of the original by Tears for Fears.
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Violentvixen
(She/Her)
Gonna have to keep thinking about that first one. I have never heard that My Dear Helen song before, it's haunting. Mad World is absolutely a depressing sounding song but I've never quite been able to parse the lyrics. Tough one.
Edit: Going to go with My Dear Helen
But Hello for the second. Nothing worse than finding out that someone else doesn't care about or remember something that still tears you up inside after time has passed. Doesn't need to be a relationship, just discovering that something soul crushing and full of despair to you didn't even register to someone else.
Edit: Going to go with My Dear Helen
But Hello for the second. Nothing worse than finding out that someone else doesn't care about or remember something that still tears you up inside after time has passed. Doesn't need to be a relationship, just discovering that something soul crushing and full of despair to you didn't even register to someone else.
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I'll come back and listen and vote, but let me explain My Dear Helen:
The song is part of a duo of back to back songs at the end of an album; the first (Jerry Was A Clerk) describes a group of snotty kids banding together to rob a house of an old man/farmer so that they can live care free, and is told from the POV of one of the robbers. The song ends as one of the kids (the leader's girlfriend, incidentally) gets hit by gunfire shot by the farmer because he thought there were coyotes trying to eat his chickens, and shot out a warning. I don't particularly love the song by itself, but it sets up this next one real nicely.
My Dear Helen is then told from the POV of the man being robbed, and it's framed through a conversation with his dead wife, catching her up with what's gone on recently. But the key here is a phrase that she said while she was alive, that she'd "catch me at the gates [of heaven] and sneak [him] in". We then hear about his account of the incident, finding the dead girl, burying her, and his grief. The kicker: he wonders if he'll be able to go to heaven after "this accidental killing", and hopes that Helen can sneak him in. Devastating. The chord progression has two different sections, with a B section that repeats with rising action, ratcheting up the tension. My Dear Helen is haunting, and depressing, and there's ultimately no answer to his desperate plea as the song ends.
The song is part of a duo of back to back songs at the end of an album; the first (Jerry Was A Clerk) describes a group of snotty kids banding together to rob a house of an old man/farmer so that they can live care free, and is told from the POV of one of the robbers. The song ends as one of the kids (the leader's girlfriend, incidentally) gets hit by gunfire shot by the farmer because he thought there were coyotes trying to eat his chickens, and shot out a warning. I don't particularly love the song by itself, but it sets up this next one real nicely.
My Dear Helen is then told from the POV of the man being robbed, and it's framed through a conversation with his dead wife, catching her up with what's gone on recently. But the key here is a phrase that she said while she was alive, that she'd "catch me at the gates [of heaven] and sneak [him] in". We then hear about his account of the incident, finding the dead girl, burying her, and his grief. The kicker: he wonders if he'll be able to go to heaven after "this accidental killing", and hopes that Helen can sneak him in. Devastating. The chord progression has two different sections, with a B section that repeats with rising action, ratcheting up the tension. My Dear Helen is haunting, and depressing, and there's ultimately no answer to his desperate plea as the song ends.