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Old 09-12-2018, 05:15 PM
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Zef Zef is offline
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Reading Wist's post, I draw three conclusions:

First: Wow, that's a lot of worldbuilding and history that were written into Delta and Fire Bomber 7, which I don't even know how to watch?

Second: Wow, I thought Mac 7 had had a happy ending, but I guess I need to watch both it and its OAVs to understand the above history?

Third: Wow, I actually need to watch Deltahahaha no I couldn't even finish that sentence I think I'll just TV Tropes it.
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Old 09-12-2018, 05:34 PM
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WisteriaHysteria WisteriaHysteria is offline
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The best things Delta and FB7 do is world-build. FB7 doesn't do a lot, but it does tell us how the people in-universe view the events of M7 and what they think happened to the fleet. Delta does a shitload of world building, and the most frustrating part of the movie-version is how it's all left on the chopping room floor. If you want to watch either FB7 or Delta, you'll have to do like everything in the franchise beyond Plus and get yourself fansubs. If you really wanted to, you could import the DVD/BDs for Delta, as those astonishingly came with official English subtitles, but the price of doing that is stupidly prohibitive.

Macross 7 does have a happy ending. But towards the end, NUNS orders the M7 fleet on a suicide mission to stop the Protodevilin - orders Capt. Max explicitly violates since NUNS is clearly just offering up the M7 fleet as a sacrificial lamb to buy time/hope the Protodevilin doesn't find the rest of humanity and he won't allow for it. So the vague implication at the end of M7, and asserted firmly in FB7 is that the M7 fleet is now AWOL/in a state of rebellion from the NUN as nobody has heard from them after the events of M7, despite us knowing they're safe and sound/repairing the fleet as of Dynamite 7 (which takes place a year after M7).

I don't regret watching Delta. It adds a lot to the franchise's lore, and that's probably the #1 reason I come to Macross, right behind cheesy love triangles and dope music. It just fails to live up to a lot of its promise, its narrative is too ambitious for how short the show is/spreads itself too thin among a huge cast, and ends with a bunch of tantalizing open ended questions. I think if you're a Macross fan, you should watch all the major entries to the franchise. The movies from a plot/lore perspective are fairly non-essential, and IMO the only reason to watch them is because they contain the franchise's best music. (Minmay's best songs are in DYRL; Sheryl's best songs are in the movies; Basara's best songs are in The Movie and Dynamite 7 which is basically a movie.) But definitely watch 7 at the least. Seven is actually amazing. I know it's polarizing but only to people who have forgotten love.
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Old 09-13-2018, 02:26 AM
Joe McGuffin Joe McGuffin is offline
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Originally Posted by WisteriaHysteria View Post
But definitely watch 7 at the least. Seven is actually amazing. I know it's polarizing but only to people who have forgotten love.
I love Seven too, but it's entirely fair that it sprains a lot of people's brains because it is a complete tonal outlier in the series (and especially since it was basically released as a companion piece to Plus, possibly the most emotionally intense Macross ever). It took me a long time to realize Seven was basically Hideo Kojima Presents Macross.
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Old 09-13-2018, 09:47 AM
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I always tell people that 7 takes quite a while to ramp up (some of the stuff towards the beginning is painfully slow), but the payoffs at both mid-series and the ending are so, so worth it if you can just commit to the length and cheese factor. I love it to death, personally.

I think I only watched FB7 before subs existed for it, so I'd missed its clarification of the 7 fleet's status.

And yeah, unfortunately the Delta map is just too zoomed-out and abstracted to have any interesting info (and probably intended that way, as Wist surmised). If I recall correctly Eden is only like a dozen light years from Earth, which is almost nothing on a galactic scale, so it's no surprise it's not even visibly called out from that perspective now that I think about it.
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Old 09-14-2018, 01:54 AM
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WisteriaHysteria WisteriaHysteria is offline
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Macross 7 is amazing. And part of what makes it so amazing are the "bad" things you Kirin and Joe mention.

"Starting off slow" is soooo good. For a long while in the beginning, it's like a slice of life living on an interstellar immigration fleet, and what TV show anywhere gives you that? Besides, so many shows these days trip over themselves to go a million miles per hour, and it's really friggin' nice to have a show slow down once in a while and really dig into/explore a setting and let the tone soak in.

And being a "tonal outlier" is also great shit. I love Macross, but soooo much of it takes itself too seriously. And M7 is like screw that, we're going to have fun for once. It's great, because even in the show, almost the whole cast chides, lectures, and tells Basara off on a regular basis, "HEY MAN, I dunno if you heard, but this Macross shit is SERIOUS BUSINESS! You have no business being here, GTFO!"

And Basara is like, "Nah, you guys are stupid. My music is dope af. Check it out!" And he just ignores everyone and jams out in the middle of outer space dog fights with no chill.

And it just keeps happening over and over again. And eventually, Basara wins this epic war of attrition. And every single last character in the show either has to give it up to my man for being right and being the most amazing baller in the galaxy, or they fuckin' die for being a stubborn tool.

My position on it has evolved a lot over the years, but Macross 7 is now pretty firmly my favorite Macross.
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