The Return of Talking Time

Go Back   The Return of Talking Time > Talking about media > Talking about TV and film

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 05-18-2018, 10:06 AM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default (Spoilers!!) The X-Men Cinematic Universes (Wolverine/Deadpool/New Mutants/SEO/XSEO)

These are different from the other Marvel movies!! They take place in a different universe (multiple, actually!) and have different merits and flaws! There are fewer of them and they are cheaper. (did you know every MCU movies still costs like 20 dollars? obscene) Deadpool 2 is out now; future installments will be re-tooled indefinitely. Spoilers are free to roam in this thread, unencumbered by blue backgrounds or white text.

I’ve re-watched a bunch of these movies lately. (1-3, Wolverine 1, the 2 Deadpools) Only The Last Stand is truly bad. Most of these movies have been wiped from continuity at this point, but X-Men: The Last Stand especially did not happen. X-Men Origins: Wolverine is in no way a worse picture because it’s got some visually thrilling bits. TLS is just a witless bummer.

In general this franchise is faithful to the structure of comic books. You wouldn’t think there would be two mutually contradictory introductions of “teen Cyclops” but there are. There are multiple iterations of several characters. Everything that happens is subject to immediate time-travel based revision. There is some incredible comic book age convergence going on. (everyone becomes “about 27” as soon as possible and stays there) Did u know: the original trilogy took place “in near the future”? (2007?) Compare to: Resident Evil. If Paul Anderson introduces something bonkers at the end of one installment, he’ll still bother to resolve it in the next one even if he doesn’t feel like making a whole d*ng movie about it. Not so here. (the RE films are of course more labors of love than these)

The New Mutants should have been released already, but they are re-tooling it to make it scarier but will keep their questionable casting decisions. Dark Phoenix is in the 90s. (anywhere from 8 to “vaguely longer than 8” years before the first X-Men). Jennifer Lawrence is still going to be Mystique, which is a shame, because I bet Rebecca Romijn would give a better performance and have a better time. (I did watch 20 minutes of First Class last night and I was surprised at how not-bad Lawrence was. she totally checks out later, though)

Last edited by Pizzarino Sbarro; 05-19-2018 at 05:57 AM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 05-18-2018, 10:16 AM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

I didn’t think “Deadpool isn’t as self-aware as it thinks it is” was a very interesting critique of the first film, but it’s how I feel about the second, I’m sorry to tell myself. (in particular: lotta dead women here to motivate men and it’s one aspect played entirely straight) The emotional through line of this film is incoherent. They kill so many random people to stop an awful adolescent from turning into a murderer, because he needs to be 18 before he can wantonly murder like his friends. I’m an extremely easy person to choke up, so I was like, “aw” when DP nobly sacrificed himself, but the movie not-unexpectedly undermined that for some okay jokes.

I can recognize New Zealand accents immediately now. Good.
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:07 PM
sfried's Avatar
sfried sfried is offline
Fluffy Prince
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 2,959
Default

A lot of people seem to really hold Logan in high regard. I've seen it and it's a quality film, but I wonder why people at the same time comment how they've lost faith in Brian Singer's X-Men films...
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:12 PM
Patrick's Avatar
Patrick Patrick is offline
of the Black Falcons
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Pronouns: he, him
Posts: 19,706
Default

Logan is violent, so young people think it's mature. That's not to say it's a bad movie, I thought it was well made. I just didn't think it was considerably better than The Wolverine or X2. Also, I don't mean to paint all of it's fans with the same brush. The violent = mature audience makes up at least some portion of its fanbase, and that's a big part of the reason why it has such a large following, but the specific reasons people alike it are going to vary a lot from person to person.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:17 PM
Pajaro Pete's Avatar
Pajaro Pete Pajaro Pete is offline
so exciting!
 
Join Date: May 2008
Posts: 19,885
Default

the original trilogy predicted iceman being gay by having him date both rogue, a girl whom he can never touch, and kitty, a girl who can become intangible at will.

the last stand is great because there are a lot of scenes in the first half of the movie that are clearly reshoots for hallie berry because she's the only one in frame and her face is right smack dab in the center of the screen and also she uses a different accent than she does when she's in shots with other actors (the last stand is also great because Literal Lightning Goddess Storm does her little "There's no such thing as a cure for mutantism because there's nothing wrong with being a mutant" speech twice in a row, once to Rogue, the girl who physically cannot touch another person without nearly killing them, and then to Beast, a man who has been transformed into a giant blue monster)
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:18 PM
Inactive Blacksmith's Avatar
Inactive Blacksmith Inactive Blacksmith is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 860
Default My boss told me about this so it's trending or he was just at Walmart

Check out your local Walmart for the limited time items!

Source
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:19 PM
YangusKhan's Avatar
YangusKhan YangusKhan is offline
does the Underpants Dance
 
Join Date: May 2011
Location: Colorado
Pronouns: he/him
Posts: 7,516
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by sfried View Post
A lot of people seem to really hold Logan in high regard. I've seen it and it's a quality film, but I wonder why people at the same time comment how they've lost faith in Brian Singer's X-Men films...
I like Logan a lot because it has literary qualities to it, certainly moreso than any other X-Men movie so far. That's pretty much the biggest reason.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:28 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

About halfway through First Class now and it has some series highs and lows. The writers and performers are having a lot of fun here - the characters and setting are more interesting than past entries. Magneto and Xavier flirtatiously picking up the team is great. OTOH it’s kinda appalling that Darwin, whose deal is that he survives whatever, dies like a punk. Bad form! Mystique is already bad again (will never get better) and the scene where everyone gets a mutant codename via icebreakers is (bad) goofy. It was straight-up silly when Magneto was impressed with his new random nickname.

Definitely agree it’s fun to read gay Iceman into these movies; that was a pleasure these past few days.

An example of dumbness in TLS is when Magneto is sending his pawns off to get slaughtered in the boring final battle. “In chess, the pawns move first!!” fifteen seconds later “that is why the pawns go first!!!” no shit you weirdo.

oh there’s a clip:
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:30 PM
Octopus Prime's Avatar
Octopus Prime Octopus Prime is offline
Mystery Contraption
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: The Great White North
Pronouns: He
Posts: 49,376
Default

If I were to give credit to Last Stand for anything, and lord knows it’s hard to, it would be that one shot near the end of the film when Jean is perfectly still, and everything around her is being torn to shreds and flying upwards into the air.

Looked very Boss.

And I am now out of compliments for that movie. Thanks for reading.
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:36 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

It’s a relic from an era where franchises were all trilogies, for better or worse. (in this case, certainly worse) Now the series just kind of anarchically flits about, with no long term plan. This can’t last, but that’s what the series is about: everything dies, and it doesn’t really matter.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:40 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

No, the franchise is about evolution: the verifiable scientific theory that every few hundred thousand years, people get superpowers. (this voice-over shows up in each of the first three movies)
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 05-18-2018, 12:41 PM
Alex Scott's Avatar
Alex Scott Alex Scott is offline
Better be the real thing.
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 5,935
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by YangusKhan View Post
I like Logan a lot because it has literary qualities to it, certainly moreso than any other X-Men movie so far. That's pretty much the biggest reason.
I honestly thought it felt kind of Cormac McCarthy-ish.

...Cormac McCarthy if he wrote about mutants, psychics, and action scenes.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 05-18-2018, 01:14 PM
Zef's Avatar
Zef Zef is offline
Find Your Reason
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: The Vortex World
Posts: 31,277
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NavelsAreNeat View Post
It’s a relic from an era where franchises were all trilogies, for better or worse.
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 05-18-2018, 01:21 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

There is more hand-acting in X-Men: First Class (sometimes accompanied with magic energy blasts) than in any X-film I’ve recently seen, and it feels exquisitely sarcastic. Magneto and Riptide are champs and have a wave-off late in the film.
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 05-18-2018, 03:53 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

The Wolverine: Many ninja flip around. Laudable! Viper is ridiculous. Amazing facial expressions combined with preposterous expository dialogue that seems ADR’ed. Love the couple of times she just describes her whole deal, though I don’t really need more of that. (“I’m a nihilist... a capitalist... a Viper.” “...helps that I’m IMMUNE to the poison of mankind!”)

Last edited by Pizzarino Sbarro; 05-18-2018 at 04:20 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #16  
Old 05-18-2018, 04:02 PM
Octopus Prime's Avatar
Octopus Prime Octopus Prime is offline
Mystery Contraption
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: The Great White North
Pronouns: He
Posts: 49,376
Default

My favorite part of The Wolverine was when The Wolverine did open heart surgery on himself by just hacking his torso open and rooting around in there like he was trying to find some loose change in the couch.
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 05-18-2018, 04:19 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

That was really tense. He needed tons of screens to show the robot in his heart, but the screens got messed up so he had to root around blind. And the person whose one power was to accurately predict deaths had assured him that this was going to kill him. He was about to die, forty minutes before the end of the movie, for sure.

Both The Wolverine and Deadpool 2 have lady dream ghosts. The former’s is a figment of the male lead’s imagination and better for it. Ideally, there would be no dream ghosts at all, but I’m happy Famke Janssen got some work.

I’m kinda sad that so many people in the final moments of First Class just die off-screen! What a fun adventure we almost had with them. But it’s the nature of this series to mutate... to evolve...!
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 05-18-2018, 05:54 PM
Torzelbaum's Avatar
Torzelbaum Torzelbaum is offline
????? LV 13 HP 292/
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Central Illinois
Pronouns: he, him, his
Posts: 13,230
Default

What does Search Engine Optimization have to do with the X-Men movies?
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 05-18-2018, 05:58 PM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

Couldn’t search for “x-men” in thread titles. Maybe because it’s just searching for “x” and “men”, and both of those are too short to be searched for? (I don’t know how any of this works) I was noting my need for SEO? XSEO stands for eXtraordinary Search Engine Optimization.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 05-18-2018, 08:36 PM
four-so's Avatar
four-so four-so is offline
PROGRAMMED BY NASIR
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Louisiana
Pronouns: ♂
Posts: 5,296
Default

Deadpool 2 is fun if not necessarily funny. Well, not as funny as the first one but the scenes during the end credits almost make up for it. The operatic singing during some of the setpieces at the end are also beautifully ridiculous.
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 05-18-2018, 08:42 PM
Rascally Badger's Avatar
Rascally Badger Rascally Badger is offline
This Guy
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Hell, Earth
Posts: 10,444
Default

I just posted in the movie thread about it, but aside from Brolin as Cable, or at least the idea of Brolin as Cable since he is not a character in this movie, and Zazie Beetz as Domino, I thought Deadpool 2 was shit.
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 05-18-2018, 09:13 PM
Excitemike's Avatar
Excitemike Excitemike is online now
Space Prez
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 15,932
Default

Yeah, it has it's moments for sure, but it does something so lazy and cretinous in the first 10 minutes and I just could never get past it. There's a pretty solid 45 minute cut of this movie, I would say.
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 05-18-2018, 09:14 PM
Excitemike's Avatar
Excitemike Excitemike is online now
Space Prez
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 15,932
Default

Also that 45 minutes would *not* include TJ Miller.
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 05-18-2018, 11:05 PM
Olli T's Avatar
Olli T Olli T is offline
concentrate
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 8,594
Default

I liked DP2! It was a sequel with more of the same, and it didn't try to be anything more. I was even able to look past the fridging, because it was played as kind of a red herring - DP wasn't motivated by it (or revenge), but instead he had to emotionally process the loss. That was surprisingly mature for an action movie about dick jokes!
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 05-19-2018, 04:02 AM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

I was sad that X-Force died, lol. Go back for Zeitgeist, Deadpool!! For Shatterstar!

The movie was at no point self-aware about Vanessa’s death, as far as I could tell. The joke in the credits was “can you believe we did this?” In fact, I could.

Last edited by Pizzarino Sbarro; 05-19-2018 at 07:52 AM. Reason: You don’t have to hide spoilers in this thread but that should’ve been in the title. Apologies.
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 05-19-2018, 05:01 AM
Wendell's Avatar
Wendell Wendell is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 2,293
Default

Whoa, hide those spoilers, Navel! What the heck?!
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 05-19-2018, 06:03 AM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

Sorry you had to see that! I put in the OP that you don’t have to hide spoilers in red and highlighted it. Now it’s bigger. Can’t change the thread title on my own, as far as I know.

Spoilers are everywhere here! Unhidden!
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 05-19-2018, 07:44 AM
estragon's Avatar
estragon estragon is offline
この世の最も無智なる者
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Posts: 18,610
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by NavelsAreNeat View Post
I was sad that X-Force died, lol. Go back for Zeitgeist, Deadpool!! For Shatterstar!

The movie was at no point self-aware about Vanessa’s death, as far as I could tell. The joke in the credits was “can you believe we did this?” In fact, I could.
Were X-Force basically just a marketing campaign for social media who get killed off immediately, or do they get some time to do anything?
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 05-19-2018, 07:51 AM
Pizzarino Sbarro's Avatar
Pizzarino Sbarro Pizzarino Sbarro is offline
Senhor Member
 
Join Date: May 2010
Posts: 6,398
Default

They die pretty much immediately after they’re introduced. (Domino survives, is rad) They have time for: someone to make a joke or two about their name/powetset. Very efficient.
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 05-19-2018, 07:55 AM
Octopus Prime's Avatar
Octopus Prime Octopus Prime is offline
Mystery Contraption
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: The Great White North
Pronouns: He
Posts: 49,376
Default

My favorite running joke in the X-Men Movies was sadly dropped after 2; wherein Wolverine automatically assumes he’s the main character and thus every plot point revolves around him.

And Magneto sighs and informs him that, no, he’s not. He’s just some guy thats hanging around.
Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
berserker barrage , pero-x-ide , x-men

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:45 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Your posts ©you, 2007