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Old 12-27-2012, 05:33 PM
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Default Hey, Wheels! Tell me about Ys!

I cannot find a general Ys thread for the life of me so here we go.

Specifically, I wanted to talk about the newer Ys games that feature less bumper cars combat and more action oriented stuff. I just recently finished Ys Origin and am planning on jumping into Oath in Felghana soonish, so I wanted a place to talk about the more action oriented games but I'm certainly not going to say "don't talk about the older games here!" =p

It was interesting jumping into the series for the very first time on the prequel origin story! I feel like I was made privy to a lot of information about Darm Tower and the twin goddesses that long time players only learned through text fragments and implied backstory, and I skimmed most of the Hardcore Gaming 101 article after finishing Origin to see just what the rest of the series is about. Man that's kind of complicated!

I'm curious now, what is the best way to go about trying to learn more through playing these days? Chronicles is 1 & 2 combined if I understand correctly, while The Ark of Napishtim is 4? I also swear I heard that there was a big deal being made about 3 coming out in English in a form that's playable for the first time ever but I can't remember what it is and apparently that's Oath in Felghana? Is Chronicles -> Oath -> Ark the right way to go through things for a modern gamer who is completely floored by how anyone ever enjoyed the old games? That sounds a lot rougher than I'm actually meaning it by the by. ;)
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:41 PM
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Well, Napishtim is 6, actually. I'm sure Wheels will come in here and really lay the knowledge down, but it goes 1, 2, Oath, two versions of 4 that never were released in English, no 5, Ark, 7.

Hell, play them in any order you want. Oath is still by far my favorite.
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:55 PM
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Naphistim is essentially proto-Oath/Origins and is fairly rough around the edges. Oath is one of all-time favorite games EVAR, so it should go without saying that its the best of the series: it's an incredibly lean, and fast-paced Action RPG without a lot of filler getting in the way of playing the actual game. Origins seems dope, but I haven't finished it yet. Seven is also really great, but for very different reasons: its more formal a JRPG than its peers, so it slows things down considerably as people spend a lot of time talking about nothing, but when the talking heads finally cease their incessant talking, the action is nothing to sneeze at.

I gave the PSP remakes of Ys I and II the college try, and while cathartic, I decided they're too arcane for my tastes.

Last edited by Belmont; 12-27-2012 at 06:09 PM.
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Old 12-27-2012, 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by Tefari View Post
I wanted a place to talk about the more action oriented games but I'm certainly not going to say "don't talk about the older games here!" =p
Ys was never not action-oriented. The old gameplay consists of ramming headlong into enemies.
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Old 12-27-2012, 06:13 PM
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As I understand it a remake of 4 is forthcoming for the Vita? But that's the 4 that it should have been and not either of the 4s that came before developed by other studios. When that hits I think that only leaves 5 completely inaccessible to english audiences, not even by way of a rom patch.

To my own end, I loved Oath, and own Origins both on Steam, but I'll be getting the rest for my Vita at some point if I don't burn out on it first.
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:31 PM
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Ys Games:

Ys Origins (prequel, you already played it)
Ys I (ported a fucktillion times)
Ys II (ported a fucktillion times)
Ys III (remade as Oath in Felgana [PSP/PC])
Ys IV (not released in US, has remakes that are also not in the US)...also there are TWO Ys IV games just to confuse you
Ys V (not released in US, has remakes that are also not in the US)
Ys VI Ark of Napishtim (PSP/PS2/PC)
Ys VII (PSP, it's okay)
Ys Strategy (not released in US, also sucks)

Ys Games Worth Playing:

Ys Origins (you did that)
- Ys I/Ys II. Basically any version is good, but keep in mind that it's an action RPG from the late 80s that was originally made for PCs, so its kind of archaic and obtuse. But use an FAQ if you get stuck and you'll have a good time. The PC Engine version is on Wii Virtual Console and I recommend that or the Ys Eternal PC version if you can find it. It wasn't released in America but years ago I found it/a translation patch online and I imagine you probably still could today.
- Ys III, PC Engine or Genesis version.
- Oath in Felgana, which is technically Ys III but its so different that its worth playing too.
- Ys VI
- Ys VII
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:50 PM
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This Ys series overview is the best I've run across. It is only slightly out of date since it doesn't mention Ys coming to Steam.

If you want to play more of the series then my opinion is you should get on to playing Ys I and II. Even if you say you aren't interested in the old games, the modern remakes are a different kettle of fish.

When it comes to I & II, the modern remakes are still similar enough in dungeon layouts and action style to make the older versions obsolete, in a certain sense. On the other hand, 'Ys: The Oath in Felghana' (based on III) is a more dramatic re-imagining. But even if it doesn't obsolesce it, the original 'Ys III' is hard to enjoy anyway. I believe 'Ys: Woodland of Celceta' (based on IV) is again going to be a more dramatic departure.

Play either 'Ys I & II Chronicles' (PSP) or 'Ys I & II Complete' (PC) with the English patch. (The only other modern remake is on the DS, which is universally considered an inferior choice.)
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Old 12-27-2012, 07:57 PM
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Its not that I'm not interested in the older games' storylines, I'm just not interested in the bumper cars style of gameplay, it doesn't look interesting in the slightest. That's why I was interested in Chronicles/Complete since AFAIK it uses the Origins/Oath game style.
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Old 12-27-2012, 08:29 PM
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Chronicles doesn't have an attack button, and I don't think Complete does, either. The DS version does, but it's a pretty lame incarnation by all accounts.
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Old 12-27-2012, 10:10 PM
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Ys Complete doesn't have an attack button. The DS game has an attack button, but the game wasn't really designed for it (it is otherwise a port of Complete) which explains a lot of why people don't like that version very much. Ys Chronicles is all together the better port of Complete.

Anyway, if the gameplay of Ys I and II doesn't look to your liking, Tefari, then that's fine. Your plan to play Oath in Felghana next is what I'd recommend!

For others who are just coming to grips with the series for the first time though I want to sort through the confusion. It'd be a mistake to immediately write off the 'Complete' -family of games with the older ones. Granted, the gameplay of Complete is classic bump to attack, but it has a modern combat engine (for lack of a better term), balance changes and an overall polished presentation. The Complete games are eminently playable and just as popular as the other modern ones with non-classic gameplay. (*cough* if not masterpieces themselves)

Alixsar's advice to reach for a FAQ when you can't figure out how to progress is spot on though.

BTW, the thread title should totally be "Ys Discussion: Ancient Thread Vanished". (explanation) I've been saving that one for some time...
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  #11  
Old 12-27-2012, 10:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dosboot View Post
The DS game has an attack button, but the game wasn't really designed for it (it is otherwise a port of Complete) which explains a lot of why people don't like that version very much.
It also has ugly polygonal environments and a severely cropped view of the action.

I definitely recommend the PC version of Complete. It's breezy and beautiful.
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  #12  
Old 12-28-2012, 12:53 AM
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Go ahead and hit Oath in Felghana right away. It's arguably the best in the series, and you don't need to worry too much about getting the stories in the right order. They have some connections to each other, but they're all self-contained enough to enjoy and understand in any order.
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:14 AM
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Oath is pretty incredible. One of the best damn games, let alone the best in the series. Origin is also really good.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanguard View Post
Go ahead and hit Oath in Felghana right away. It's arguably the best in the series, and you don't need to worry too much about getting the stories in the right order. They have some connections to each other, but they're all self-contained enough to enjoy and understand in any order.
I've only played the absolute start of it, but I was pretty impressed by how Oath gave the impression of being part of an ongoing story while still dumping the player straight into its action!
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:02 AM
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My only disappointment with Oath was to find out that the PC version I dumped time into didn't have the NG+ bonuses that the PSP version had. The game was breezy enough that I might have done a re-run right away (almost unheard of for me) if that had been an option.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:34 AM
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Are they the standard NG+ bonuses that make you wildly overpowered?

If there's no challenge, you've lost half of the reasons for playing. Oath in Felghana has maybe the best balance between extreme challenge and extreme fairness I've ever seen.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:58 AM
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Except Nightmare/Inferno Gyalva. *shudder*
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Old 12-28-2012, 11:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vanguard View Post
Are they the standard NG+ bonuses that make you wildly overpowered?

If there's no challenge, you've lost half of the reasons for playing. Oath in Felghana has maybe the best balance between extreme challenge and extreme fairness I've ever seen.
Actually the PSP system for Oath that I read was really...unique. You get a number of "points" to spend based on what difficulty you completed it at. And from those points you get to spend them on which things you want to carry over, be bonuses, etc... I'm not sure it works in practice of course because I couldn't try it...but I WANTED to.
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Old 12-28-2012, 11:51 AM
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Wheels is busy tending to the babby he apparently now has to raise. So I can understand why he hasn't shown up here yet.
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Old 12-28-2012, 01:02 PM
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Well it seems my work has been done for me!

I'll just add a few things:

Ys VI is best on PC in my opinion. You can still import it from Falcom and there is an English patch available.

Troa11 is right on the Vita Ys, except its not forthcoming its out and awesome (Ys VII with more action and less talking). Hopefully XSEED will bring it over.

Glad to see so much Ys love
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  #21  
Old 12-28-2012, 01:34 PM
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I'll edit that with Ys VI being good on PSP so long as it's on memory stick.
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Old 12-28-2012, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alixsar View Post
Ys Games:

Ys Origins (prequel, you already played it)
Ys I (ported a fucktillion times)
Ys II (ported a fucktillion times)
Ys III (remade as Oath in Felgana [PSP/PC])
Ys IV (not released in US, has remakes that are also not in the US)...also there are TWO Ys IV games just to confuse you
Ys V (not released in US, has remakes that are also not in the US)
Ys VI Ark of Napishtim (PSP/PS2/PC)
Ys VII (PSP, it's okay)
Ys Strategy (not released in US, also sucks)

Ys Games Worth Playing:

Ys Origins (you did that)
- Ys I/Ys II. Basically any version is good, but keep in mind that it's an action RPG from the late 80s that was originally made for PCs, so its kind of archaic and obtuse. But use an FAQ if you get stuck and you'll have a good time. The PC Engine version is on Wii Virtual Console and I recommend that or the Ys Eternal PC version if you can find it. It wasn't released in America but years ago I found it/a translation patch online and I imagine you probably still could today.
- Ys III, PC Engine or Genesis version.
- Oath in Felgana, which is technically Ys III but its so different that its worth playing too.
- Ys VI
- Ys VII
Wheels' personal recommendation is to play oath and ignore the old versions of III. Support XSEED! We need more Falcom goodness
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  #23  
Old 12-31-2012, 03:20 PM
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Ys 1&2 are pretty mindblowingly awesome games when you think about the combat engine being entirely ramming into things. When I first got to the final boss of 1 I was like "Hooooollly shiiiiit this is absolutely insane." I keep dropping my file in Ark, which is a shame because it's good, but Oath is definitely the best one I've played. Seven has some pretty fantastic music (I liked the OST more than the other games because it's varied more like a traditional JRPG), but there's at least 1 or 2 tracks from every game that kick major ass.
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Old 12-31-2012, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich View Post
I started playing Ys Origin after getting it in the Holiday sale and it's destroying me. I finally got past the first "real" boss, and then died about 8 times to the enemies in the second area.
The bosses are brutal. While playing Oath, it seemed on several occasions that the bosses were literally impossible, but each time I was able to chip away a fraction more health, almost dodge an attack that previously hit me head-on. Upon defeating one, the feeling of accomplishment is enormous, and the fights rarely last long enough for even the twentieth try to feel tedious. It really is an amazing little series.
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Old 12-31-2012, 07:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich View Post
I started playing Ys Origin after getting it in the Holiday sale and it's destroying me. I finally got past the first "real" boss, and then died about 8 times to the enemies in the second area.
Origin has some pretty tough bosses (especially on hard) so grinding up a level or two is usually a good idea.


Quote:
Originally Posted by T-Brew View Post
The bosses are brutal. While playing Oath, it seemed on several occasions that the bosses were literally impossible, but each time I was able to chip away a fraction more health, almost dodge an attack that previously hit me head-on. Upon defeating one, the feeling of accomplishment is enormous, and the fights rarely last long enough for even the twentieth try to feel tedious. It really is an amazing little series.
Yeah beating Oath (I beat it on hard on the PC version where there is no healing during boss battles) is a really awesome feeling especially with the incredible final boss theme.
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Old 12-31-2012, 11:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheels View Post
Origin has some pretty tough bosses (especially on hard) so grinding up a level or two is usually a good idea.
It's probably the game's most significant weakness... except grinding can still be really damn fun thanks to the music (if you like Falcom music anyway) and the combat system. That, and it can literally take like 5 minutes to be leveled up enough.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nich View Post
I started playing Ys Origin after getting it in the Holiday sale and it's destroying me. I finally got past the first "real" boss, and then died about 8 times to the enemies in the second area.
Oh yeah, something that isn't initially made clear in Origin is that the first area is basically a tutorial. Don't base your choice of difficulty on how easy it is.

That's what happened to me. I chose hard at first, but switched over to nightmare after seeing how easy the initial enemies were.

And that is the story of how I became a man.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:31 PM
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It's probably the game's most significant weakness... except grinding can still be really damn fun thanks to the music (if you like Falcom music anyway) and the combat system. That, and it can literally take like 5 minutes to be leveled up enough.
That's been perhaps the single most notable weakness in the Ys series since forever. The level range at which a boss fight is appropriately challenging is always very narrow. A couple levels higher or lower and bosses either take almost no damage and kill you in two hits, or are defeated in seconds and can't even scratch you.
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Old 01-01-2013, 03:56 PM
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I generally find that you'll be at the appropriate level in Oath and Origin if you maintain at 1.99x chain and fully explore the current area. On normal mode, at least. I had to grind myself up against a few bosses when I did Inferno mode (Gyalva...), at least until I got the Terra Bracelet.
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Old 01-01-2013, 04:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wheels View Post
Yeah beating Oath (I beat it on hard on the PC version where there is no healing during boss battles) is a really awesome feeling especially with the incredible final boss theme.
Aside from the burst charge, I don't don't remember you being able to heal in boss battles in Oath's Normal mode on the PSP version. Man, that game was brutal, and I don't just mean the voice acting!
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