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  #2041  
Old 04-03-2017, 07:45 AM
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Yeah even while in the middle of watching all of Gundam I've started to rewatch G-Gundam because it's just that good.

The first time I saw it I mostly appreciated it for it's absurdity but now I'm really starting to respect as a really well crafted story that uses it's "Gundam of the week" format to build a larger narrative perfectly and in a way most shows with a format like this fail to do completely. Every episode builds on something or gets called back to in a significant way and the characters honestly have way more depth and development than most Gundam series, probably because it doesn't have as much of a hard on for melodrama/angst.
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  #2042  
Old 04-03-2017, 07:49 AM
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I mean, there's plenty of melodrama and angst, but it's almost always in service of the overarching story arc and not as a determinate of who will stare broodingly at each other next.
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  #2043  
Old 04-03-2017, 10:35 AM
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Also there's a Tequila Gundam, which is a Gundam in a sombrero

It's from Neo Mexico, which is a giant sombrero space colony

This show...
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  #2044  
Old 04-03-2017, 03:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Alixsar View Post
Also there's a Tequila Gundam, which is a Gundam in a sombrero

It's from Neo Mexico, which is a giant sombrero space colony

This show...
I told a Mexican-American friend about the Tequilla Gundam one time.

"I bet its pilot has some stereotypical beaner-name like Chico Rodriguez"

"..."

"NO. SHUT. UP!"

"He's also piloting Gundams to send money home to help his sick family."

"THAT'S SO RACIST!"

"The Gundam also wears a sombrero, poncho, and has cactuses on its shoulders"

""
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  #2045  
Old 04-03-2017, 04:00 PM
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He also loses IMMEDIATELY and I laughed so hard both times I've seen the episode.
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  #2046  
Old 04-03-2017, 04:06 PM
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Yeah I totally forgot and then his arms blew up within seconds. It was glorious.
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  #2047  
Old 04-03-2017, 04:11 PM
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G Gundam is, like, 190% racist. It's so racist it runs out of races and starts making up new ones just so it can be prejudiced at them.
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  #2048  
Old 04-03-2017, 05:14 PM
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So I gather from what you all are telling me is that G Gundam is the Sausage Party of anime
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  #2049  
Old 04-03-2017, 06:21 PM
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G Gundam is incredibly racist, but not in the "exterminate the undesirables!" kind of way, but in the insidious and subconscious reinforcing stereotypes kind of way. I'm convinced G Gundam doesn't even understand what it's doing, because it thinks it's being inclusive and understanding. Which it kinda is! It's just also coming from a perspective of cultural isolation where the people writing these characters and designing these mechs have very little understanding of the people they're inadvertently creating caricatures of. Chico Rodriguez is a good person, with noble aspirations and no real character faults. He just happens to embody and reinforce a lot of stereotypes that aren't appreciated by Latinos. The closest thing this show has to a purely evil villain is a Japanese character. There's a real attempt to make almost every character that represents their nation into embodying the best attributes of its people. And when there is a bad guy (like the dude representing Neo Italy) there's the juxtaposition of numerous other good people from that place to show that not all people from there are like that. It's like TOS Star Trek, where in today's world a lot of stuff looks really iffy, but it means well and the underlying message is one of tolerance, acceptance, and peace. It's also a little refreshing to see a show actually have real places/ethnicities instead of chickening out and for plausible deniability like 00 and its not!Iraq parallels which IMO just comes off as gutless and offensive in its own way.
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  #2050  
Old 04-03-2017, 06:52 PM
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How G Gundam handles ethnicity is a prime example of the behind-the-scenes conflict between the sponsors and the creative team. You have the sponsors dead-set on this horrible, stupid idea, with Imagawa desperately trying to salvage it.

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The designs Imagawa-san had produced for the new series were quickly dumped by a designer (who, according to Imagawa-san, "barely looked at them") who trotted out his own new designs - Gundams based on nationality. In Imagawa's words, they were "terrible."

[…]

Imagawa-san even questioned, "What if the nationality based Gundams are offensive?" The sponsors countered by saying that adding "Neo" to every country (and saying they were off-Earth colonies) would solve the problem - and in the case of America, it could be "Neo A 'pause' merica."
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  #2051  
Old 04-03-2017, 07:01 PM
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I fucking love Andrew Graham. He is the perfect representative of Canada, and seeing him tickles me pink.

Personally, the only character that really bugs me as far as race is concerned is the Indian snake charmer. Otherwise, I think the designs and characters are a lot of fun and mostly benign. They're a product of their time. But of course, I'm also an ultra white dude saying this so it's not like what I say in this regard really matters.
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  #2052  
Old 04-03-2017, 10:58 PM
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For those interested in Gundam X, the first set is currently $30 on Amazon (in Canada too!). The second set is still pricey, though, so you may have to wait a while to finish the series. Still, I happily jumped at that; X is a favourite of mine and it'll be nice to own a copy.
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  #2053  
Old 04-11-2017, 01:40 PM
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Gundam sale at CR Store.
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  #2054  
Old 04-11-2017, 03:14 PM
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Today I learned that crunchy sells physical media and model kits. Huh. Okay.

Edit: I also learned that their storefront is shit and randomly reorders the search results each time you leave and come back to the same page, wtf.

Edit 2: Lol, I was tempted by a Nobel Gundam kit for 14 bucks but the shipping is an additional 12. Nah.
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  #2055  
Old 04-11-2017, 03:17 PM
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Yeah, they have for a while. Most of the time they tend to promote current show stuff over legacy, but every so often they'll have specials on older stuff too.
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  #2056  
Old 04-28-2017, 01:52 PM
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Episode 6 of Gundam Thunderbolt is live:



All those amphibious mobile suits...!
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  #2057  
Old 04-28-2017, 11:14 PM
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Nina Simone cover on the end credits, niiiice.
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  #2058  
Old 04-29-2017, 01:07 PM
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Heck of a setpiece. The series seems to excel at those.

Implosion totally doesn't work that way, though.
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  #2059  
Old 05-02-2017, 11:02 AM
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Finally got around to finishing IBO. My brother and I have pretty much opposite views on it. He feels it's a generally good show with with some examples of very poor writing that drag it down a bit, while I feel it's a bad show with a few good ideas that it fails to capitalize on.



I found the epilogue pretty interesting, really. Mostly the stuff about Rustal Elion. I almost want to watch it again after seeing him... sort of re-contextualized. He was ostensibly (and visibly) the Bad Guy, but the Good Guys also did a lot of questionable things over the course of the series. On the other hand, I also don't want to subject myself to the Smooth Criminal and his Space Harem and basically everything related to the show's problematic relationships.

It really feels like the show was not properly portraying unhealthy things as unhealthy. Mikazuki was clearly fucked up and his and Orga's codependency contributed to the hell they found themselves in. I suppose they died in the end and maybe that was supposed to say something, but it feels like it was celebrating them the whole time otherwise? Especially when you have multiple women fawning over the damaged sociopath who displays little to no outward emotion. It felt like some kind of wish fulfillment fantasy.

There's like, the skeleton of a good story somewhere in there, but the show is a mess.



I need to finish Zeta Gundam.
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  #2060  
Old 05-02-2017, 12:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Regulus View Post
There's like, the skeleton of a good story somewhere in there, but the show is a mess.
The way I see it is that the show just has no awareness of what it's actually laying down. There is a lot of potential with Mikazuki, yet the show consistently avoids any examination of his character or relationships— that implies to me that they didn't even intend for him to be anything other than a cool stoic hero, and that is both bewilderingly incompetent and also a little worrying.
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  #2061  
Old 05-02-2017, 03:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by conchobhar View Post
The way I see it is that the show just has no awareness of what it's actually laying down.
It really becomes apparent when you analyze the disaster that is the show's overarching story. Rustal Elion, a character that simply didn't exist in S1, becomes the main antagonist in S2? Mobile Armors - being the cause of the Calamity War - go completely unmentioned in S1. Kudelia just runs out of things to do in S2, and her entire story arc just grinds to a halt? Gundam Bael, as this McGuffin that our Char-clone is ostensibly striving this entire time to capture, likewise simply doesn't exist until an episode or two before it gets revealed that it's the plot's primary McGuffin. The plotting of the story is written like its writers flew by the seat of their pants and didn't plan a single thing out beyond the immediate next episode. IBO feels less like something professional writers were paid to design, and more like a bad game of Consequences by people completely disinterested in actually playing.

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Originally Posted by Regulus View Post
I found the epilogue pretty interesting, really. Mostly the stuff about Rustal Elion. I almost want to watch it again after seeing him... sort of re-contextualized. He was ostensibly (and visibly) the Bad Guy, but the Good Guys also did a lot of questionable things over the course of the series.
I think that character and what happened during the epilogue is symptomatic of how awful the writing is in this show. Here we get a new main villain introduced in Season 2. And at no point during the show do we ever actually spend any meaningful time with him. As viewers, we don't know anything about the man, his aims, his ideals, what he fights for, etc. All we see is his brutal, cut-throat tactics that belie a man of poor character. I think that it would have been interesting, had he remained an enigma, completely off-screen, and then been revealed at the end "oh shit, we (Tekkadan) were the bad guys all along!?" But that would have required a focusing of the perspective to just Tekkadan in order to give that perspective-based twist any real meaning.

However, as viewers, we're shown Rustal and watch him talk to in his underlings countless times. It's just that that screentime goes completely to waste as it never delivers any meaningful information beyond telegraphing when the next conflict will occur for the audience. So instead, as viewers after only ever showing the man in vague, villainous tones, committing war atrocities, that in the end he turned out to be a good guy? That was incredibly unfulfilling and frustrating. And TBH, something IBO has been guilty of the entire show - having important events and character development and action occur off-screen. We just have to take Kudelia's word for it at the end I guess that the guy did good things for Gjallahorn, because IBO certainly couldn't be bothered with actually showing us directly his capacities as a leader or how he actually led reforms. The same way IBO couldn't be bothered to actually show us Kudelia's usefulness to the plot in S1 as a negotiator for independence movements. Or even down to the little things like "I guess the mechanic and the secretary-lady are dating now?" Please don't *show* us any of those things IBO, then you might actually risk being an interesting show.
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  #2062  
Old 05-02-2017, 08:22 PM
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Came in here to see what people were talking about and found some love and good analysis for G Gundam. I think I'll stay.

...and based on the recent comments, maybe I shouldn't finish S2 of IBO, as I really quite enjoyed the first season.
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  #2063  
Old 05-02-2017, 10:50 PM
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If you enjoyed S1 of IBO, don't let our hatred deter you. Most of the problems of S2 are just the continuation of problems S1 had, so if they didn't bother you then they might not bother you now at all. It's fairly divisive show, but I think people in general are OK with it. It's sitting at a solid 8 on MAL for example. Meanwhile I detest IBO but love the much maligned G-Reco so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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  #2064  
Old 05-02-2017, 11:48 PM
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FWIW, Drac, I watched the whole thing and largely remain in Regulus' brother's camp - there's lots of interesting things about the show but the moment-to-moment writing often has massive problems. I'm certainly not sorry I watched it though.

I just haven't been talking about it much because I was kind of tired of arguing about it, plus there's certainly things in it I wouldn't defend and I can definitely understand why some people don't like it at all.
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  #2065  
Old 05-03-2017, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WisteriaHysteria View Post
love the much maligned G-Reco so. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
... G-Reco is maligned?

These are the same people who don't like Victory or Turn A, aren't they?
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  #2066  
Old 05-03-2017, 11:16 AM
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I wanted to like G-Reco, heck I did like a lot of things in G-Reco, just... the pacing, man. I feel like if they doubled the episode count then Tomino probably could've pulled off what he was going for. Like, I don't mind shows not spelling everything out for you, but if you feel like you need to draw up a detailed faction chart just to keep track of what's going on that's maybe not ideal.
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  #2067  
Old 05-03-2017, 11:49 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Egarwaen View Post
... G-Reco is maligned?

These are the same people who don't like Victory or Turn A, aren't they?
It gets a really bad rap in the "West" - it's the lowest rated Gundam thing on MAL (5.8, compared to SEED Destiny 7.4, and Age 6.6) and ANN (5.4, compared to SEED Destiny 7.4, and Age 6.0) by a considerable amount.

Meanwhile in Japan, last I checked its ratings and disk sales were about on par with IBO, even though G-Reco was a show designed for kids and aired in a midnight time slot, and IBO got a prime time time slot.

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I wanted to like G-Reco, heck I did like a lot of things in G-Reco, just... the pacing, man. I feel like if they doubled the episode count then Tomino probably could've pulled off what he was going for. Like, I don't mind shows not spelling everything out for you, but if you feel like you need to draw up a detailed faction chart just to keep track of what's going on that's maybe not ideal.
Do I think the show could have benefited from slowing down a little? Maybe. But I'm pretty sure most people's complaints with the show would have remained regardless. Having the same scene take 50 or 100% longer, wouldn't have told people wanting to be spoonfed information what Bellri's motivations were when the show refuses to give you inner monologue, or has characters realistically deploy misinformation on a contextual basis towards people they don't yet trust. I'm convinced of that fact after watching other Tomino shows that get maligned like Brain Powered that completely lack 'pacing' issues.

Last edited by WisteriaHysteria; 05-03-2017 at 12:10 PM.
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  #2068  
Old 05-03-2017, 12:51 PM
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I had that factions issue with Zeta Gundam too. It took me a few years to make it through that show. I'm not a huge fan of it.
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  #2069  
Old 05-03-2017, 01:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WisteriaHysteria View Post
It gets a really bad rap in the "West" - it's the lowest rated Gundam thing on MAL (5.8, compared to SEED Destiny 7.4, and Age 6.6) and ANN (5.4, compared to SEED Destiny 7.4, and Age 6.0) by a considerable amount.

(...) I'm convinced of that fact after watching other Tomino shows that get maligned like Brain Powered that completely lack 'pacing' issues.
I think a big part of it is also that Tomino has gone farther and farther into refusing to engage in military celebration, which western audiences demand. While SEED Destiny at least makes a show of skepticism of state power, it also spends a lot of time going "look how awesome this army is man these soldiers kick ass". G-Reco refuses to do this; there's one character in the entire show who can be described as a badass soldier, and he dies in the first episode. Everyone else is confused, flaky, delusional, naive, or openly manipulative.
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  #2070  
Old 05-03-2017, 01:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WisteriaHysteria View Post
Do I think the show could have benefited from slowing down a little? Maybe. But I'm pretty sure most people's complaints with the show would have remained regardless. Having the same scene take 50 or 100% longer, wouldn't have told people wanting to be spoonfed information what Bellri's motivations were when the show refuses to give you inner monologue, or has characters realistically deploy misinformation on a contextual basis towards people they don't yet trust.
I haven't seen G-Reco, but I feel like I would have difficulty following a story where characters subtly lie to and misdirect each other when it's in another language, especially if attention isn't called to those misdirections. In English, the implications of tone, hesitation, word choice, emphasis, equivocation, etc. are all going to be readily apparent to me, but a lot of that is going to be lost when it's in a language I don't natively speak and I'm relying on reading the translation while listening. If I started to notice inconsistencies in the dialogue, I would probably first assume I had just misunderstood something earlier, then wonder about the quality of the translation/writing/editing, all before realizing the characters might be deceiving each other.
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