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  #211  
Old 09-19-2018, 06:00 PM
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I had an hour free so I played for a bit and discovered the city of tears, then ended up getting the map and finding my way to the fast travel bug. What an amazing area! I really want to explore it more, but Iím heading over to a friendís place right now.
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  #212  
Old 09-23-2018, 05:41 AM
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Originally Posted by MCBanjoMike View Post
First off, if you want you can just go ahead and fight him, it gets you one of the endings and then you can continue playing if you want to get the others.

As for the barriers, your first step is to go find Hornet at the far east of the map, have you done that? There's more to it, but that'll get you started.
Thanks! Unfortunately for both of these I'll have to get my muscle memory back where it was before I took a much-too-long break from the game, and hoh-lee shit did Hornet ever kick my ass and send me packing on my first attempt. Got a refresher on how long it takes to get back to certain bosses to boot!
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  #213  
Old 09-25-2018, 09:37 PM
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Nightmare King Grimm. How?
Nightmare King Grimm ded.

Last edited by Behemoth; 09-25-2018 at 09:38 PM. Reason: Misspelled "Nightmare" as "Knightmare."
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  #214  
Old 09-29-2018, 10:02 PM
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Nightmare King Grimm ded.
It took me 2-1/2 hours of trying, but I finally defeated him, too.

There was maybe 3 or 4 times where I was close but kept fucking up my dodging several times in a row.
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  #215  
Old 09-30-2018, 08:49 PM
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I made it up to the second-to-last obstacle in the Path of Pain, but just couldn't clear it after running through it over and over, and eventually had to give up, since my hand was starting to hurt. It might be more frustrating since I knew I was so close to the end of it, but it's too long to practice the end sequence properly.

Oh yeah, I've been playing this since it went on sale on the Switch. I've had as couple of issues (the scope of the world is awe-inspiring and frustrating at the same time), but it's been pretty addictive all the same for me. Hopefully beating Radiance will break the addiction, I have little patience to do too many of the harder bosses at this point.
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  #216  
Old 10-12-2018, 06:33 AM
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Well I may not have beaten Nightmare King Grimm, but I did get the Speedrun 2 achievement last night! It was my third attempt to speedrun the game, although I haven't been following the accepted strategies very closely. My first try was basically from memory and I managed to clear the game in about 6.5 hours. I tried again on the Switch and just missed hitting the 5 hour mark, mostly because I lost a ton of time losing to the Watcher Knights and the Hollow Knight. That was really frustrating, but also kinda weird, because I absolutely aced those fights on my previous attempt. Determined to get that dang achievement, I did a third speedrun and this time I managed to clock in at (just barely) under four hours! It was annoying to fail my 2nd attempt by so little, but beating that time by over an hour definitely makes up for it.

That said, 4 hours is still like 5 times the world record, so clearly there's a lot of room to improve yet. The two biggest time savers that I could see myself actually doing someday are the Greenpath skip (where you use repeated Vengeful Spirits to extend your jump onto a ledge where you see Hornet, thereby saving a big detour) and skipping the Monarch Wings (which requires doing some tricky super dashes over a few acid lakes). I also didn't make use of the bench warp, where you quit the game and reload your save to instantly warp across the map to your last save point. But even putting all that stuff together, I doubt I could get my time to under 2 hours, because it would require dying less while using worse equipment. As it stands, my current run has me upgrading my nail twice (it's a very short detour to get a pale ore if you're already grabbing the Monarch Wings) and getting one extra mask - and even with that gear I died a bunch of times. I'd also have less geo to spend on charms and charm notches, in all likelihood. My current route allows me to put off buying the lantern until pretty late (happily, it skips almost all of Deepnest : praying emoji : ), but I'm never going to memorize the dark areas well enough to ditch it entirely. So yeah, no sub-40-minute runs in my future.

Even so, it's been really enjoyable getting to know this game better. The gameplay is so smooth and satisfying and the world is always a delight to revisit, even if I'm only seeing about 30% of it. Not sure if I'll keep trying to bring my time down or just leave it for a while, since I've already finished Hollow Knight four times this year. Man, what a great game.
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  #217  
Old 11-09-2018, 05:46 AM
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This game makes me so happy. I think one of the best things the Souls series has taught gamers (in theory) is to care less about dying or losing money; it makes the whole thing less of a stupid numbers game. And man does the Super Metroid-ness become all but 100% explicit once Forgotten Crossroads gets infected.

What are some good ways to seek out new pins and/or upgrade my nail? There's plenty to explore in the meantime, but I am pretty sure these bouncy knights are not dying until I make myself a little stronger.
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  #218  
Old 11-09-2018, 10:05 AM
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I played through this recently.

I think it's overall good with a lot of interesting design happening in it (the mechanics of mapping are my favourite), but tonally and aesthetically I don't connect to it at all, and that just about kills it for me. Doing something of this scale starring a cast and setting of insects is in theory 100% what I want, but the specifics of that in Hollow Knight aren't what I find compelling about bugs in most cases. The biggest example of that dissonance is the--to me--totally uninteresting recontextualization of bugs into a tiresomely portentous narrative about fallen kingdoms, entropic demise and a very human-informed hero's journey arc. This is where the Souls influence lies at its barest, and it's not a perspective on the goings-on of bugs that I really care much about. When the final battle dawned and all I saw was echoes of Gwyn, Artorias, Gehrman, the Soul of Cinder--all of them sickeningly "epic" or tragic big boys with swords--the game's title and the boss's name took on a whole new personal meaning.

The other point of criticism I have concerns mainly the game's choices in colour palette. Shades of blue are its dominant colour, with significant patches of the world where that gives way to greens or browns, and independently there isn't an issue here. Unfortunately the game wields that palette with a monochromatic principle, reserving alternate hues almost exclusively for contrasting pops in the environment like bright orange globs on dim blue backgrounds. When a game world is this vast to explore and traverse, visual interest is paramount in maintaining engagement, and the approach here made the experience more taxing than I would have liked.

The denizens of the world itself embody aspects of the above points. Almost all are garbed in white masks of various designs, and then occupy a similarly reserved spot on the colour spectrum--dark greys, blues and reds, rarely in combination with each other. This is hugely disappointing when bugs found in the real world are anything but reserved in their displays of colour about themselves. Combined with the decision to make most of them anthropomorphic to gel with the largely human-slanted setting, it left me more disengaged with all the various creatures able to be met in the game, who do display creativity in visual design but are hampered by a sense of uniformity about them otherwise.

While I appreciate the general commitment to terming bugs who aren't specifically gendered as "them" or (less so) "it", there's a troubling premise at the heart of Hollow Knight's obfuscated story. The kingdom of Hallownest and its prominence, innovations and reign were instigated by the Pale King, an entity who is gendered male. A man builds, creates and oversees, we're told. The same kingdom's downfall and the world's ongoing crisis that's the entire set-up of the game were then, in turn, brought down and about by the Radiance, a female figure in the game and potentially its ultimate enemy. There isn't much direct characterization for either of them, but their positioning and the roles they have in the game say a lot without having to. The Radiance makes femininity and all that derives from it in Hollow Knight's world a sickness, a literal infection, a madness to be contained, sealed away and forgotten. In this way, the game's kinship to Souls is also established and maintained. There are a few instances of homosexual couples in the game, and it just so happens that the lesbian couple are past tense with one half in mourning for the death of the other, while the masculine gay couple have a chance to happily cohabitate.

I think the game is good in the ways that are often discussed, but not particularly when it comes to the stuff I tend to gravitate to and value. That's the reason why I ultimately found it conflicting.
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  #219  
Old 11-16-2018, 12:28 PM
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i loved everything about this game, and i knew that i would after watching my girlfriend play it for 5 minutes. didn't know it was a combination of all of my favorite games. very surprising.

anyway, i'm glad i read the above post right after finishing it because, while i didn't bounce off of it for any of those reasons--some of them, like the limited palette, are things i even liked or at least found evocative--they, especially the positioning of male and female characters, are all absolutely valid criticisms of the narrative genre the game belongs to at large. but, after thinking about why that criticism still didn't sit right with me i came away with my own queer understanding of things.

while the pale king is absolutely the creator-god, Gwyn type, in every way, i never really thought we were supposed to think of him as some "good guy" opposed to a theoretical "bad guy" in the radiance, especially considering Gwyn (and Manus, and the Soul of Cinder)'s positioning in their games/expansions as final bosses. that is to say, while Gwyn is the final boss because he lost his mind in linking the flame, i always viewed him as an oppressive figure--one to be opposed, rather than rejoiced. so to was my understanding of the pale king. while he is credited with creating the bug's entire "world" and bringing them intelligence, he still demands worship and fear of his bearers. for instance: the fact that the moth tribe rebelled against their own creator to worship him read to me as cultural conquest, rather than as an example of how absolutely awesome he was. (also, if the radiance demands mindlessness of its subjects, how was the moth tribe even capable of revolting against her?)

additionally, i don't necessarily view the radiance as all that evil; i read her more as angry at being betrayed and using that anger, either directly or indirectly, to destroy the kingdom they betrayed her for. i didn't view them as instances of good or evil at all; the pale king is in every sense the christian God i have come to loathe so entirely, while the radiance is just fucking mad at what's happened to it.

finally, we have the three characters who ultimately do destroy the radiance: the knight, the hollow knight, and hornet. all characters who are female or genderless. but the way i view it, i suppose, is that the only reason they also don't have to go out of their way to deal with the pale king is because he's already dealt with. he's dead, man. he failed. he failed at the hands of a woman, sure; but all that says to me is that the woman is stronger than the man; the group of non-binary and women, stronger still.


anyway, i don't want to deal with the hall of the gods so i'm not gonna see the final endings, i also never beat the coliseum or delivered the flower. and i'm fine with that? i think i'd probably try to get all the achievements, as i usually do for soulsbornes, were it not for the "100% the game on steel soul mode" sounding absolutely uninteresting to me. could maybe see myself going for the speedrun ones if i come back to the game in a year or two, though.
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  #220  
Old 11-16-2018, 12:54 PM
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That's a better reading than mine, I think. My own take was likely influenced by the other less-than-flattering opinions I had about the game, and the general suspicion I have about anything that so deliberately invokes so many aspects of Souls games when it comes to gender.

I don't think the game specifically reduces the Radiance and Pale King to uncomplicated "good" or "bad" sides of a conflict, just that the imagery, concepts and themes around both and the way they operate within the game's larger world and narrative are explicitly gendered in way where I can't tell if they're purposeful commentary or unexamined propagation. It's the connotation rather than the text that bothers me more about them.
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  #221  
Old 11-16-2018, 01:04 PM
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that's totally fair i think; i'm more just sharing what i came away from the game with than insinuating some type of intended reading. in the same way you say your reading is influenced by the rest, i'm likely giving them too much benefit of the doubt because i loved the rest of the game so thoroughly.
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  #222  
Old 11-16-2018, 09:40 PM
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Pretty fun game, about 7 hours in. Boss fights are a real highlight and the atmosphere is solid. I don't quite think it'll turn into an all-time classic (some levels can be pretty bland at times...) but I recommend it for anyone into metroidvanias.

Bouncing off the posts above, I will say that I like the game a lot more when it's trying to do its own thing in terms of atmosphere, focusing on its unique insect world, and not this tiresome somber Souls-like thing.
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  #223  
Old 11-19-2018, 12:18 PM
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Ooh ooh did you catch the "a safe space for you! and you! and you!" dialogue you get for whacking the Collector with the dream nail.

It sorta breaks out of the vocabulary and setting of the game to be explicit about having a weirdo reactionary agenda. It's strange.
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  #224  
Old 11-19-2018, 12:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Epithet View Post
Ooh ooh did you catch the "a safe space for you! and you! and you!" dialogue you get for whacking the Collector with the dream nail.

It sorta breaks out of the vocabulary and setting of the game to be explicit about having a weirdo reactionary agenda. It's strange.
That is very much not the read I got on that character, although the read I did get is problematic in a different way on it's own. The Collector is a portrayed as having gone mad, or always being mad, and the game often equates madness with evil, so I saw it as a parallel to the kinds of people who have been driven to obsession about the SJWs and shit. Using mental illness as a source of evil is a classic Bad Trope so it's really not any better this way, but the game doesn't come across as having shitty reactionary politics because of a character that's been designated as evil is saying evil things.
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  #225  
Old 11-19-2018, 05:17 PM
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There are some really goofy things like that in this game that do bring it down. Some pretty bad voice acting in certain places and goofy-looking character designs can mess with the atmosphere. I wouldn't usually make such a big deal about those sorts of things but aesthetics are huge in metroidvanias. Little things like that are very noticeable, especially when they're otherwise solid in this game.
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  #226  
Old 11-20-2018, 12:08 AM
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I think some of the goofier characters designs are a pleasant contrast to the Souls-y glumness the game bumbles through at times
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  #227  
Old 11-20-2018, 08:14 AM
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Yeah, I think the sillier characters (Cornifer, the grown Grub, etc) add levity, which is needed. The voice acting is all nonsense talk, so I'm not even sure how I would really criticize those performances. None of the voice work stood out to me as "wow, that took me out of the experience."
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  #228  
Old 01-03-2019, 03:52 PM
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I'm playing this. The more I play it, the more I love it. Like, I'm lying in bed but want to continue playing.

Just beat the Mantis Lords after defeating that teleporting boss. The Mantis Lords are super amazing and one of my favourite boss fights ever, reminding me of the excellent bosses in Megaman Zero. The music added to the felling of a dance. Great experience, including how they bow to you afterwards.
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  #229  
Old 01-13-2019, 05:10 PM
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At 100 % now, despite missing a mask piece. I had a lot of fun with the game, but two or three of the breakable walls are placed in a way that I find absurd. For example, the entrance to the Hive. The breakable wall is not on ground level and above spikes, so you can't even test the wall, and have to shoot from afar. Am I supposed to hit every single wall in the game to find this? There are a handful of other examples that also seem too well hidden to figure out on my own. That said, I really like that breakable floor crumbles when you stand on or walk over it. That's enough for me.

Also, why do I have to fight Hollow Knight every time before fighting against Radiance. The fight is really easy by now, it just wastes a few minutes, which feels like a complete waste of time.

Aside from these two complaints, I really enjoyed the game. It never grabbed me, as it does a lot of other people, but the world is fun enough to live in that I didn't mind looking everywhere again just to find the missing charms. But in the end, I don't care for the lore, and every time someone talks in weird, unclear sentences I lose focus. A minor gripe, as everything else is so good, end especially the boss fights are a joy.

Speaking of bosses, I love the one-on-one fights. Mantis Lords is still my favourite in the game (even though it strictly doesn't fit the criteria), and Hornet, Hornet 2, Hollow Knight and the Traitor Mantis Lord are all great too. I wasn't much of a fan of the fights agains a bunch of enemies, though. The battle system just feels better fitted to one oponent. Worst example were the Watcher Knights. I know, every boss can be beaten without taking damage, but these guys just felt like big jerks.

Anyway, the circus guys are still left to beat, and I'm looking forward to more bosses. And the Trial of the Fool. And then it will be time to not playing this game again for a few years. After over 30 hours, I start to want to play something different.
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  #230  
Old 01-13-2019, 08:48 PM
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I ran into those problems, too. Regarding The Hive, I knew the entrance was somewhere in that area. I ended up checking a map, still ended up looking in the wrong place, and finally backtracked to the right screen and found the wall. Tricky stuff.

Also, agree on that particular fight. Not fun at all. Give me a better checkpoint!

There's a lot of DLC I didn't really mess with, but you're right. Putting in 30 hours was exhausting, so I had to switch to something completely different. I ended up going with Shadow of the Tomb Raider, which of course saw me put over 30 hours into it, too...

...which is why I went old-school today and played some Gateway to Apshai for Colecovision. (We're doing pre-Famicom games over at Hardcore Retro Gaming this month.)

Still, great game, and despite its length, it didn't feel like it had a ton of filler.
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  #231  
Old 02-11-2019, 10:19 AM
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Hornet DLC reveal coming the 14th
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  #232  
Old 02-11-2019, 01:27 PM
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Announcing a DLC reveal in the future is a very annoying move, but at least it's only 3 days away. I'm very interested in seeing what this will be! Hope it isn't too far out.
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  #233  
Old 02-11-2019, 01:31 PM
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Oh, I thought the DLC itself was comic out on the 14th.

My startled excitement has abated.
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  #234  
Old 02-14-2019, 03:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Octopus Prime View Post
Oh, I thought the DLC itself was comic out on the 14th.

My startled excitement has abated.
And rekindled.

Silksong isnít DLC, itís a sequel. Hornet has a kind of Specter Knight-y vibe, going by the trailer (which I canít link to on mobile).
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  #235  
Old 02-14-2019, 05:22 AM
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Silksong isnít DLC, itís a sequel. Hornet has a kind of Specter Knight-y vibe, going by the trailer (which I canít link to on mobile).
But I caaaaaan!

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  #236  
Old 02-14-2019, 05:55 AM
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But I caaaaaan!

trailer
That was amazing. I had a few minor quibbles with the first game, but overall I adored it. An entire sequel? With Hornet? Yes, please.
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  #237  
Old 02-14-2019, 06:04 AM
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A sequel?! Already?! But Becksworth, it came out two years ago and... QUIET YOU!
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  #238  
Old 02-14-2019, 06:16 AM
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Holy shit holy shit holy shit
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  #239  
Old 02-14-2019, 06:39 AM
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Side note: kickstarter backers of the original get this for free. I may not be as enamored of HK as some other people but I do like Team Cherry.
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  #240  
Old 02-14-2019, 01:25 PM
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holy shit holy shit holy shit
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a bug's strife , atmospheric platformers , better than metroid 3? , buggin' out , bugtroidvania , hollow knight , metroidvania , team cherry , weird bats

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