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Mash A to Win - Let's Play Golden Sun Dark Dawn

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  #31  
Old 09-08-2011, 01:56 PM
Chu Chu is offline
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Somehow I managed to enjoy Dark Dawn. I think it was because I like its presentation (graphics and sound) and also because I had fun complaining about all the stupid crap with my friends. The game's story is in dire need of an editor. For example, who the hell cares about Himi, and why did she join your party so suddenly? She feels like an afterthought.

My name is Chu and I'm going to buy Dark Dawn's inevitable sequel despite everything. help me
  #32  
Old 09-08-2011, 02:01 PM
Refa Refa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bongo Bill View Post
A game that says "Basic reading ability is needed to fully enjoy this game" on the back cover has clearly embraced its destiny of being children's introduction to the genre, and, as such, predictably prioritizes explanation over convenience. So while it's annoying, at least it's annoying For The Children.
You know the FF remakes for the GBA said that, right?
  #33  
Old 09-08-2011, 02:22 PM
Kalir Kalir is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chu View Post
Somehow I managed to enjoy Dark Dawn. I think it was because I like its presentation (graphics and sound) and also because I had fun complaining about all the stupid crap with my friends. The game's story is in dire need of an editor. For example, who the hell cares about that one chick, and why did she try to bum a ride off of Eoleo so suddenly? She feels like an afterthought.

My name is Chu and I'm going to buy Dark Dawn's inevitable sequel despite everything. help me
You're not alone.

Also I like to think that basic reading warning is just them making a jab at everyone complaining about the script's length. Which, yes, they should edit, but it could be worse (i.e. a Tales game).
  #34  
Old 09-08-2011, 02:36 PM
Alpha Werewolf Alpha Werewolf is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BlitzBlast View Post


And then this picture pops up, inspiring quite a bit of shipping related debate no doubt.
IVAN x KRADEN FOR LIFE
  #35  
Old 09-08-2011, 04:45 PM
Refa Refa is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalir View Post
You're not alone.

Also I like to think that basic reading warning is just them making a jab at everyone complaining about the script's length. Which, yes, they should edit, but it could be worse (i.e. a Tales game).
Um, no, actually it already is worse than a Tales game.
  #36  
Old 09-08-2011, 04:59 PM
Mightyblue Mightyblue is offline
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Yeah, most Tales games give you the option of skipping tutorials or at least beating them quickly and then moving on. I think Abyss is the only one with a mandatory combat tutorial simply because it was the first game to implement the improved 3D combat engine.
  #37  
Old 09-10-2011, 02:24 AM
Chu Chu is offline
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The only Tales game I've played is Symphonia, and I liked the extra dialogue the characters had with each other. For one thing, the characters actually had interesting things to say to each other and sometimes it was actually pretty funny! For another, a lot of it was optional.

These chumps, though? Most of their dialogue is pointless crap. They just keep repeating themselves.
Protagonist 2: Yeah, I know, right? It's like a broken record!
Protagonist 3: I agree. So repetitive.
Protagonist 4: Is it really necessary to keep repeating everything like that?
Protagonist 5: Over and over again...

You get the idea. I have no idea how any of the other Tales games are, though. I imagine it could only be worse if the characters were despicable and chatty rather than just boring and chatty, though.
  #38  
Old 09-10-2011, 11:32 AM
Kalir Kalir is offline
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Well, I disliked just about every character in Symphonia and found just about every cutscene to be "oh hey, what personality trait are they going to beat me over the head with now? Hey, maybe Colette will apologize again!"

Also you can skip the tutorials, yes, but the game also pulls things like putting a boss battle, and then immediately after without a break in between (except for cutscenes), two more boss battles you are intended to lose.

Golden Sun never did anything like that, and I prefer its story and characters to that of Tales games, drawn-out though they are. So I guess I'm not going to be hanging out in this thread for very long, am I?
  #39  
Old 09-10-2011, 05:22 PM
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All of that work preparing for that midterm, and it ends up being piss easy. My APUSH teacher is either fucking with us, or luring us into a sense of false security.

In any case, there’s been some discussion on the length of this game’s script, so for this update (and hopefully this update alone) I’ll be posting the full script. I’ll also be bolding the only parts worth mentioning, if you don’t want to read through all of it.



Karis: Please, Tyrell!
Isaac: *sad face* Tyrell has been drained of his Psynergy. Adepts need help recovering from such trauma.
*Isaac and Garet nod at each other*



*Tyrell opens his eyes, causing everyone to smiley face*



Tyrell: Ohhhh! And I was having such nice dreams…!
Garet: What?! You oaf! Is that the thanks we get? We were worried about you!
Tyrell: Worried? Oh, yeah… Now I remember… I crashed the Soarwing… The wing broke…
Garet: *angry face* It broke? More like you broke IT!

Karis: *sad face* We were sick with worry, Tyrell.
Matthew: *smiley face* (This was an emoticon option)
Tyrell: Glad to see me? You’re a good friend, Matthew.
*Garet, Tyrell, Matthew, and Karis super smiley face*
Isaac: *stern face* We’re all glad to see you safe, Tyrell.
*Matthew question marks, Garet exclamation marks, and Tyrell has another smiley face*
Isaac: *sighing face* We should be thankful you made it through all this without serious injury. Or it would have delayed the start of your trip.
*Tyrell, Matthew, and Karis turn to each other. Tyrell sweats. Garet looks at them and sad faces*
Tyrell: My trip? What trip?
*Garet sad faces again*
Isaac: We have to get the soarwing in working order as soon as possible. You’re going to help us fix it.
*Matthew, Karis, and Tyrell sweat*
Garet: *reluctant face* As much as I would like to shelter you, Tyrell, you’ve just gone too far this time…
*Tyrell sad faces*
Karis: *angry face* My father put some very rare resources into building that soarwing for Isaac and Garet.
Isaac: *reluctant face* We can make most of the repairs ourselves. But we lack a major material to fix it fully.
*Karis approaches Matthew for some reason and angry faces*
Karis: The rare material comes from the feathers of a very… unusual bird.
*Matthew and Tyrell sweat. Karis stern faces, Isaac and Garet… I don‘t even know what to call the emoticon they use, stare face?*




Karis isn’t kidding when she says they just need one feather. I have no idea how that makes sense, though.

Karis: Way off at the far side of the country of Morgal, in fact.
*Matthew and Tyrell question mark*
Isaac: The trip will be difficult. But first we need to get you rested up at the cabin, all right?
*Everybody nods*




I wanted to show this bridge. It leads to the upper ledge Tyrell crashed on, so obviously he took this path. There are feathers here, so apparently Tyrell just took a bunch of feathers with him up to this point for some reason.



*Matthew, Karis, Tyrell, and Garet nod.*



Fuck Tyrell so much.



Remember that long scene where Isaac and Garet just explained this? This game assumes you don’t.

*Karis angry faces*
Isaac: I’m shocked, Karis. It’s not like you to get so riled up.
Karis: *angry face* Look- I want to see my father’s soarwing fixed just as much as you do.
*Matthew and Tyrell sweat, Karis approaches Isaac*
Karis: But you need that Mountain Roc feather, and you sere saying how hard it was getting the last one!
*Isaac “…”s*




That doesn’t sound bad to me.

*Karis nods*
Isaac: *nods* Our quest for the Mountain Roc feather was long and hard, given how radically Angara has changed.
*Karis sad faces*
Isaac: *shakes head* But we need that soarwing fixed. Since Garet and I have to stay here and monitor Mount Aleph, that leaves only the boys to fetch that feather for us.
*Karis looks at Matthew and Tyrell for a second*
Isaac: You know how hard we’re working with your father to study the aftereffects of the Golden Sun.




Bullshit. It’s been 30 years since The Lost Age and Matthew and the rest of his generation are only about 17 at this point. Isaac and co had 13 years to get this done, and they apparently sat around twiddling their thumbs.

*Karis crying faces, then sweats, then walks back to Matthew and Tyrell*



Have you ever considered just walking over there?

Garet: *sad face* I can’t believe that my own son would risk the soarwing. It’s about time he got straightened out. And a tough quest for the feather is just the thing to do it.
Isaac: *”…” bubble* But Tyrell can’t do it alone, so I’m sending Matthew with him. They’re practically brothers.
Garet: *sad face* Sorry you got dragged into all of this, Matthew. Are you looking forward to setting off with Tyrell?
Matthew: *nods* (A yes/no choice. I just wanted to start the main quest already.)
Garet: You’ll never forget your first quest! But don’t forget to keep an eye on Tyrell, OK?
Isaac: Garet, we shouldn’t delay them any further. The boys need to leave immediately.
Karis: What? Just like that? So soon?
Isaac: Our first quest began just as suddenly, Karis.


Not really, considering the first thing you did after your quest started was to do a sidequest.

Actually, I should probably mention that. Golden Sun’s heroes always have a main task they’re shooting for, and they almost always ignore it for the majority of the game in favor of helping out random people.

*Isaac and Garet “…” bubble*
Isaac: Thirty years ago, we were catapulted into action when we met Kraden. His study of Alchemy changed out lives.
Garet: Good ol’ Kraden. Hey, didn’t our friend the Alchemist say he would pay us a visit soon?
Isaac: Hm… so he did.
*Garet “…” bubbles, then Isaac light bulbs*
Garet: Er, Isaac? Oh boy, I know THAT look… You’re hatching a plan.
Isaac: *stern face* Kraden’s just the thing…
Garet: *sweats* Out with it, Isaac.




I have no idea why Matthew is confused here. He was raised by Isaac, so there’s no reason he shouldn’t recognize his father’s moods. Karis suddenly staring at Matthew isn’t odd, though.

*Matthew nods at Karis, then Tyrell*
Isaac: Kraden might be willing to help the boys out with this.
Garet: *sweats* Yeah, I think the boys would benefit from Kraden’s help.

*Matthew and Karis question mark. Tyrell light bulbs*




DAMN YOU TYRELL DON’T GIVE THEM MORE THINGS TO EXPOSIT ABOUT.

Garet: *sweats* Sure, he’s old as the hills, but have some respect for Kraden.
Karis: *turns to Tyrell* He was that old scholar who helped you all those years ago!
Isaac: *turns around and “…” bubbles* Yes, Kraden helped us when we were young warriors, so I bet he’d even enjoy helping out our children.
*Matthew, Karis and Tyrell exclamation mark*
Garet: *turns to Isaac and reluctant faces* You sure he’s up to the task?
Isaac: *”…” bubbles* Why wouldn’t he be?
*Matthew, Karis and Tyrell exclamation mark again*
Garet: I mean, Kraden IS getting up there in years, Isaac. It’s been three decades since he helped us.
*Matthew, Karis and Tyrell sweat*
Isaac: *stare face* Sure it’s been 30 years since that quest ended, but we’ve hardly aged. I’m sure Kraden’s the same.


I wasn’t kidding back in the first update when I said that the light of Mars Lighthouse (or, more likely, the fragment of the Golden Sun trapped inside the Mars Star) made the heroes immortal.

Karis: *exclamation mark* It‘s the same with my father. He says he looks a smidge older than back then- but not much!
*Matthew and Tyrell turn to Karis and question mark, because they apparently have never noticed their fathers never aging at all*
Garet: Ivan believes that those of us directly exposed to the power of the Golden Sun have aged very little.


This is all somewhat odd. Back in The Lost Age, Felix’s group (and maybe Isaac’s) reached Lemuria, a place with a fountain that gave eternal life. Having the Golden Sun do that too implies that Lemuria’s fountain is just as Psynergetically charged, which doesn’t make any sense considering it kept on going even after Alchemy was sealed.

This game introduces a bunch of new ideas. Expect very little of them to make sense.

Karis: *sweats*



The implications of this sentence are twofold. First, Karis has apparently also never questioned her father never growing older. Second, you’d think that something like parents outlasting their children would lead to some angst and frustration. It doesn’t because this specific topic never comes up again after this scene if I recall correctly.

That’s another thing about Golden Sun. A lot of interesting details are occasionally dropped during cutscenes, and almost none are ever expanded upon.

Karis: *sad faces* Hmm. You know what? I want in on this quest! I’m going with Matthew and Tyrell!
Garet: *shakes head* Don’t be ridiculous, Karis. You don’t know the first thing about adventuring!


First off, she went through that tutorial with Matthew too. Second, Karis’ home is Kalay, which is… what, across the continent? At the very least it’s a long journey from the Lookout Cabin to Kalay, and Karis has been making that trip for quite a while.

Isaac: Garet, stop. She’s a Wind Adept, and her powers will help.



Garet: Fess up, Isaac. You had this planned all along, didn’t you?
Isaac: We mustn’t waste another minute. I’ll contact Kraden while the kids pack.
Tyrell: Seriously?! We’re really leaving THAT soon?
*Isaac nods and the kids… surprise face, I guess*
Karis: Talk about pushing us out of the nest! *angry face* But we know nothing about going so far away! Where did you say that feather was? Somewhere in Morgal?
*Matthew and Tyrell turn to each other and nod*
Isaac: This isn’t a vacation. It’s a quest into the unknown. So the sooner you begin, the sooner you’ll find your way.
Karis: *sweats* What?! You mean you’re sending us off to meet your friend Kraden and giving us NO more details?


Like I said, Isaac is kind of a dick.

Isaac: *reluctant faces* Kraden is a genius when it comes to charting a course into the unknown. You’ll be in excellent hands. I think I should arrange to have you all meet in Carver’s Camp. That’s not so far away. Kraden recently sent one of his carrier pigeons to the cabin… I’ll send it back to him with my request.
*Isaac nods and exits the cabin*
Karis: Why can’t we just wait here? Didn’t that carrier pigeon bring word he was coming? You can’t just send us on our way like this!
*Matthew and Tyrell sweat*
Karis: I mean, it’s getting dark outside!


What are you talking about, it’s always sunset at Lookout Cabin.

Garet: He’s made up his mind that it’s time for you to grow into warriors. He needs your help. Besides, Isaac is consumed by concern about what’s going on out there. We need that soarwing fixed.
*Karis sad faces*
Tyrell: *sad face* If you ask me, it sounds like Isaac needs to fly that soarwing to Sol Sanctum on Mount Aleph.


I’m pretty sure that “needs” should have been capitalized to emphasize that Tyrell thinks Isaac is a little loopy, but as it is now it makes him look like a complete moron who never paid attention to his parents’ words at all. Which is somewhat accurate, actually.

*Karis, Matthew, and Garet sigh face*
Tyrell: The mountain has been erupting for a long time, so there’s only one way there- by air.


First off, we already know this. Second, how the hell does that make sense? The volcano erupting, and you want to fly at it rather than just walk over and use your mastery over earth and fire to protect yourselves?

THIS GAME.

*Matthew and Karis exclamation mark*
Karis: *shakes head* He can’t get to Sol Sanctum until the soarwing is fixed.


WE GET IT. THE SOARWING IS BROKEN AND THAT IS A BAD THING. STOP REPEATING YOURSELVES.

Tyrell: I think he needs to return to where THEIR quest began.
*Karis sigh faces, looks at Matthew (who sweats), then smiley faces*
Karis: It must be serious. That’s not the kind of place you can just go to for old time’s sake…
*Tyrell smiley faces, then walks to the window next to his father*
Tyrell: Well… I guess we won’t be seeing this place for a while.
Karis: This will be our first trip away from here. Take a long look. You never know when we’ll be back home.


what are you even talking about karis you don’t live here

*Tyrell shakes his head and walks over to Matthew, who sad faces*
Garet: *smiley face* When I left Vale, I was just 17. My life was never the same. Think you’re ready for all this?
Matthew: *overjoyed face* (another emoticon choice)
Tyrell: I’m with Matthew! We’re so completely ready for this!
Karis: *overjoyed face* Well, I know I’m ready to start this quest too. So how about we get going?
Matthew: *nods* (unnecessary yes/no option that gives the illusion of choice)
Tyrell: *nods* Right! Let’s go get that Mountain Roc feather!
*Matthew, Tyrell, and Karis nod*
Karis: It’s like we were fated to go on this quest! So I think we’ll be off soon, Garet!
Garet: *sad face* It’s good to start a journey looking forward to the adventure ahead. Now go get ready.
*Matthew, Karis, Tyrell and Garet nod. The kids then leave the room*


And with that, I’m going to stop transcribing the text. FYI, this first post was seven pages in Word.
  #40  
Old 09-10-2011, 05:24 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Paralleling his mother, Isaac does not show up to say farewell to his son. Dora had the excuse of possibly being ashamed, though, so this is just Isaac being a dick.



Matthew’s all sad and everything.



ahahaha you are so wrong karis



Garet’s farewell to his son is a little dragged out, but I can’t begrudge him.



Meanwhile, Isaac shows that he cares about birds more than his son.



WHO WILL REACH THEIR DESTINATION FIRST?

(hint: the bird)



Anyways, Tyrell. Like Matthew, he’s pretty much a clone of his father.



After Matthew leaves Goma Plateau, Flint appears in a cutscene and joins the party as the first Djinni.

Flint boosts HP by 9 and Attack and PP by 4. Using him in battle results in a 160% power normal attack.



I put him on Karis to give her Bolt, which is a low cost 20 power attack learned at level 2 by Seers. Even at level 3, Karis can throw out 11.



Patcher’s Place is a little outpost on the way to Carver’s Camp. It’s where many of the inhabitants of Vale went to after the village was destroyed.



It’s also the location of the Psynergy Training Ground, the game’s first sidequest. In order to get a pass to go further on in the game, Matthew and co. have to clear all four areas of the Training Ground.

The Training Ground, incidentally, is essentially a summary of the non-important parts of the first two games with some important stuff tacked on at the end of every area.



Finally, as the name implies the main feature of Patcher’s Place is Patcher’s shop. Tyrell and Patcher are on bad terms because this one time Tyrell almost burned the whole place down.



Nope.



In fact, Tyrell almost does it again. Like I said, fuck up.



Karis just shoves Tyrell to the ground to get him to stop.
  #41  
Old 09-10-2011, 05:25 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Another interesting line that implies there is some public prejudice against Adepts. This actually shows up again much later, but until then it’s just dropped like every other thing of interest.

Incidentally, Karis is crying false tears the entire time she rants at Tyrell. Or maybe it’s real, but it’s hard to tell when she immediately changes to being happy once Tyrell agrees with her.



Patcher, who decides to not let his bias against Tyrell drag down his perception of Matthew and Karis, gives a tutorial on how to buy things at a shop. I am not kidding you.



More importantly, the chest right behind the desk holds a Power Bread. This is a stat boost item for HP.



The rule of thumb for stat boost items is to pile them all on the main character. Their boosts aren’t significant enough to be noticed if you spread them around, and at the end of the game stats don’t mean a damn thing so you might as well get one character with really big numbers. And since the main character always gets a super weapon at the end of the game…



Another Golden Sun gimmick is that just about every stove has its own individual description about what’s cooking.



There is a Mars Djinni just sitting around.



To get it, you have to go the Training Grounds, push some blocks around, then jump from the central tree to the cliffs on the right.



There’s a seedling there to turn into a downwards vine.



Forge increases HP by 11, Attack and Luck by 2, and Agility by 1. When used in battle, it buffs the party’s attack by 25%. It’s honestly better off on Karis since she can use it immediately, but I stuck it on Tyrell because why not.



Anyways, the training grounds. Each course has a time limit and a series of obstacles to get past using Move, Growth, Whirlwind, or Fireball. It’s a boring waste of time.



There’s also a bunch of flavor text describing completely random sidequests the heroes of the first two games did. Tret was a living tree who went insane and started turning humans into trees, so Isaac and co. beat the insanity out of him then cured him with magical water from Mercury Lighthouse.



Speaking of lighthouses, each area ends with a mock version of one of them with one/two of the Proxians at the top. The Proxians were, as the name implies, warriors from Prox. The first two, Saturos and Menardi, sought to unseal Alchemy to save Prox. They were total dicks about it so Isaac and co killed them. The other two, Karst and Agatio, wanted revenge for Menardi’s death and glory for Prox respectively. They were also dicks and got killed by Felix and co (who they needlessly antagonized despite being on the same side).

They were dicks, so it’s not bad to see them being vilified here, but you’d think one of the Warriors of Vale would mention that they were also trying to save the world.



On the way to Venus Lighthouse, Isaac had to take a ship across the Karagol Sea because he was too much of a wuss to try climbing over a few boulders. The ship was attacked by a Kraken for some reason, so Isaac and co killed it.



Felix and co spent most of their game just dicking around Weyard, so there’s a lot of random stuff they went through. One of them was this tribe of not-Africans who were praying to this ancient machinery statue that turned out to be sentient.



Oh, and they spent like a third of the game acquiring the Trident of Ankohl so they could kill Poseidon, enter Lemuria, learn some stuff they should have already known, and conveniently get an item that let them into the western part of Weyard.
  #42  
Old 09-10-2011, 05:27 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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This puzzle is stupid. To make Poseidon’s cardboard cut-out open to getting hit by Fireball, you need to move three pillars. These pillars can only be reached by jumping across very, very, very slow floating boxes who move in the most inefficient paths ever. Seriously, this puzzle will take about two minutes even if you go as fast as possible.

Anyways, remember how the final boss of The Lost Age was a dragon composed out of Isaac’s dad and Jenna and Felix’s parents? That must have been a very traumatizing event for all parties involved, and it’s probably something none of the Warriors of Vale would mention out of respect for Isaac, Felix, and Jenna.



So of course the final boss of the Training Grounds is a cardboard mock-up of the Doom Dragon. You’d think Isaac would do something about it, but you know how he is.



The strategy here is simple. Matthew is going to spam attack, Karis is going to spam Bolt, and Tyrell is going to alternate between attacking and unleashing Forge.



For some odd reason, Dim Dragon is capable of inflicting Death Curse. Death Curse gives its target about eight turns to either heal themselves or finish the battle, and once time runs out they die.



Buffs wear off after a few turns, but if you use another buff before the first buff runs out, the counter will reset.



Dim Dragon can actually deal damage, but Matthew’s got a bunch of herbs (recovers ~50 HP) so he’ll be fine.



Occasionally, Dim Dragon will break down and do nothing for two turns. This makes an easy boss easier.



This entire battle only took eight turns.



More levels. Matthew and Tyrell reach level 5, and Karis makes it to level 4.



It doesn’t matter which one you pick,



you’ll always get the gate card. If you choose to go through the Testing Grounds again (only this time under much stricter time limits), you can get the other chest, which just holds a Water of Life. I don’t know why anyone would ever do something like that, though; this entire “dungeon” is just a massive piss off.

Next time: Golden Sun plot is stupid.

Last edited by BlitzBlast; 09-10-2011 at 06:32 PM.
  #43  
Old 09-10-2011, 05:53 PM
Albatoss Albatoss is offline
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Holy fuck, that is a wordy script. It's even worse than The Lost Age.
  #44  
Old 09-10-2011, 06:02 PM
Kala Kala is offline
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Man, I'd forgotten just how wordy this series really is... Not to mention half of the stupid stuff you had to do. Thanks for the refresher course.

...Ugh.
  #45  
Old 09-13-2011, 03:51 AM
Chu Chu is offline
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so much meaningless text and emoticons

Anyway, I heard from a good source that the exchange between Karis and Tyrell was different in the Japanese version of the game. Originally she had made a remark that Tyrell is a rude, unthinking asshole because his mom died and couldn't teach him better. Then she felt bad about saying that and became upset. Apparently the ESRB made them change that because... I think it implied that single fathers always make poor parents? Food for thought, anyway.

Not that it really matters because a happy little after that tiny, forgettable dump of character/world-building (depending on the script) ruins the mood either way.
  #46  
Old 09-13-2011, 04:25 AM
Mightyblue Mightyblue is offline
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Uh, yeah, way wordier than Tales. Waaaaaay wordier than Tales.
  #47  
Old 09-13-2011, 01:55 PM
Raven Raven is offline
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Emoticons should really be banned from all kinds of video games. Or talky JRPG, at least.

  #48  
Old 09-13-2011, 02:42 PM
Elfir Elfir is offline
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Pretty much anything but .hack and other "we know we're in a game" games. Like Star Ocean 3!
  #49  
Old 09-13-2011, 10:31 PM
Feynman Feynman is offline
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Avoiding the more negative topics of Dark Dawn's awful script and how laughably easy the battles are, I have to say I like the blurring effect used in combat. It makes screenshots look kind of ugly, but in motion it's pretty awesome.
  #50  
Old 09-14-2011, 03:23 AM
Chu Chu is offline
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Oh yeah, the production value of this game is great. It looks and sounds beautiful! I particularly like this battle theme: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n64Qg6NeSMU I love the way the song sounds around the 0:40 mark, especially when using a summon.
  #51  
Old 09-14-2011, 10:21 PM
Karzac Karzac is offline
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Hey, I liked the training grounds. I thought the puzzles were fun. And while it does trivialize the previous games' events, I didn't actually remember any of the stuff you mentioned, so it didn't matter to me.

But yeah, I mostly enjoyed this game despite it- and myself. I was wordy, stupidly easy, with a trite plot and boring fetch quests. But somehow I still had fun.

I probably won't buy the hypothetical sequel though.
  #52  
Old 09-14-2011, 11:16 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Any area that gives you a time to complete it by and doesn't freeze time during forced cutscenes is stupid. And a mine cart puzzle where there's only one mine cart (causing constant trips to the beginning of the area in order to take the newly opened path) is also stupid. Finally, having to hit (multiple) moving targets with a fireball that takes two seconds to start moving is even more stupid.

Sorry for all the delay; school and Touhou are really sapping my time.
  #53  
Old 09-15-2011, 06:38 PM
Refa Refa is offline
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Get your priorities straight and skip the school and make LPs and play Tohou instead*.



*Advice might not be advisable.
  #54  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:00 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Sorry this took so long.



Just south of Patcher’s Place is this fork in the road. Astounding how the game is already giving me a choice as to where I’ll go ne- wait a minute.



Never mind, the area on the right is just a shortcut back to Patcher’s Place in case you didn’t get the Gate card.



Going to the correct area (Goma Highlands Road) causes a cutscene to play.



The wind causes these flowers to lift up. Apparently they’re relatives of those things you could jump on to spin jump in Super Mario 64.



The wind also reveals a Jupiter Djinni, who Matthew just watches runs away.

Surprisingly, the game does not stop and have Karis and Tyrell discuss what just happened. Of course the entire cutscene was unskippable so yeah.



I’ve never actually tried running away from fights in Golden Sun before, so I don’t really know the formula. Still, four turns trying to run away? That’s just ridiculous.



The main puzzle of this update’s area involves using Whirlwind to lift flowers to jump on. Of note is that in this game, Whirlwind moves forward in a line instead of just hitting the area directly in front.



Anyways, Fireball is needed to get these (apparently steam powered) gondolas to move.



Woo.



Doing all of that got me the Agility stat boost item.



Would it kill Carver to make a clear path through the mountains that doesn’t require puzzle solving?



Oh hey, my first Artifact weapon.



Golden Sun has two types of equipment: normal and artifact. I haven’t found any Artifact armor yet so I’ll just focus on weapons.

Normal weapons can be bought in shops, and the only unleashes they have are things like Critical Strike and (in Dark Dawn only) little things like Rolling Assault. Artifact weapons, however, have a variety of different unleashes and tend to be much stronger than normal weapons. They can be acquired by getting rare drops from certain monsters, buying stuff from a weapon shop’s Artifact section (which includes all of the Artifacts you’ve ever sold, so you never lose anything), or from opening chests.

Anyways, artifact weapons are better than normal weapons in pretty much every way possible.
  #55  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:03 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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God damn it.



Entering Carver’s Camp results in a long cutscene about how a Psynergy Vortex has collapsed the main bridge and how a little kid is now in danger.



Using necromancy, Matthew gets Karis’s dead body to cast Whirlwind, hitting the wind flower the kid was conveniently gripping.

Anyways, immediately after is another cutscene where the kid and the father discuss how the father will get back to Biblin, with the father quickly deciding to find another way (because apparently those ropes aren‘t strong enough to support his weight?). The kid then asks what he should say to his mother. After slowly going through four emoticons, the father tells his son to tell his mother that the father is going to find another way back.

That last sentence is about as long and redundant as the cutscene.



Good luck with the monsters.



After thanking Matthew, the man reveals that he met Kraden before coming to Carver’s Camp.



Kraden gave this message before the random Psynergy Vortex struck and destroyed the bridge. What, can he tell the future now?

Anyways, Kraden went looking for an alternate route and wants Matthew to follow him into some old ruins.



god damn it matthew suck it up and just climb across the ropes it’s not hard



Nearby is Carver. Talking to him initiates another cutscene where there is a lot of talking. Eventually the two NPCs accuse Matthew’s group of somehow causing a Psynergy Vortex.



This leads to the first double response. The game really wants every party member to participate in cutscenes, so it does this a lot.

After more exposition about Psynergy Vortexes and how they occur every 10 years and how they might be related to the Mourning Moon and how stopping the Psynergy Vortexes will stop the Mourning Moon despite the fact there’s no clear connection between the two andasfhskdhfjkhgjksgf SO MUCH TALKING AND EMOTING



Eventually the conversation turns to Kraden again because that last cutscene with the father wasn’t enough. Thankfully, the exposition is interrupted by the vortex suddenly shrinking.



Eventually, someone’s brain starts working and everyone realizes that the gondolas created specifically for crossing the ravine might be helpful.



So of course they all converge around the oldest gondola in the camp and ponder if it can be used.



Just touching the gondola causes it to explode because nobody ever tried to maintain the thing for some reason.
  #56  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:06 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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(Jesus Christ I have the worst mouse ever. Just highlighting text for copy and paste is an ordeal from hell.)



So then they try the next oldest gondola, because everyone in this world is too stupid to think of the various ways they could get across by using the rope the gondola was hanging from and their magical psychic powers.



After more useless talking, a plan is formed.



Because this is not how Grip actually works, to portray the plan the programmers just used a series of still frames with fade to white transitions.



They then headbutt the gondola, destroying the machine and sending Carver over to the other side.

After Karis makes the stunning observation that the gondola has been destroyed, Tyrell finally realizes that the way to Morgal has been destroyed.



So the game tells the player about the alternate path under the ruins again.



Here’s the game’s explanation as to why the gondolas broke when they were used. This does not explain at all why Matthew can use the ones right outside of the Camp as much as he wants.



Yum.



Slightly interesting exposition. Anyways, that priest nearby is the only way for me to revive my characters at the moment.



He also can cure Poison, remove the Haunt status effect, and remove Cursed equipment. He charges money for all of this.



Karis is revived for 80 coins.



Moving on, let’s break into someone’s house.



Guess what stat this boosts.
  #57  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:08 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Anyways, a path behind the largest house leads to this little Move puzzle.



This leads to another gondola. After two cutscenes, it can get Matthew to a previously inaccessible part of the area. Circling back to where I started puts me in position



To battle the Jupiter Djinni from earlier.



Welp, there goes that plan.



(52 damage)

Guess I’ll just beat the crap out of it.



Djinn give a decent amount of experience points.



Gust boosts HP by 3, Agility by 2, and Attack by 1. Using it results in a normal attack with +10 damage and a chance of hitting twice for double damage. It’s going to stay on Karis for now.

Anyways, guess it’s time to head to Konpa Ru-



wait what

This is one of Golden Sun’s bigger dick moves. In certain places on the World Map, Djinn can be encountered as random battles. Good luck finding out where without a guide, though; the areas are usually pretty distinctive, but there are a lot of red herrings and the Djinn aren’t guaranteed to show up as your first battle.



Anyways, this guy goes down after a simple Gust + Flint chain.



Now that I have at least one Djinni on everyone, I can start setting more than one. I won’t be able to set more than two until I get two Djinn on everyone, but two is enough for me to



Make Matthew a Ruffian again. Tyrell looks like he’s getting nerfed, but he isn’t; look at his Attack and Agility.



Entering the (entirely pointless, I don’t even know why it exists) Konpa Gate leads to a long cutscene where the game shows how having a Pass Card lets you get through the gate.



The player must then act out the cutscene and watch the gate‘s long opening animation again.



Once on the other side, you can freak out this Venus Djinn and make it hide under some Wind Blossoms.



It’s pretty obvious what you have to do.
  #58  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:10 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Flower boosts HP by 12 and PP by 3. Unleash it restores some HP to the party. It’s going on Karis since she’s fast enough to make the most out of a group heal.



Impressive.



There’s a physics defying puddle here that I can’t do anything with yet. Note that it leads to a shortcut that basically skips 90% of the dungeon.



Konpa Ruins is an intricate dungeon with lots of little things you need to use the appropriate Psynergy on in order to move on. Conveniently, there are no puzzles requiring Mercury Psynergy despite the fact this is a temple for Alchemy.



There’s also a lot of unnecessary cutscenes.



Oh good, an Artifact armor.



While store-bought armor tends to only raise defense, Artifact armor almost always boosts something else. Like with weapons, you’ll always want Artifact armor over normal armor.



Anyways, the main goal of the dungeon was to get three pushable blocks down to a puzzle area. I did that before coming into this room, so it looks like a simple block puzzle. Which it is, just there’s a lot of crap you have to do to set things up.



Completing the puzzle both causes an earthquake and activates the guardian statue.



There are lots of tablets like this throughout Dark Dawn. They’re written in the ancient language, so they can’t be understood until



Matthew gets the information directly transcribed into his brain.
  #59  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:12 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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He also gets a useless book.



The vast majority of the ancient tablets contain puzzle hints.



UP UP AND AWAY

I’m taken to the roof of Konpa Ruins, the place the shortcut I mentioned earlier cuts to.



Any Earth Adept equipped with this can use Grip. Don’t ask why the people at Carver’s Camp could use Grip without a special item.

The player is forced to solve a Grip puzzle before they can leave the room.



~Look out! Here comes the spider adept!~



With the Grip Crystal in hand, I can web sling into this Jupiter Djinni (who otherwise just runs away from Matthew while he’s frozen due to a cutscene) and engage it in battle.



Everyone hits level 6.



Jolt boosts PP by 7, HP by 5, and Luck by 2. When used, he has a chance of reviving a fallen character. Yes, you read that right, a chance. It’s replacing Flower on Karis because at level 6 Karis learns



Fresh Breeze, a full party heal. Note that all healing Psynergy in the game only state what they heal at the absolute minimum; the caster’s elemental power will determine how much will really be healed. There can be quite a difference; with the correct equipment and class, the dedicated healer of The Lost Age could heal the entire party for 850+ with a spell that says it heals 400.



Oh look, another shortcut for Mercury Adepts.



After I use Grip to get in range to Fireball the orb, guess what activates?



A machine at the entrance of the dungeon. Are you starting to understand just how much Golden Sun likes wasting your time?



DOWN DOWN AND AWAY



Activating the machine reveals a staircase that leads to the caves I heard about back in Carver’s Camp. How they knew about a cave that was sealed behind a gigantic pain in the ass puzzle is beyond me.



Yay, this stupid dungeon is almost over. Oh, and I got a new weapon, that’s cool too.
  #60  
Old 09-17-2011, 08:13 PM
BlitzBlast BlitzBlast is offline
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Hey, Kraden! HEY! LOOK TO YOUR RIGHT!



Oh fine, I’ll step here to start the cutscene.



Shut up Mrs. I Can Skip 90% Of A Dungeon.

Nowell and her brother Rief are the two students of Kraden. They’re also the children of Mia, the dedicated healer from The Lost Age I mentioned earlier.



Interestingly, Nowell seems to know Growth, a Venus spell. While this probably means that Mia married some random Venus adept, fans obviously jumped to the assumption that Isaac slept with both Mia and Jenna.



Kraden and Nowell continue to chat about how Matthew and co are taking so long and how there’s a Psynergy Vortex (nobody mentions the big pink machine underneath it) and how Kraden and Isaac are old friends and how Nowell has Rief whipped and how Rief has a Vortex fetish and ARGH WHY WON’T ANY OF YOU TURN YOUR HEAD A FEW INCHES.



And if your head wasn’t soldered into place, you would have noticed the big pink machine right underneath the vortex. Nowell has to point out that it’s there (though you‘d think she‘d have noticed earlier).



Kraden wants to take a closer look, so Nowell starts heading over to him. Then everyone stops and finally stares at Matthew’s position. Not because they’ve noticed Matthew, mind you.



It’s because ninja attacked.



In a Low Level No Psynergy No Artifacts No Djinn run, these guys are pretty damn hard.



I’m only doing Low Level so they’re just kind of tough, but in normal runs they’re total jokes due to their weakness to every type of Psynergy.



Their gimmick is that they can use various items and skills to negatively affect your characters. They also have herbs to heal themselves with, but it doesn’t really make the battle any harder. Finally, they can choose to do nothing and “scout the area”, which I assume is just a fancy Defend command.

As long as Karis has enough PP to cast Fresh Breeze, I'm basically immortal.



Once one Stealthy Scout goes down, the battle difficulty significantly decreases since it‘s now safe to just spam attack, but it’s still very possible that the two remaining Scouts will gang up and kill one character. Once the second Stealthy Scout dies, though, the battle difficulty vanishes because you can just unleash Fever, Gust, and Flint to cripple the last Scout.



Everybody reaches level 8.

Next time: Can you believe we’ve already reached a point of no return?

Last edited by BlitzBlast; 09-17-2011 at 11:26 PM.
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