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  #151  
Old 10-24-2017, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Juno View Post
Hell, the coins you'd put in arcade machines for extra lives were basically monetization for its day. I think our attitude towards it is different compared to modern day stuff like loot boxes simply because we grew up with it as children and we simply saw it as natural.
I've always wanted a phone game to try this arcade model just to see what would happen now. Make customers pay 25 cents for a credit as a baseline, potentially throw in some more modern features like building up your max lives per credit or something.
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  #152  
Old 10-24-2017, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by Juno View Post
Hell, the coins you'd put in arcade machines for extra lives were basically monetization for its day.
I was thinking the exact same. Of course, an arcade experience is not analogous to how most people game now, but monetization as a beast has been with us for quite some time.
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  #153  
Old 10-24-2017, 03:46 PM
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I mean I vaguely remember seeing tip lines being in magazines and game manuals, but the vast majority of my childhood was in the 90s by which point a lot of scams using 900 numbers were killed off; nobody in my family ever used them.
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  #154  
Old 10-24-2017, 03:53 PM
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Obviously there's a core difference in that arcade games didn't have you make a large up-front payment before charging you extra. Starting the game only requires a small initial payment, a few quarters at most. That's different from a modern game that costs 60 bucks at first and then asks you for more later.

Still though, arcade games were designed to get you to pay more. I remember the GB guys saying that after going back and playing the X-men arcade game, it often felt cheap, like it was intentionally designed to force the players to put in more quarters to continue.
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  #155  
Old 10-24-2017, 03:55 PM
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X-Men is an interesting example because on the surface it feels super cheap to play, but then when you get good at it, you have to rely on cheap tactics to win. And there's not much variation in strategy. (Really good arcade games feel cheap at first, but then you feel awesome when you get good at them.)
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  #156  
Old 10-24-2017, 04:12 PM
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Now I'm wondering how much it would cost to get a Street Fighter 2 Turbo arcade cabinet.

And where I would put it.

THANKS, GUYS.
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  #157  
Old 10-24-2017, 04:14 PM
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That's not a miro-transaction, four-so.

That is, in fact, a very large transaction!
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  #158  
Old 10-24-2017, 04:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Juno View Post
Hell, the coins you'd put in arcade machines for extra lives were basically monetization for its day. I think our attitude towards it is different compared to modern day stuff like loot boxes simply because we grew up with it as children and we simply saw it as natural.
Quote:
Originally Posted by four-so View Post
I was thinking the exact same. Of course, an arcade experience is not analogous to how most people game now, but monetization as a beast has been with us for quite some time.
You're not wrong, but there's still some pretty big differences between the arcade machines of old and the modern day money sinks.

1) They were a offline social experience. You had to go to arcades, malls, bowling alleys, bars, movie theaters, places where other people gather to partake in them. Maybe some strangers or friends would join in to cooperate with or compete against you, maybe you'd make some new friends.

Modern games, you just play on your mobile device or console and unless the game has local multiplayer and you have offline friends into gaming you're gonna look online for competition. And it's a lot easier for people to dehumanize and be complete assholes to someone who's not in the same room as you.

2) They offered an experience you couldn't get at home. Obviously a big advantage the arcades used to have was that they had better graphics, sound, loading times, and sometimes gameplay than the home experience, but it's not just that. A big thing about this machine that's made to play one specific game is that the cabinet could be built for the experience. Vehicle games had setups like a car/bike/jet, music games had instruments and metal dance pads, light gun games had guns appropriate to the cabinet. There are peripherals you can get to emulate the experience, but the home versions of After Burner Climax and Silent Scope just can't compare to the arcade.

Modern games, they put pay-to-play and F2P stuff on experiences you can get elsewhere. Candy Crush Saga is a Bejeweled ripoff that uses Joe Camel style addiction tactics and it's made millions, possibly billions off of addicts.

3) When you went home, the arcade couldn't keep trying to take your money. Simple enough. You had to be at the places with arcade machines to blow all your money on arcade machines, physically. With coins. Mobile games can be with you always, tempting you to blow money on them with your credit card.
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  #159  
Old 10-24-2017, 04:40 PM
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Some of this reminded me of a great article Waypoint ran last year on "Fishing" Games.
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  #160  
Old 10-24-2017, 06:29 PM
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I don't buy that bigger games have to have loot boxes and other slimy systems to make money. Witcher 3 gave away a bunch of free DLC that absolutely would have been paid content for most other games. The only stuff you had to pay for were the meaty expansions, which I still have not done despite the base game one of my favorites of this generation. Am I part of the problem!?
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  #161  
Old 10-24-2017, 06:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.R. Bigman View Post
I don't buy that bigger games have to have loot boxes and other slimy systems to make money. Witcher 3 gave away a bunch of free DLC that absolutely would have been paid content for most other games. The only stuff you had to pay for were the meaty expansions, which I still have not done despite the base game one of my favorites of this generation. Am I part of the problem!?
The Witcher 3 was subsidized in part by CD Projekt's lucrative internet retail side business, GOG.

Additionally, the question isn't whether the practice is necessary in order to turn a profit, but whether it is useful in increasing revenue.
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  #162  
Old 10-24-2017, 07:03 PM
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CD Projekt owns Good Old Games? Wow, running an online marketplace and still making video games. (glares in Valve's direction)

Sorry for not understanding the question at hand. Loot boxes and such do certainly appear to be working well for many of the bigger deal games that use them.

My only personal experience with this mechanic is Terra Battle, which had a very limited audience that never expanded, so they tried to milk every player they did have with truly brazen schemes to make you really need to buy in-game funny money, culminating in gacha events that wouldn't except in-game currency you got for playing the game normally, only paid currency. There is a sequel out now and I've heard it's pulling that crap from the start, so I stayed far away.
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  #163  
Old 10-25-2017, 12:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by R.R. Bigman View Post
I don't buy that bigger games have to have loot boxes and other slimy systems to make money. Witcher 3 gave away a bunch of free DLC that absolutely would have been paid content for most other games. The only stuff you had to pay for were the meaty expansions, which I still have not done despite the base game one of my favorites of this generation. Am I part of the problem!?
It's important to keep in mind that games take a lot longer to make now than it takes the market to shift, so a lot of games come out having been planned for a older way of doing things. Given what we know, it's almost dead certain that CDPR's next game Cyberpunk will be a GaaS.

The obvious laggard in the industry is Nintendo, whose embrace of service games has been tepid or unorthodox (Splatoon and ARMS are both GaaS, but have no monetization), but they have advantage of 1) Being a platform-holder 2) Still having massive cash reserves from the Wii/DS days 3) Knowing that their games will sell millions of copies over years, mostly at full-price.
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  #164  
Old 10-27-2017, 01:57 PM
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Kotaku's story on the failure of Visceral's Star Wars game

It seems like the issue was maybe less "EA no longer considers single player-only games a sustainable business model" and more "EA has no idea how to manage studios it acquires".
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  #165  
Old 10-27-2017, 02:35 PM
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Visceral was one of EA's original in-house developers; started back in the late 90s.

But yeah, they apparently have no clue how to properly manage anything.
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  #166  
Old 10-27-2017, 02:52 PM
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I forgot that fact and the way the story goes, you wouldn't think it. Let's throw these two studios with completely different management styles together on the same project, I'm sure there will be no problems!
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  #167  
Old 10-27-2017, 03:07 PM
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Damn... I really want to play the game they wanted to make now, too!
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amiibo are so expensive , embrace the future , gotcha mechanics , industry , lootboxes , microtransactions , monetization , outside the skinner box , stay off the hook!

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