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  #9841  
Old 10-19-2017, 10:35 AM
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I watched Voyager season 4's "Retrospect" last night, and the episode's conclusion and ultimate message made me a little uncomfortable.

So Seven uncovers repressed memories that a skeevy merchant assaulted her in a very thinly veiled rape metaphor, and an investigation is launched. Each piece of evidence uncovered yields ambiguous results which could be explained by either side's story, and yet at one point the entire cast (minus Seven) seems to suddenly agree that the allegations were completely spurious, and that Seven somehow concocted extremely specific false memories pertaining to this guy from trauma she experienced during her assimilation. Merchant dude has already bugged out at this point, fearing the damage the charges will do to his reputation (I don't know why he thinks fleeing the magistrate will insulate him from being charged in absentia???), and when Voyager goes after him to give him the good news that he's definitely totally innocent, he attacks them and blows himself up. Janeway then delivers this sad speech about how the entire Voyager crew bears responsibility for his death (what) and Seven is super remorseful about having made the allegations that caused this """tragedy""" in the first place (also what)

The whole thing just feels kind of gross and irresponsible in a world where rape allegations are too often disbelieved and the victim blamed/threatened for marring their assailant's reputation. Even just going by the story beats alone it didn't make sense to me that this pile of evidence that didn't particularly point one way or another suddenly amounted to "this assault could definitely never have happened!" They just didn't yet have proof that it did. I dunno, man. I'm aware that recovered memories are super unreliable, but tackling that relatively niche issue feels like it comes at the expense of doing a disservice to rape/abuse victims in general.
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  #9842  
Old 10-19-2017, 05:45 PM
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Yeah, I had a similar reaction when I got to that episode awhile back. Has not aged well at all.

Anyway, wrapping up Season 5!

Relativity: Y'know, way back as Voyager was winding down and we knew a new series was coming, but before we learned any actual details about Enterprise, I was certain they were going to do a series based on the Federation in the far future, and their 'time ships'. A series that could have episodes set anywhen they want in all of Star Trek history, with an eye on maintaining the timeline would have been interesting, I thought. Of course, time travel tends to invite nothing but headaches so maybe it's for the best it didn't happen. Still, considering when DS9 started it had some TNG in its first episode with Picard and Sisko, and when Voyager started the ship first docked at DS9, they could have kept up the 'new series gets started with some guest appearances from the previous one' thing going by linking it to this episode of Voyager.

But anyway, a time traveler goes crazy due to too much time traveling and decides to blow up Voyager. All of the Voyagers. Seven of Nine is recruited by the Federation TIME COPS to stop him and save the timeline, and probably create about fifty paradoxes in the process by the end. Womp womp.

Warhead: The Doctor's program is overwritten by the AI of a sentient bomb. I'm pretty sure one of his lines at some point is literally "I AM A BOMB." Eventually the bomb learns how not to be a bomb just in time to be a bomb when it counts, just in a heroic way.

Godspeed, noble explosive.

Equinox I & II: Ehhhh, probably the weakest season finale/premiere. Not a huge fan of this two-parter, especially with how Janeway's character is taken on a real roller-coaster in the second part, becoming incredibly vengeance-driven to the point of relieving Chakotay, nearly killing a hostage, and straight-up kidnapping some aliens, only to flip back to her original temperament during the climax so fast it gave me whiplash. Also features an uncomfortable sequence of an ethics-deprived Doctor torturing Seven with... singing.

But hey! New background crew members for the last two seasons who will be super important I bet! (lol)

Last edited by SpoonyBardOL; 10-21-2017 at 02:08 PM.
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  #9843  
Old 10-22-2017, 08:34 PM
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Iím liking Discovery better after I mentally switched it to the Mass Effect show, instead of Star Trek.
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  #9844  
Old 10-23-2017, 10:40 AM
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Discovery's 6th episode was pretty good. The interplay between Burnham and Sarek, as well as the elucidation of Sarek's motives, felt pretty natural and like the logical progression of everything we've seen in Star Trek previously.

Also, big fat Enterprise and Spock namedrops.

Also wik, Discovery is getting renewed for a Season 2, so it seems DIS is officially a resounding success so far.

Quote:
Originally Posted by John View Post
Iím liking Discovery better after I mentally switched it to the Mass Effect show, instead of Star Trek.
Considering Mass Effect was the thing Bioware made because their Star Trek game proposal got denied, I always considered Mass Effect to be Star Trek with the serial numbers filed off to begin with.
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  #9845  
Old 10-23-2017, 11:11 AM
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Stamets be trippin' on spores, yo.
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  #9846  
Old 10-23-2017, 07:44 PM
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It makes total sense that there should be lots of "far outs" and "groovy" being thrown around. It's contemporary to TOS, set during the big 60s retro fad of the 23rd century!

I enjoyed that episode, though I hate to admit that I don't seem to find Burnham's story as interesting as I wish I did. I'm more interested in Lorca at this point, the rogue admiral Star Trek archetype given top billing.

Though I haven't found a thing to love about the show yet, I do still look forward to it every week.
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  #9847  
Old 10-23-2017, 07:54 PM
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Anti-Federation Vulcan logic extremists is some good-ass lore, and the first thing that Discovery has introduced to the greater series' canon that I'm un-reservedly into.
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  #9848  
Old 10-24-2017, 04:00 AM
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I dunno, I had the exact opposite reaction. A faction of extremists might make the Vulcans a little less, I dunno, monolithic, but the name.... wow, that name. Logic Extremists. I keep picturing fedora-clad youtube douchebags.

Besides most of that I kind of liked most of this episode, I think? Saw that 'surprise' at the end coming a mile away, though.

Anyway, more Voyagers!

Survival Instinct: Voyager comes across a few ex-Borg who just so happened to be part of the same cluster as Seven, ie: They're a bunch of ex-Of Nines. Y'know, Voyager keeps tripping over all of these ex-Borg since they first entered their space, I guess separating from the collective is easier than the Federation thought. Kinda makes Picard's wanton murder of his assimilated crew in First Contact look incredibly cruel, in retrospect. Oh well!

Anyway, the ex-Borgs are very unhappy with Seven because it turns out that back when they were still Borg Buddies (....Borddies) they were all briefly disconnected from the collective and regained their individuality, but while the others were assimilated as adults and were super pumped to be people again Seven was assimilated as a child and just could not deal with being not a drone, so she ends up forcing them all back into the collective, and does some crazy Borg brain surgery on them to force their compliance. This has the side effect of keeping the three of them linked even after separating from the collective. They eventually find a way to sever their collection, but at the cost of their lives after a month or so. They all opt to sever the link and live their remaining days in peace within their own minds, and Seven gets to feel super guilty about how she inadvertently condemned these people because she just could not deal that one time.

Barge of the Dead: B'Elanna dies and goes to Klingon Hell except not really. Also faces her Mommy Issues and Klingon Guilt. I thought this episode was silly when I first watched it, and I still do.

Tinker Tenor Doctor Spy: This, on the other hand, is a different kind of silly. Not 'Bride of Chaotica!' silly, but in that ballpark. The Doctor decides to install daydreaming protocols to his program (because the last time he tinkered with it without telling anyone worked out great) which is good harmless fun until a group of paranoid aliens tap into his daydreams somehow and start believing all his fantasies about being a holographic Captain Amazing and decide to launch a pre-emptive strike on Voyager. Oops. Ridiculous episode, but an entertaining kind of ridiculous, especially that first scene where the Doctor dreams up Tuvok going through pon farr and saves the day by singing at him.
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  #9849  
Old 10-24-2017, 09:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Peach View Post
Anti-Federation Vulcan logic extremists is some good-ass lore, and the first thing that Discovery has introduced to the greater series' canon that I'm un-reservedly into.
These aren't really new concepts to Star Trek though. There were isolationist logical extremists on Vulcan in TNG and ENT. The later of which explored the idea and ramifications very thoroughly.
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  #9850  
Old 10-24-2017, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by SpoonyBardOL View Post
Ridiculous episode, but an entertaining kind of ridiculous, especially that first scene where the Doctor dreams up Tuvok going through pon farr and saves the day by singing at him.
I love changing to words to songs to be about what I'm currently doing, so that scene really tickled me.

Ep 6 of DISCO felt like a pretty classic trek story, and the B-plot with Lorca was interesting. Dude is really scary, and the fact that he's being so nice to Michael and Ash seems kind of ominous and manipulative now. He's becoming some kind of overbearing dad with tons of rage and paranoia bursting from the seams. Obviously he doesn't intend to change his ways or get help, or rescue Admiral Cornwell since she is now a threat to his command. The war has dropped into the background such that there's basically a few minutes of exposition at the beginning and a tiny scene at the end to place the episode in context.
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  #9851  
Old 10-25-2017, 06:34 AM
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I canít believe how good the preview for next week was. Iím so ready for that insanity!
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  #9852  
Old 10-25-2017, 07:39 PM
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is Lorca Voq?

1. Same timeline as Michaelís
2. Special interest in Burnham
3. Was aboard ship to recover telescope
4. Weird scars
5. Admiralís accusations possibly literal
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  #9853  
Old 10-25-2017, 09:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpoonyBardOL View Post
Equinox I & II: Ehhhh, probably the weakest season finale/premiere. Not a huge fan of this two-parter, especially with how Janeway's character is taken on a real roller-coaster in the second part, becoming incredibly vengeance-driven to the point of relieving Chakotay, nearly killing a hostage, and straight-up kidnapping some aliens, only to flip back to her original temperament during the climax so fast it gave me whiplash. Also features an uncomfortable sequence of an ethics-deprived Doctor torturing Seven with... singing.
Equinox is why I can't look at Tuvix in isolation.
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  #9854  
Old 10-26-2017, 04:46 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chud_666 View Post
is Lorca Voq?

1. Same timeline as Michaelís
2. Special interest in Burnham
3. Was aboard ship to recover telescope
4. Weird scars
5. Admiralís accusations possibly literal
I don't think so, but if the new Security Official is not a Klingon double agent, or maaaaaaaybe even a Klingon himself, I'll eat my HAT*

Also, the end arc seems to be that Michael will become a mutineer again - she'll have to stand up to Lorca when he goes too far. Mark my words.

I dislike that Michael is the never before seen-or-mentioned sister of Spock's. Way to shoehorn her into the middle of the ST lore; we know how well that worked with Sybok. But besides that, I did like the retro-fitted explanation of why Sarek doesn't approve of Spock joining the Federation.

Today's continuity bit that had me grinding my teeth: Discovery has a Holodeck?!?!? At least this one didn't try to kill the crew.


* HAT = Hamburger and tomato
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  #9855  
Old 10-26-2017, 05:58 AM
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On the disc holodeck: TAS Enterprise had one. Roddenberry felt TAS wasnít canon, but he was also against ST6 being canon.
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  #9856  
Old 10-26-2017, 06:19 PM
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Continuing on with Voyager...

Alice: Voyager comes across a space junkyard/used car lot and its totally trustworthy salesman that winds up selling them an old shuttle that isn't at all haunted. And it's not, but it does have a rather malevolent AI aboard that winds up getting into Tom's head, literally, forcing him to do crazy out of character things like fight with B'Elanna and neglect his responsibilities and disobey orders and take crazy risks trying to fly into a space hole. That's not the Tom Paris I know!

Riddles: So my first impression of the whole Tuvok/Neelix dynamic was 'oh great they're trying way too hard to recreate the Odo/Quark chemistry' and a lot of the Tuvok/Neelix episodes just did not work, for me anyway. But this one does. Voyager encounters xenophobic Delta Quadrant alien race #10395 and they blast Tuvok with a weapon that, while deadly to most other races, merely scrambles his Vulcan brain, erases most of his memory and makes him rather helpless, and it's up to Neelix to teach him all the things. And Tuvok winds up becoming a really jovial guy who likes Jazz, and Desserts, and smiling and having emotions and stuff! But then the xenophobic alien plot resolves itself and The Doctor is able to science up a cure to reset Tuvok's brain back to Vulcan and at first he doesn't want to because he LIKES being Neelix's buddy and having feelings and stuff. We almost have a Tuvix situation on our hands, but Tuvok eventually relents and everything goes back to normal. Except the episode more or less confirms at the end that, yes, Tuvok actually is rather fond of Neelix. D'aw.

Dragon's Teeth: Voyager falls into some space thing which turns out to be a super fast subspace highway which takes them 200 light years in five minutes, but they're thrown out by the owners of said highway who don't much like intruders. In trying to escape Voyager is forced to land on a planet where the find an alien race in stasis who turn out to be the REAL owners of the space highway, the Vaadwaur. They strike a deal to help them find a new world to colonize and in return Voyager will get to use their super secret space highway, but there's shenanigans and back-stabbings and before you know it everyone is fighting each other and Voyager manages to get away. We learn a bunch of Vaadwaur ships escape and Janeway comments 'we'll be seeing them again...' except, not really. Maybe they show up one more time? I think? But they turn out to be a bit of a nothingburger, at least until returning in Star Trek Online anyway.
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  #9857  
Old 10-29-2017, 09:52 PM
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1x07 of DIS: Rainn Wilson hamming it up as Mudd is actually amazing. Also, I really liked this genre-savy spin on the classic time-loop episode. It's great that DIS skipped all the boring setup of "omg, we're stuck in a time loop!" and got down to work. And having people being aware of the time loop and acting to out smart each other within its constraints was a lot of fun. As was watching Lorca eat it repeatedly. DIS is a bretty gud TV show.
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  #9858  
Old 10-30-2017, 02:41 AM
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Yeah, I'd say this is my favorite episode of Discovery so far, seems like they have a better grasp of the cast, and they handled the sci-fi trope in a smart way.

Anyone else expect Michael to talk to that other bridge officer from the Shenzou at the end there? Every time this episode mentioned Michael's past regrets or anxieties it always put her in the shot, and the end of the episode has Michael mentioning how she finally feels like she fits in, and there she is again, but nothing. That conversation has to happen eventually.
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  #9859  
Old 10-30-2017, 07:53 AM
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And that other officer was getting a piece at that party! Good for her!

Also: gormander!
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  #9860  
Old 10-30-2017, 11:33 AM
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Really fun episode! Iím in love with Rainn as Mudd now.
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  #9861  
Old 10-30-2017, 06:55 PM
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Rainn Wilson as Mudd turned one of the worst aspects of Star Trek into one of its best. If Discovery is going to continue to get renewed and builds multiple seasons, I hope he becomes a reoccurring antagonist in the same vein as Q. Because so far his portrayal of Mudd is worthy of putting up in that highest echelon as John de Lancie and Jeffrey Combs.
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  #9862  
Old 10-30-2017, 07:54 PM
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Yeah, I don't have a lot to add, but: hot damn, that was an episode.
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  #9863  
Old 10-30-2017, 07:58 PM
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Hereís our review of the latest episode. I appreciate any views!

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  #9864  
Old 11-01-2017, 08:50 PM
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Since I watched the first three episodes of Voyager, all I've done Star Trek-wise is watch a dozen episodes from DS9's first two seasons. I guess Voyager is good for something after all.
^Me, three months ago.

We picked Voyager back up because why not. We've seen all of TNG and DS9, watched many of our favourite episodes over again, so why not give Voyager more of a shot.

10 episodes in and the joke's on me that, of all first seasons of modern Trek, it's Voyager's that's legitimately the best one. Phage and The Cloud were both fairly strong and Eye of the Needle, State of Flux, and Prime Factors were all excellent. This is easily the strongest set of episodes of any first season (and I'm not even done yet), even if a bit less ambitious than DS9's wider scope and world building.

I am stunned. But also nervous. I figure the show will eventually earn the reputation I've been hearing about for nearly two decades. Oh well. Live in the moment, I guess.
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  #9865  
Old 11-02-2017, 08:05 AM
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^Me, three months ago.

We picked Voyager back up because why not. We've seen all of TNG and DS9, watched many of our favourite episodes over again, so why not give Voyager more of a shot.

10 episodes in and the joke's on me that, of all first seasons of modern Trek, it's Voyager's that's legitimately the best one. Phage and The Cloud were both fairly strong and Eye of the Needle, State of Flux, and Prime Factors were all excellent. This is easily the strongest set of episodes of any first season (and I'm not even done yet), even if a bit less ambitious than DS9's wider scope and world building.

I am stunned. But also nervous. I figure the show will eventually earn the reputation I've been hearing about for nearly two decades. Oh well. Live in the moment, I guess.
Voyager does not suck. When it and ds9 were on simultaneously, I preferred VOY for a long time. But! It has issues. One of which is the uselessness of most of the cast, the other is how it doesn't ever live up to it's premise. But still! Lots of legit great eps. Their two parters are especially good.
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  #9866  
Old 11-02-2017, 09:45 AM
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So is there just one more episode of DISCO before the break? Or was this week's the last one?
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  #9867  
Old 11-02-2017, 09:52 AM
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So is there just one more episode of DISCO before the break? Or was this week's the last one?
2 more. it's 9 and 6.

Final one of the year is on the 12th
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  #9868  
Old 11-02-2017, 10:23 AM
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Awesome thanks!

I thought the episode 7 was fun, but my wife was annoyed that they used a pretty well-trod framing device, and she also haaates the actor that plays Mudd. It's weird seeing a party in Star Trek that doesn't look totally lame. I was a little unclear on one thing. Was Ahs's and Michael's final gambit formed in reaction to Stamets giving up, or was Stamets' surrender part of the plan? It just seemed weird for him to do that and I feel like I missed something.

Also the less captain-centric perspective of this show made it possible to show Lorca getting completely clowned on, repeatedly, in a way that I don't think they would have every dared with any other captain. That was great.
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  #9869  
Old 11-05-2017, 09:38 PM
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Oh nooooo, a cliffhanger! Lots to chew on in that Discovery episode, though. And fun to see a first contact situation for the first time in quite a while, even if the planet was sort of sprung on us out of nowhere. There sure is a whole lot that's gonna have to be covered up real good at the end of this series such that the rest of ST history never comments on it...

(Disclaimer: I'm not a ST lore nerd by any means, so discount the last bit if this place has actually been heard of before.)
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  #9870  
Old 11-06-2017, 01:58 PM
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Discovery!

Decent episode, I guess the mid-season break has a two-parter. I kinda wish they were a bit more clear regarding what happened to the Admiral (is she actually dead? Did L'Rell only knock her out? Was she playing her the whole time and always intended to kill her in the hallway to impress Kol?) but maybe it'll be clarified next week. Getting more character focus on Sulu Saru was good, though the shots of him running were kiiiiiinda creepy.

Voyager!

One Small Step: Voyager encounters some space thing which just so happens to have stopped by Mars back in 2036 and picked up a shuttle with some poor jerk inside. Turns out Chakotay is just the biggest fan of that poor unfortunate soul and becomes REALLY INTENT on salvaging anything they can from shuttle no matter what it takes, including disobeying orders from Janeway. He nearly gets the away team killed and Seven becomes rather cross with him for taking such a huge risk for frivolous reasons, but she winds up getting sentimental while salvaging the shuttle and her Borg heart grew three sizes that day I guess and she makes sure to grab the remains of the pilot so he can be spared an eternity drifting through space in a metal tube to get a PROPER space burial. Still drifting through space in a metal tube, but a smaller, nicer one.

Most impossible thing to believe in this episode is that we would have manned Mars missions by 2036. We'll never see that crap at the rate we're going.

The Voyager Conspiracy: Seven starts downloading data from Voyager's computer directly into her cyber-brain. How much? All of it. All of the datas. It becomes too much and she soon is unable to tell what's what, and in trying to make sense of it all she comes up with just the wackiest conspiracy theories. At least they were wacky for the year 2000. They look positively quaint in today's environment of Fake News. Anyway, Janeway manages to keep her from turning into Alex Jones. Oh, and Voyager shortcut alert: 3 years closer to home, in this episode.
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