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  #211  
Old 01-24-2018, 12:32 PM
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All right. Everyone's sent me their assorted stuff, so let's see how the Shady Character likes their new contraband!



They like it juuust fine. And coming from as famous an alchemist as JBear, they're happy to pay the extra coin necessary to make it worth his while.

All right lads, time to go shopping!
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  #212  
Old 01-24-2018, 12:46 PM
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I need something nice enough to celebrate my newfound zest for life. I think I have just the place in my new lab for that lovely Crystal Cabinet. I'll give the shopkeep directions so he can have some strapping young lads deliver it for me. I'll give turtle a friendly wave on my way out the door. You should have gotten here a bit earlier, turtle? They have some really nice stuff in today! I'm sure you'll pick up something nice.
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  #213  
Old 01-24-2018, 12:48 PM
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aturtledoesbite aturtledoesbite is online now
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I--

Bu--

Wha--

JBEARRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR

*cries into my new altar of gold*
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  #214  
Old 01-24-2018, 12:53 PM
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And since they get the Altar for free and don't need gold for literally anything else, they can immediately blow all of their gold on it for 4 reputation.

Mogri. You can have a mirror! I guess, if you really want one? I'm so sorry.
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  #215  
Old 01-24-2018, 01:37 PM
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Mogri Mogri is offline
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I don't see any reason not to buy the mirror?

If there is one, please let me know
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  #216  
Old 01-24-2018, 01:39 PM
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You can trade gold in for victory points at a 3:1 ratio at the end of the game.

If you somehow don't think you'll have enough reputation to get 2 VP off of it (and also don't plan on spending any of your 6 gold for the rest of the day), you may want to save your money.
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  #217  
Old 01-24-2018, 01:47 PM
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Right. Scoring at the end of the game goes like this (not that there will be many ways to influence it at this point):
  • Reputation becomes victory points (and thus loses modifiers for high/low rep).
  • Victory points for grants and artifacts are awarded.
  • All favors in hand are cashed in for 2 gold apiece.
  • Gold becomes victory points at a 3:1 ratio.
  • Theory board and answers are revealed. Correct theories award victory points as per starred seals on them, incorrect theories lose 4 victory points if not properly hedged, as per debunking.
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  #218  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:20 PM
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OK, I think at worst I'll break even. One Mirror, good sir.
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  #219  
Old 01-24-2018, 02:25 PM
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All right, you all have some debunking to do. Go nuts!
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  #220  
Old 01-24-2018, 03:10 PM
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Alright, I'm riding pretty high, so it's time to get dangerous. Now, I've never experiment with feathers. Birbs squick me out, frankly. I've never even so much as touched a feather. HOWEVER, I have read some Poe, and I can say definitively that Feathers drive people insane!
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  #221  
Old 01-24-2018, 03:19 PM
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  #222  
Old 01-24-2018, 03:24 PM
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I also wish to claim that scorpions, being inhabitants of the accursed desert, will in fact make you insane!
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  #223  
Old 01-24-2018, 03:32 PM
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What? No they don't. Get the heck out of here, you nerd. You don't get that 2 reputation back, either.
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  #224  
Old 01-26-2018, 01:38 PM
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Toads. I've never seen one in person, but I have worn the frog suit in Mario 3. They sure don't make you Agile...
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  #225  
Old 01-26-2018, 01:42 PM
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NUH-UH ITS JUST SUPER TECHNICAL YOU DON'T KNOW HOW TO USE IT

Anyway you don't lose reputation for this failed debunk because your rep is already low enough. That was a completely risk-free action for you!
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  #226  
Old 01-26-2018, 02:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by aturtledoesbite View Post
I also wish to claim that scorpions, being the freakiest animal on Earth, will in fact make you run for your life!
FTFY
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  #227  
Old 01-26-2018, 02:20 PM
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See, now THAT'S a debunk!



Care to make an immediate publication on either the scorpion or the R- alchemical?
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  #228  
Old 01-26-2018, 03:04 PM
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Alright, that's it. I'm never taking Mogri seriously on anything ever again.
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  #229  
Old 01-26-2018, 06:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalir View Post
Care to make an immediate publication on either the scorpion or the R- alchemical?
I don't suppose I can do both? No?

Fine. Let it be known that scorpions are venomous, speedy, and crafty. In my strongest remaining seal -- this is the last round, after all.
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  #230  
Old 01-26-2018, 06:16 PM
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All right, aturtledoesbite has one theory to publish, followed by two from dtsund, and then we're off to the exhibition!
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  #231  
Old 01-26-2018, 07:17 PM
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Before I publish my theory... here, JBear, I made you some lovely lotus-extract tea.

Just...just don't look at what I'm publishing. You would likely just scoff at it anyway.

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  #232  
Old 01-26-2018, 07:28 PM
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And that gets you a grant, too! Which leaves dtsund to publish their two final theories.
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  #233  
Old 01-27-2018, 02:51 PM
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The other day, I was walking along, and I saw a small, innocent, furry creature eat a fern. Within seconds, it started acting erratically, before seizing up and foaming at the mouth. And then a fox came along and ate the easy prey, and the same things happened to it! It keeled over and died, and when a vulture ate it, it died too!

Please join me in helping to eradicate ferns from the face of the earth. Nothing good can possibly happen when you use one for any purpose.

Oh, and feet are mostly good, if you don't mind the paralysis.
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  #234  
Old 01-27-2018, 03:09 PM
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So that's our theory board after our publications.

Mogri decided to submit their exhibitions ahead of time. First, they wished to demonstrate that they could make an insanity potion, which is always a crowd pleaser.



Which he does, and gets 1 reputation.

Now, if he could mix up a wisdom potion on top of that, he'd get 3 reputation, 1 for the correct call and 2 for displaying mastery over potions of thought.

But unfortunately, they're going to demonstrate a poison as their second potion.



They still do it and get reputation, but it's just not the same, y'know?



And with that, the final turn of our game of Alchemists comes to a close. Here's the final look at this board...



And our final theory board, with the rep boosts from the exhibition and the Top Alchemist award.

I'm going to be doing some end of round calculations on my end, as well as writing up a post about how the game went, so as to leave you all properly in suspense for a bit. Have fun!
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  #235  
Old 01-27-2018, 03:39 PM
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So, the first part of scoring is that reputation immediately becomes victory points. Which means Mogri's Magic Mirror locks in at a value of 1 victory point. Sorry mate.

The first thing we check for score is artifacts.
  • dtsund has no artifacts and as such, gets no points.
  • Mogri gets 1 point from their Magic Mirror.
  • aturtledoesbite gets 1 point from their Discount Card and 2 from their Printing Press.
  • JBear gets 1 point each for the Periscope and Hypnotic Amulet, 6 points from the Silver Chalice, and 8 points from the Crystal Cabinet.

Next up, the grants you obtained. Everyone has 1 grant, but Mogri's grant was from the middle, which means it's only worth 1 point. Everyone else gets 2.

After that, any Favor cards you still have in hand are cashed in for 2 gold apiece, and gold is cashed in for victory points at a 3:1 ratio. Which means Mogri and aturtledoesbite get 1 point each.

And now it's time for The Big Reveal. This is what it all boils down to: did you really master the secrets of the universe?



This is the set of alchemicals for game code VXPR, which I used to administer the entire game. How many of them did each of you figure out?



Well, it took most of the game to do, and there's still no theory on the feather, but every theory that is out on the board is correct. And according to what everyone told me in their own findings, they had much of the board sussed out anyway, and it was more due to a lack of resources (time/money) that they weren't able to put out more seals.


While JBear is obviously the uncontested winner, I want to talk about how the game played out compared to games I've personally seen. This will all go in the spoilerpop below.


I'll tackle this on a round by round basis. The first round was about how Alchemists usually goes: one or two players goes for an artifact, but mostly everyone just starts testing and seeing what they get. The triple-neutral was startling to be sure, but whatever, that didn't in and of itself ring any major alarm bells.

That all changed during the second round, where people immediately went to publishing. I have played this game a lot, but I've NEVER seen a game that published as aggressively as this one with as little info as everyone had. But behind the scenes, it was actually a little worse than expected, for the following reason.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mogri
So, funny story

I really thought I had Scorpion + Toad = Health instead of Wisdom. I have all my notes around that.

I think I'm screwed. I'm screwed, right?
In case this game didn't make it apparent: making an error in your notes is EXTREMELY LETHAL. Mogri didn't discover this mistake until the fourth turn, but they confidently threw good seal after bad onto misinformed theories. The second round was kind of worrisome with all the publications, but the third round, well...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Champagne Room
[1:46 PM] Kalir: remember: Mogri still has a second theory to publish.
[1:46 PM] Kalir: let that sink in.
[1:47 PM] Kalir: they have missed both 5 star theories and are about to go for a third.
[1:47 PM] Kalir: the next conference is going to be a bloodbath
[1:47 PM] Asakura: DEBUNK
[1:49 PM] Kalir: also: two people know that the mushroom is poisonous.
[1:49 PM] Kalir: aturtledoesbite hedged green despite a very solid train of thought.
[1:49 PM] Kalir: he has transmuted himself into a steak dinner for dtsund and JBear
Basing your theories off of the information provided by other players is a risky move, although it can pay off bigtime if you are careful to base it off of what they would actually know and hedge against. This was dtsund's strategy for the lategame. Unfortunately, this stops working against opponents who have made their own serious mistakes in their notes. Between that and aturtledoesbite's overzealous publications (frequently made worse by the alchemicals they wanted to actually use being taken), dtsund was eaten by inaccurate rivals.

This isn't to downplay JBear's skill. They legitimately did well. I should note, however, that they were also lucky in a number of areas. Basically anything one player did to another (i.e. almost all of the publications and debunks) couldn't touch them, because they hedged correctly (mostly) and published accurate theories, which means that everyone was tearing each other apart while JBear went into the final round to...

Quote:
Originally Posted by IRC
[12:35:09] <Kalir> jbear: how would you like 5 gold
[12:35:18] <jbear> I would like it very much!
[12:35:27] <jbear> I've going to spend it on turtle's delicious tears!
[12:35:30] <jbear> I'm*
[12:37:26] <aturtledoesbite> jbear pls no
[12:37:28] <aturtledoesbite> pls
[12:37:29] <aturtledoesbite> ;_;
[12:37:38] <jbear> Turtle. Turtle, listen.
[12:37:57] <jbear> A cabinet that nice.
[12:38:04] <jbear> Needs a home that's nice enough to match.
[12:38:12] <jbear> Someplace successful.
[12:38:52] <jbear> You can have a very nice mirror instead, to keep in your dingy closet.
[12:39:50] <aturtledoesbite> Kalir, jbear is being mean to meeeeeee
[12:40:19] <Kalir> yeah im posting this in the champagne room
[12:40:24] <jbear> lol
[12:40:45] <Kalir> this is like backstage WWF except instead of two large musclemen its a large muscleman punting a small child across the room after knocking the ice cream out of their hand
[12:41:00] <jbear> LOL
[12:41:15] <jbear> It works because turtle is a literal child.
[12:41:19] <jbear> Give me your ice cream, turtle.
Wow. What a bully. You're not invited to my birthday party, JBear.


Anyway this game was super fun to run for all of you, I hope you enjoyed it! I'll provide a link to the champagne room if you want, although there wasn't much activity save for me.
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  #236  
Old 01-27-2018, 04:13 PM
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Thanks for running! While I completely embarrassed myself in the front half of the game, I did get my act together eventually. It wasn't enough to keep me out of last place, but I'm happy with my deductions. I independently figured out everything but the flower and fern, and I used the flower in my final exhibition anyway, since I knew it had to be R-.

I can confidently say that I will do better next time I play Alchemists
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  #237  
Old 01-27-2018, 04:20 PM
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The only thing I wish I might have done

was to try to standardize each letter in my publications, to give it that real "printing press" feel
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  #238  
Old 01-27-2018, 04:24 PM
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Yeah, a lot of my publications were based on the notion that if someone publishes with a five-star seal, they probably weren't wrong in two different ways...
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  #239  
Old 01-27-2018, 04:32 PM
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Mogri Mogri is offline
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A lot of my publications were based on wishful thinking, though
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  #240  
Old 01-27-2018, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kalir View Post
Anyway this game was super fun to run for all of you, I hope you enjoyed it!
I know I did! Thanks for much for running it!

I'm curious how the rest of ya'll were organizing your data. Here was my spreadsheet going into turn 5:


I initially just had one grid, but early on I realized that I could get a lot of mileage out of assuming that each of you correctly identified the one aspect that you had information on with your respective first publishes, so I started maintaining two grids in parallel: one that assumed your initial publishes were made in good faith, and another that did not. Eventually, however, the two resolved into one anyway, and by the end I was able to fill out the entire grid.
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