FF6 (our third finalest fantasy)

[Peklo]

I'm always a little bit surprised when Saga's contributions to this game come as news to even people very familiar with the material and her other works, but I'm glad the word is being put out there. I'm obviously not hot on Edgar for the discussed reasons but I think the interpersonal dynamic between the brothers is good, and Sabin individually and as part of the group dynamic that he gets to partake in is one of the game's clearer successes. Too bad Figaro no Kekkon seems to be largely inaccessible outside of second-hand summaries as far as its content.

 

[ThricebornPhoenix]

Oh, and has anyone ever properly sussed out the solution to the Zozo-chainsaw puzzle? Or have we all been working off the same Nintendo Power guide since 1994?

If you talk to everyone, it's pretty simple.

It cannot be ignored that the whole thing is rather misogynistic (a grief stricken Strago joins a cult, Setzer turns to drinking, and Cyan pioneers the concept of being an internet weirdo; but none of the boys seem to even consider the ol’ suicidal “widow” route), and, while you can make the excuse that Celes always had the support network of an army behind her (even if that army included a moogle), the fact that this all seems to be intentionally related to Locke… Well, it ain’t great.

Relm and Terra also don't consider suicide, and are in fact far more well-adjusted than those three men. Relm even has a proper job!

We as players had plenty of reason to suspect that we'd eventually reassemble the party, right some wrongs, and kick Kefka off his throne. From Celes' perspective, everyone she ever cared about has died, and so has everyone else. Even the monsters are dying! After Cid kicks the bucket, she has no reason to believe that anything good still exists in the world.

I wrote up a little thing that I posted on Facebook a while back (I don't remember when, and it wasn't very good anyway) musing on this game's themes and what G.K. Chesterton called "the virtue of hope".

Hope is the power of being cheerful in circumstances which we know to be desperate. It is true that there is a state of hope which belongs to bright prospects and the morning; but that is not the virtue of hope. The virtue of hope exists only in earthquake and, eclipse. ... For practical purposes it is at the hopeless moment that we require the hopeful man, and the virtue either does not exist at all, or begins to exist at that moment. Exactly at the instant when hope ceases to be reasonable it begins to be useful.

The hopeless moment is when Celes realises she's the last living person on an island of death and decay, and possibly in the entire world. Fortunately, she survives her suicide attempt, and finds evidence not just that Locke may still be alive, but also a reminder of kindness. Locke's kindness specifically, yes, but also just that kindness, though rare in her life previously, is sometimes a genuine human trait. It also suggests that the world as a whole may be less awful than her little slice of it.

Could we have started off as someone else on the Solitary Island? Could the evidence have been of some other party member? I suppose so, but it wouldn't have had resonance with the opera, and it wouldn't have connected to the game's other big theme (love). And then it would just be another character attempting suicide; Cid didn't because he had to watch over Celes, but he does say there had been other survivors and every one of them took a dive. It's explicitly a traumatic, desperate, (seemingly) hopeless situation, and I never thought Celes' decision was foolish or came from a place of womanly weakness.

 

[Mogri]

+1 to all of the above. Celes's decision to commit suicide had nothing to do with Locke. Her decision to live had a little to do with Locke, but more to do with the discovery that she was not alone in the world.

 

[Peklo]

It's a bullshit scene that exploits a suicide attempt by aestheticizing it and by juxtaposing it directly with the relevant character's earlier signature scene during the opera. Whatever the character motivations going into it are read as, it's extremely female-coded in how it's carried out and by whom; it never would've passed into the finished script should the subject have been a man in an equivalent scenario, with too much of its staging contingent on cultural ideas and depictions of how women take their own lives. The narrative is better off if it's never seen and Celes reigniting her hope for the future is carried out through the player's own actions in dedicating themselves to caring for Cid.

 

[Bongo]

It's true, they probably would not have depicted a masculine character as making a feminine suicide attempt. Is that the root of your disapproval?

The whole deserted island episode goes one of two ways: either the player tries and succeeds to save Cid, and through that success Celes is emboldened to seek other survivors; or the player tries and fails, and as a result Celes reaches the nadir of despair, until her hope is renewed by a sign that there are other survivors. Both paths to hope - hope that faltered or hope that never faltered - are reached through the player's actions.

 

[Purple]

It cannot be ignored that the whole thing is rather misogynistic (a grief stricken Strago joins a cult, Setzer turns to drinking, and Cyan pioneers the concept of being an internet weirdo; but none of the boys seem to even consider the ol’ suicidal “widow” route), and, while you can make the excuse that Celes always had the support network of an army behind her (even if that army included a moogle), the fact that this all seems to be intentionally related to Locke… Well, it ain’t great. Some more deft writing would have benefitted Celes, Cid, and Locke. More of an emphasis on how Celes distinctly regrets leaving things unsaid with Locke could have been a little more relatable than “where my man? I die now.”

This doesn't really strike me as a particularly fair read. Comparing how Celes reacts to things here to the rest of the cast is straight up unfair, because she's in a completely different situation. Everyone else landed in a still inhabited part of the world when stuff went down, and had to deal with all the chaos and fallout of that, while Celes is in a coma for a year then wakes up hearing "hey, this little island where all the animals are dying and the trees are living might be the only landmass left on the world, and there WERE some other survivors here but they all killed themselves already.

That's a lot to take in all at once, and enough for a lot of other people not to be able to take it even without being hit with the knowledge like a truck. Past that, she's got an established history of being depressed and alienated from everyone, with a lot of guilt about being a general in the empire that uh, literally destroyed the world and killed everyone here, and then the one person left at all, who was also one of the only people she had any connection with, see below, and kept her alive just died, and it was explicitly her fault. You can win the fish catching game, we can look at the alternate timeline here, he lives.

"I just killed the last person in the world, after helping kill everyone else" is kind of a lot, on top of a hopeless situation.

The rest of the cast... wouldn't be in this exact situation because none of them served the empire (well, Terra and Shadow you could make a weak case for), but I think the scene would work just as well (beyond losing the opera parallel setup) with most other characters instead. Terra, Locke, Cyan, Setzer would probably flip a coin on it every day or something, I could definitely see Setzer or Shadow here (look at them in the ending)... the twins maybe not. Sabin has a survivalist streak, Edgar'd at least have the optimism and techie drive to double check for survivors. Doesn't feel at all like a gendered thing to me though.

And as for muttering about Locke, in my experience, that's how it goes. When you're about to make an attempt you run down who could/would talk you out of it if only they were there.

Similarly, Cid and Celes had exactly one interaction together in all the World of Balance, and Cid’s position at the time was “Huh? Celes?” like a dog that thought they heard their owner outside (and it is the mailperson every time). While he hastily explains their shared past before shoving the party into a minecart, the actual “present” relationship between Cid and Celes is practically nonexistent before the world goes sideways. And, again, this might have been remarkable with more focused writing (Celes immediately adopting Cid as literal family could have a couple of different motivations, but the text is just basically “You’re my grandpa now!” like Celes is a toddler), but the reality of it is trite and arguably too shallow for such a potentially deep character and moment.

Keeping in mind that FF6 was released back in the day where space was at an absolute premium and every bit of the ROM was accounted for, there's a necessity to get as much as you can across in as few lines of dialog are possible. We do know that Celes was in this whole super soldier program, and that Cid is the guy who was running that, on top of them both being high ranking types, so it's not a huge leap to confirm later on through this interaction that this weirdo mad scientist was the closest thing she ever had to family. Especially when a SIGNIFICANT number of those precious lines are burned elsewhere establishing her general alienation and lack of meaningful connections with people. Plus for real, so far as either knows, they are the last two people still alive on the planet. That's a real bond strengthener/incentive towards acting like family.

 

[Kazin]

I was listening to the Retronauts episode mentioned in this post:

Recent Retronauts podcast had Nadia with Stephen and Andrew Vestal on to talk FF ROM hacks. All three of them used to be posters on the forum!

And it got me thinking about this thread, wherein a lot of the discussion is around a lot of the missing bits of the narrative that feel like they should be there (Sabin staying silent when he and Celes encounter "Gerad" being one that always stuck out obviously to me). So I downloaded and started up Final Fantasy VI: T Edition, which supposedly adds tons to the base game, including dialogue in the scene I mentioned above.

...not that I've gotten there yet! It's also a rebalance patch, because wow, FF6 is challenging again! And in a fair way, too, I would say. Encounters are dangerous, but it feels like that's mostly down to it being the super early game so far. I had to put Terra in the back row to beat Vargas (and Locke was dead pretty much the whole fight). It seems like enemies get all their turns, which they never really seemed to in the vanilla game - a lot of time would pass and they would just sit there while your team would get multiple turns in a row. There's been a few dialogue changes here and there, and they've changed the character sprites to match closely to the Amano artwork, which is cool but weird. They've also added music to the game too, though I haven't heard much of it yet.

So far, if you're a FF6 expert, I recommend it. I'll certainly post if it gets dumb, though!

 

[gogglebob]

I am averse to playing Final Fantasy 6 in a way that makes the game harder (because I am a wiener), but I'm very interested in hearing how it all goes.

 

[gogglebob]

Speaking of different ways to play Final Fantasy “3”… I thought I was done when I beat the game, but there is one last thing I want to talk about…

Back in the time of Final Fantasy 6, if you wanted more out of a videogame, you were pretty well stuck. Only very particular franchises had direct sequels, so even if you wanted more Super Mario Bros. 3 action, it was still very likely that that raccoon tail would be dropped for a dinosaur by the next adventure. The internet as we know it was still a few years away from allowing for endless online discussions, and DLC was an unknown acronym that could only marginally apply to errant echidnas. However, we did have one place to fill the void: books and magazines.

I have never seen an in-depth interview with a 90’s Nintendo Power or strategy guide writer, but I have always assumed that there was more at play in those publications than just “tips from the pros”. Yes, everyone has recounted eternally how they were videogame propaganda rags, and the fact that the worst licensed pap would still score in the higher percentiles seems to support this hypothesis. But these periodicals were written in the early days of gaming by people that had to be exposed to the most gaming content that had ever existed at that point in human history. They had to love it, right? They would not have lasted through seven seconds of reviewing Day Dreamin’ Davey otherwise! And they must have had the same desires as the players, too, right? A desperate need to get more out of the games they 100% enjoyed, even knowing full well that the next Final Fantasy would have nothing to do with their previous, beloved entry.

So here is something that I have to believe is a labor of love… Even if it is a mostly wrong labor of love…

I purchased this book when “Final Fantasy 3” was still fairly fresh. I never needed this book. I already owned multiple issues of Final Fantasy 3 Nintendo Power coverage, and the official Nintendo Power strategy guide for Final Fantasy 3. By the time this book was in my hands, I already knew every “real” trick, secret, and tip for Final Fantasy 3 (except maybe that it wasn’t actually titled Final Fantasy 3). This was a random Electronics Boutique purchase, and I know that because I still have part of the price tag on the back cover…

And, let me tell you, this had to look like a deal back in the day. Over 480 pages! The danged official guide was barely broader than a pencil, but this bad boy was thick enough to wallop a Pearl Dragon into next week! Just think of all the extra tips and tricks that must be in this complete guide not from the pros at Nintendo!

(This is the number one google result for “Final Fantasy 3 Thicc”)

And this was, of course, a giant trick. This guide is garbage, and, more often than not, factually incorrect. It is literally the opposite of helpful for any conceivable reason.

I also absolutely love and adore this book.

So allowing for inflation and my extremely limited allowance as a child, I’m pretty sure I paid a relative $10,000 for this guide. Let’s roast it so my 12-year-old self gets his money’s worth

(from here on out, click on any image to see a larger version)

First of all, we need to address whatever is happening here. According to our own fanboymaster, “Hayaku Kaku’s” signature characters above his name roughly translate to

""quickly written", or since they aren't really conjugated "quick write""

So, yes, I am 100% convinced this was a C.B. Cebulski - Akira Yoshida situation, and this is the work of a white guy pretending to be Japanese while writing about a Japanese game. Ol’ Kaku doesn’t have any other writing credits, so if someone else wants to prove me wrong here, have at it.

Going to

Spoiler: spoiler pop this from here on out...

spoiler pop this from here on out to reduce image scroll...

Note that this is the official unofficial Prima guide for Final Fantasy 3. Also, at this point, all images were provided by the internet archive. Previous pictures were taken on my library’s couch.

There is nothing I like more than an opening table of contents that makes this all sound appropriately epic. Historical Overview! The Watersheds of History! Play Mechanics!

If you are paying attention to the page numbers, you can figure out immediately where the bulk of this book’s bulk originates.

The authors of this book “have over 25 years of experience evaluating interactive entertainment”. In 1994, this just meant they could remember playing Pong. Also note that we are told that it would be “virtually impossible” to complete the quest without the knowledge found in this book. So anyone that is only hearing about Complete Final Fantasy III Forbidden Game Secrets for the first time, how did you do it, you genius!?

This is an elaborate way of introducing the world of Final Fantasy 6, but it is at least accurate. Remember that this is Page 3 of this book before we get to a later point where it is completely contradicted.

This guide uses the weird tactic of describing all the locations in the game in order, but not yet providing an actual walkthrough. It is basically an overview of the game with the loosest explanations possible. It… is pretty alright, actually. It is here to fill up page space, but I appreciate the summaries.

I was approximately twelve when I read this guide, so suffice to say I did not understand references to “the Medici of early Europe”. Someone assumed a reader would need help getting through the first hour of Final Fantasy 6, but knew details of the Renaissance.

I mentioned earlier in my Final Fantasy 6 essays that this game is just loose enough that an active imagination could fill in the blanks and make even the most “we should probably put a dungeon at this point in the plot” location like Mt. Koltz an important part of the greater story of this world. Kaku apparently agrees, and fills some page space by describing Mt. Koltz as a sort of spiritual Mecca.

Cyan swore fealty to Samurai Masters… who must appear in some other game.

Aw, I distinctly remember looking up the concept of “liver spots” thanks to this passage on the Ghost Train/Phantom Forest.
Also: Baren Falls is “a one-way trip to Hell”. Gau should be offended!

Aw, yeah, here’s the entire reason I will always remember this book.

This history of the world was seemingly created whole cloth. I have found no source for all of this nonsense, and was theoretically an invention of this book from start to finish. I do not believe these time spans are based on anything, whether they be parallel “real world events” or just some nonsense from a Star Wars novel. Even some of the specific things, like Figaro using “machines” 84 years before the game, seem to be contradicted by the actual events of the game (isn’t the whole point of the first Figaro sequence that the empire/Kefka is surprised by their mechanical prowess?). Stuff like Kefka inventing Magitek is also downright bonkers.

Regardless, I cannot get mad, because being reminded that this “world” existed for a thousand years before the actual game started always set my own imagination ablaze…

Kefka is identified as the main threat from jump street here. I mean, he is, but spoilers, guys.

There is no such status effect as “cursed”. Given “echo screen” is supposed to cure it, it looks like you guys couldn’t figure out “mute”. Doesn’t matter, you don’t explain what status effects do anyway…

Here would likely be a good place to note that, as a connoisseur of strategy guides of the 90’s (or just someone that would do anything to complete The Seventh Guest), I know exactly what happened here: This is a strategy guide for a 16-bit “console” videogame being written by an author who traditionally writes guides for Western “PC” style videogames. References to Wizardry and Ultima give it away. In fact, the start of this page all but assumes you are coming over to Final Fantasy 3 from, like, The Incredible Machine. Thomas Covenant! Betrayal at Krondor! Bastard Swords! Get excited for treasure!

Mentions of Dragon Warrior or Final Fantasy 2 are completely absent.

Various “intricate” mechanics are described on the following pages, which basically works out to explanations of the individual character abilities. I am featuring this page because Nintendo Power rarely made Metallica or Doom II references. Or, for that matter, to the concept of “sass”.

Well that’s an ominous title for a map.

These maps were all hand (mouse) drawn in 1990s AutoCad, right? I want to state plainly again that this book is often wrong, but I love the effort that went into it.

Okay, I checked the SNES instruction manual, and, after that sacred object nearly put me in a nostalgia coma, I realized that all this “stat information” does not appear in that book. And, as has been discussed here before, ages, blood type, and alike does not actually appear in the game either. However, the information here is correct, insomuch as it can be found in the official Final Fantasy Ultimania books… albeit with a slightly skewed translation. For instance, the Ultimania notes that Celes likes “antique picture books”, while you can see “Old books and pictures” listed here. Similarly, officially Celes hates “weak men”, but that is recorded as “rowdy males” here…

My point? It appears this “unofficial guide” had access to some official sources. Still got the mechanics of Runic completely wrong, though.

But over and over again, it seems like everything else comes exclusively from the SNES game, and specifically “that” translation. There is no way “blow fish”, which is Cactuar’s 1,000 Needles everywhere else in the franchise, would make reference to fish in the Ultimania. Lore “Reflect” is 100% wrong.

Gogo listed on the same level as Banon is an insult to Mimics everywhere.

Let’s get Shakespeare all up in here! You get an English degree, and you use it.

Here is what I was alluding to earlier: despite the history of Final Fantasy 3 being mostly correct on Page 3 of the book, here The War of Magi that occurred centuries before the game is conflated with the meeting of Terra’s parents, which happened (at most) 20 years back. Additionally, Kefka could be interpreted as someone with the power of the “mechanized fist” of the Empire, but he certainly doesn’t already have “Magicite Statues” in his “fortress”. Bro doesn’t even seem to have his own apartment in Vector! And then this half wrong recounting of half the plot segues into “here’s how Espers work”.

It's weird, y’all.

So now we get a rundown of all the Espers and their attendant spells and learn rates. No, this section does not ever tell you where to find all of these Espers.

The permanent switch from Odin to Raiden is noted here, but it ignores that Crusader can teach meteor, too. Which is odd, considering Crusader is properly listed as the next esper!

Pearl. Hehe.

Come to think of it, I do not believe I have ever been poisoned in Final Fantasy 3 after Mt. Koltz.

Does anyone know if these “three times” and “seven times” calculations are correct for the spell progressions? They are repeated for the Elemental 1/2/3 descriptions as well.

Does that imp look like a zombie to you!?

On seemingly only this page, there are references to “classes”. Most items apparently cure all classes, but Echo Screen only works for “fighters”. They had a chance to make this relevant with the Shadow/ninja-based items, but whiffed it.

Petrifaction. Microsoft Word claims that is a synonym for Petrification.

That is not how Cherub Down works. That is not how the Cure Ring works. That is not how the Dragon Horn works.

Expecting the Relic Ring to work like that will get you killed. Or… double killed?

We get pages of information on equipment. Occasionally, the descriptions of the items are fun.

I’m trying to remember if “Minerba Vische” is a Woolsey-ism or complete nonsense.

By volume, the majority of this book is the least useful bestiary ever to appear in print. Maybe 1.4 monsters per page, barely any pictures, and no information on where you actually encounter these creatures. And, given how the rest of the book works, there is no way anyone has ever proofed this information for exactitude. Before or after publishing. Who would have the time?

The bosses are listed in alphabetical order. This is violence.

Kefka walloping your party, you hastily flipping to the boss section, always seeing “Air Force (Laser Gun)” first while your HP dwindles down to nothing... Be glad you never have to fight Zoneseek! ... Until World of Final Fantasy, at least.

This screenshot gives me secondhand anxiety.

As you have probably guessed, Kefka's angel form and Tower of Power is listed under “F” for “The Final Boss”. The full description for the boss is marginally valuable (yes, tools are useful), but the whole “face the adventure of a lifetime” denouement seems to imply this section would have once reasonably listed the bosses in plot-order. But here, we just go from “the absolute end” to “that fire boss”.

This strategy for Magi Master is more or less suicidal.

“At this point, however, our data become more general.” Book write hard, tired now.

If you learn one thing from this guide, it is that you must rotate the egg.

The general guide tips are actually pretty helpful. I appreciate any tip that derides hording and encourages spending that gold.

This section goes all in on the maps that I simultaneously find impressive in their craft, but wholly useless in their functionality. At least label the entrances and exits!

Yes. Bruins. Good.

One of the most iconic scenes for an entire hardware generation is described as a “critical timing puzzle”.

My brother in Christ, did you think Lonewolf was somehow two wolves? Did one of the two wolves inside of you tell you this?

Do you mean “transparent points” like there would be a counter on the screen, but it is see-through? Because any other interpretation of that phrase is absolutely inapplicable.

That said, I think the answers to the dinner questions are correct here. Small miracle, considering Gestahl is repeatedly referred to as “the king”.

The death of General Leo gets a sentence. Ha.

Anti-Shadow bias detected.

“Cid dies, Celes is inconsolable.” Guess that’s canon.

Just because something sucks does not mean it is a “vacuum-like creature”.

These are the only maps of Kefka’s Tower available in the book. They are easily the most ineffective maps ever created.

You said I could live without Shadow earlier, and now he’s part of the final party recommendation!?

I had to stare at the list for a while to work out that this writer’s two “leave behinds” are Gau and Cyan. Those would be my picks on the SNES version, but Pixel Remaster does improve Cyan a tweak.

A handy-dandy index is included to navigate that page count and increase the page count further.

You think this got everything wrong? Write your own damn strategy guide!

And that’s about it. I never purchased either of those guides, but they’re “Official” and “Authorized”. I only buy renegade strategy guides now.

In lieu of filling out this survey, I have decided to complain on the internet. I wonder if Question #4 was there so they could petition Square for greater access to Terra’s blood type.

Question #8 being on a scale but still phrased as “covers most of what I need” amuses me.

It is its own envelope! Neat!

Do you reckon you can beat Final Fantasy 3 now? Because I feel like this guide has bimbofied me to the point that I might be able to approach the game with fresh eyes. Let’s see if I can clear Final Fantasy 6 Pixel Remaster again… Or just use it as an excuse to stall before playing Final Fantasy 2 Pixel Remaster…

 

[Kirin]

I’m in a rush and haven’t read your spoilerpop yet but jwts: I am not 100% certain whether or not I own this book (would have to dig through a lot of stacked boxes to be sure), but I very much recognize the cover and have definitely held it in my hands at some point in time. So, random uselsss game artifact bro-knux, I guess.

 

[gorha]

This book is fascinating.

All the screenshots are lacking text, which I suspect is because they're taken from the Japanese version of the game, but they use some English SNES version names, like the Pearl spell instead of Holy. It's applied inconsistently, though; the item that restores 250 HP is (correctly) called Potion in the list of items, but "High Potion" in the Blackjack's shop. Our Blue Magic user is called Strago in the table of contents, but Stragos when listed as a wearer of the Light Robe and "Magic Leader's Robe", which itself is called Tao Robe in the SNES version. As for "Minerba Vische" on that page, it looks like an attempt at transliterating the katakana for Minerva Bustier gone wrong. Woolsey's not to blame, in any case, as he just called it Minerva.

Checking against more reliable sources like the Fandom wiki and the (sadly a bit broken nowadays) FF6 Encyclopedia, it looks like the defense values they give are correct, though! But they neglected to list Relm among the possible wearers of those two robes. And some of the stats for enemies are wrong, but some others that would be hard or impossible to determine in-game are right. How do you know Chadarnook has exactly 61 speed when you can't see enemy ATB gauges? How do you know the Air Force's laser gun has 12 attack power when it never uses a physical attack? You don't, unless you hack the game, or read a guide by someone with access to the game's data - that is, an official guide.

And if the character profiles in this book have information taken from the Ultimania, I'm guessing they imported the game and that guide, translated bits of both, making mistakes in both translation and transcription along the way, wrote their tips based on a playthrough of the game in a language they only kind of understood, then tried to update the names of items, spells and characters when the English version came out, but couldn't catch all of them before they had to send the book off to be printed while the game was still relevant. And yeah, the whole thing has the energy of writing by and for PC gamers in their 20s, about a game marketed to teens and tweens.

 

[Mogri]

"Do plenty of fighting, especially after the world ends." Words to live by.

I would have eaten this up as a kid. I would have taken it as gospel, and it would have taken me far too long to realize how wrong it was. Makes me wish I'd had a copy.

On seemingly only this page, there are references to “classes”. Most items apparently cure all classes, but Echo Screen only works for “fighters”.

I think you're reading too much into this. He's referring to the player characters as fighters, which is pretty accurate given how much time they'll spend doing just that.

 

[ghosttaster]

I got the Pixel Remaster of this game and have been blowing through it here and there... God bless the QoL additions. No more grind! That's like- 2/3 of what I spent my time doing as a kid.

 

[Daikaiju]

"You know nothing, Jon Snow Coyote"