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Balrog
(He/Him)
A while back someone (eirikr, I think) was talking about SMB2 and said Mario is good at everything but isn't great at anything in that game and that's kinda how I view the NSMB games. They're good, well designed, Mario games but they're not great at anything. Sure, there's some one off things like the Starry Night stage but overall they're just good. Personally, I'd much rather play any of the other 2D entries.
Sarge
hardcore retro gamin'
I will say, I greatly enjoyed both the original NSMB (I really liked the throwback simplicity), as well as NSMB Wii. That game, despite my physics niggles, has some fun design going on. Strangely enough, though, I'm not very high on NSMBU. It was firmly "decent" for me, but nothing special.
I want to amend my earlier answer to the question of this thread to "not a goddamned thing"
I loved New Super Mario Bros., and probably put more time into that than any other entry in the NSMB series, maxing out the score counter. It used to be something I'd play before going to sleep, before smart phones kind of overtook that spot. I liked how the spotlight was put more on Mario's core abilities, and the power-ups served to enhance them.
NSMBWii was pretty cool, though Nadia and I never quite effectively gelled with the multiplayer. The return of the Koopalings was cool.
NSMB2 was... okay. It felt uninspired. The coin gimmick was neat and I love the Gold Flower, but... I feel like in terms of premise, they really didn't do much here. The coins don't factor into the story, the Koopalings just show up and take Peach because that's just what happens now, I guess. It felt like going through the motions, and that's without getting into if there was ever a time to bring Wario in, as a playable character, an antagonist, or both...
(I am glad that it gave us some sunset and nighttime levels again, but those were in the hidden worlds, and only for a level or two, rather than anything longer lasting. I always loved those in the original Mario games. Well, more night time than sunset, but you get my meaning.)
NSMBU is probably the best of the whole lot. If you're only going to play one NSMB game, make it this one (and NSLuigiU is good, too). This one is clearly where all the inspiration went, since it came out around the same time as NSMB2. Making Peach's castle the end of the game instead of the beginning was a great subversion, and giving Bowser's airship that big robot fist to use as a persistent threat throughout the game was great, too. Really, my only issues with this one are a) Penguin Suit (best power-up of all time) is rarer than I'd like, and b) I really just don't get much out of the Squirrel Suit, to the point I almost actively avoid it unless I just really need to glide.
Incidentally, I always liked the graphics, though the minute changes from one game to the next kind of dulled things as they went along. Same for the music, bahs and all. Physics, I thought Mario felt fine in the original, perhaps even better than ever before to me, though I can't say the later ones don't feel maybe a bit tighter. But the first one just clicked with me.
NSMBWii was pretty cool, though Nadia and I never quite effectively gelled with the multiplayer. The return of the Koopalings was cool.
NSMB2 was... okay. It felt uninspired. The coin gimmick was neat and I love the Gold Flower, but... I feel like in terms of premise, they really didn't do much here. The coins don't factor into the story, the Koopalings just show up and take Peach because that's just what happens now, I guess. It felt like going through the motions, and that's without getting into if there was ever a time to bring Wario in, as a playable character, an antagonist, or both...
(I am glad that it gave us some sunset and nighttime levels again, but those were in the hidden worlds, and only for a level or two, rather than anything longer lasting. I always loved those in the original Mario games. Well, more night time than sunset, but you get my meaning.)
NSMBU is probably the best of the whole lot. If you're only going to play one NSMB game, make it this one (and NSLuigiU is good, too). This one is clearly where all the inspiration went, since it came out around the same time as NSMB2. Making Peach's castle the end of the game instead of the beginning was a great subversion, and giving Bowser's airship that big robot fist to use as a persistent threat throughout the game was great, too. Really, my only issues with this one are a) Penguin Suit (best power-up of all time) is rarer than I'd like, and b) I really just don't get much out of the Squirrel Suit, to the point I almost actively avoid it unless I just really need to glide.
Incidentally, I always liked the graphics, though the minute changes from one game to the next kind of dulled things as they went along. Same for the music, bahs and all. Physics, I thought Mario felt fine in the original, perhaps even better than ever before to me, though I can't say the later ones don't feel maybe a bit tighter. But the first one just clicked with me.
As someone who enjoys all of the NSMBs except for 2 (because I haven't played it), I agree that it feels sluggish, especially going from a dead stop to a run. On the same tangent, you throw Koopa shells instead of dropkick them, and it just feels immensely less satisfying and slower. I don't know if the actual speed of the thrown/kicked shell backs me up here, but that lack of impact with the kick really takes the air out of the action.
I want to give a shoutout to one of the best and most slept-on Mario power-ups there is: the blue shell. Finding out where you can get the space to build up a dash, and finding out just how far you can go without breaking up a dash (sometimes needing to bounce backward in order to advance) is my favorite part of the first NSMB. It's great for fighting bosses, it gives you superior swimming, AND crouching makes you immune to contact damage from enemies (and fireballs)! It takes a platformer and makes the platforming more intense and fun. What a gem!
I want to give a shoutout to one of the best and most slept-on Mario power-ups there is: the blue shell. Finding out where you can get the space to build up a dash, and finding out just how far you can go without breaking up a dash (sometimes needing to bounce backward in order to advance) is my favorite part of the first NSMB. It's great for fighting bosses, it gives you superior swimming, AND crouching makes you immune to contact damage from enemies (and fireballs)! It takes a platformer and makes the platforming more intense and fun. What a gem!
I’m playing WiiU now cause of this thread. Never played it before (only Luigi U). Loads of secrets. I’ve come close to timing out on every stage because I’ve been hunting.
that’s something I like about the New subseries, it encourages to you poke your nose into corners because hey, you might at least trigger some hidden coins if nothing else, a nice little reward that’s always worth the detour.
that’s something I like about the New subseries, it encourages to you poke your nose into corners because hey, you might at least trigger some hidden coins if nothing else, a nice little reward that’s always worth the detour.
NSMBU is a very good game that I ended up completing with Nabbit because for a series ostensibly aimed at kids, they sure keep cranking the difficulty up with each entry.
If they do another 2D Mario (I'm sure they will), I really hope they leave New behind and give us something, well, actually new.
Like this:
Like this:
My (shallow, poorly considered) opinion is that the poly 2D style just doesn't really dazzle for whatever reason. The issue is visual, not necessarily mechanical.
This is of course my excuse to say, I'd love to see a New-er Mario platformer with new pixel graphics (not otherwise derived from am earlier title). I'd just like to see what Nintendo would do with it.
This is of course my excuse to say, I'd love to see a New-er Mario platformer with new pixel graphics (not otherwise derived from am earlier title). I'd just like to see what Nintendo would do with it.
Nah, U is the only game in the series I haven't finished, because whatever else it does right, it's the worst in one critical measure -- time wasted in post-death load screens. The whole "get kicked out the world map" thing is totally fine in SMW where it's a basically instantaneous screen wipe, and acceptable in the earlier NSMB games where it's just a couple seconds. But NSMBU does a death animation, followed by a 5-7 second black load screen to get back to the world map, then another animation of getting kicked out of the level, followed by (since I've been mashing A this whole time) an animation of jumping back into the level, followed by another 5-7 second load screen before you actually get back control.
It's a minor thing in the big picture, but it just winds up sapping any momentum and enjoyment from the game for me. I'm not even normally all that sensitive to load times, but taking time to unload and then reload the level I'm trying to play through feels like an insult in a way that just taking some time to load the next area that I'm deliberately trying to get to doesn't. Especially since this is such an unforced error, as almost everybody else (even stablemates like 3D World and DKC Tropical Freeze) has figured out that it's better to assume the player wants to try again and drop them back to a checkpoint or the beginning of the level, with the option to exit from the menu if they want.
That aside, though, the series is fine, albeit a bit vanilla. I generally enjoyed playing through the others, though I agree with those who would wish for a bit more experimentation and imagination.
I don’t like 3D graphics in a 2D game. They always seem so imprecise about they take up on a 2D plane. With pixels you know where you are.
NSMB series has always been the absolute worst of them for me. I misjudged so many jumps or positioning that I lost my patience.
This might seem silly or fantastical but it’s true. I also think the NSMB art style is ugly but that’s another issue.
NSMB series has always been the absolute worst of them for me. I misjudged so many jumps or positioning that I lost my patience.
This might seem silly or fantastical but it’s true. I also think the NSMB art style is ugly but that’s another issue.
i only played the first nsmb very much. beat it on a copy my brother bought during a week we were helping him move stuff back from omaha
i liked the shell and tiny powerups, they were actually pretty funny to mess around with in spots where they weren't necessarily useful (and sometimes detrimental). but playing normally i definitely found it super easy until that last (?) tower with the snake blocks, where i died about 100 times. which really didn't leave me very excited for any of the sequels
i liked the shell and tiny powerups, they were actually pretty funny to mess around with in spots where they weren't necessarily useful (and sometimes detrimental). but playing normally i definitely found it super easy until that last (?) tower with the snake blocks, where i died about 100 times. which really didn't leave me very excited for any of the sequels
While I certainly agree with your sentiment in general, I’d say that NSMB is one of the only series of polygonal 2d platformers that doesn’t have that problem; I’ve never had the slightest issue figuring out where was and was not safe, and the camera never bothered to scoot around to muddle the issue.
My opinion has always been that 2D Mario needs to be always be reinventing itself aesthetically. Give us something handdrawn in a vintage style or even a modern style. Give us claymation. Give us a pixelly throwback. Like, just give us anything besides that plastic-y rendered style that's a decade past its expiration date.
I mean, classic Mario gave us distinct aesthetic experiences for every entry from 1 to 5. I think that would have gone a long way to reducing the sense of fatigue if they had done it again.
Mechanically, the games aren't perfect, but still quite acceptable. I don't have much to say there, other than that I admire their restraint and craftsmanship.
I mean, classic Mario gave us distinct aesthetic experiences for every entry from 1 to 5. I think that would have gone a long way to reducing the sense of fatigue if they had done it again.
Mechanically, the games aren't perfect, but still quite acceptable. I don't have much to say there, other than that I admire their restraint and craftsmanship.
I can't say for sure whether this is true of the entire NSMB series, but the first one at least was prerendered sprites: 2D with the appearance of 3D. Given that the entirety of SMM uses the same underlying engine, the NSMB theme there is probably the same, and if that's true, it may be true of the other games as well.
The DS game uses pre-rendered graphics for many things, but Mario is a polygon model. The whole Mega Mushroom item was basically an excuse to show him scale up to screen-height as an example of the fantastic newness.
By the way, while looking for that video, I found this one from 2005:
I'd forgotten how much the game changed prior to release. While the earlier video obviously consists of a lot of mock-ups, here you have the game looking close to its final form but with many differences: different music, Nintendo already trying to get co-op working, and SM64-style punches and kicks.
By the way, while looking for that video, I found this one from 2005:
I'd forgotten how much the game changed prior to release. While the earlier video obviously consists of a lot of mock-ups, here you have the game looking close to its final form but with many differences: different music, Nintendo already trying to get co-op working, and SM64-style punches and kicks.
Same here. I probably have a worse time with Donkey Kong Country Returns/Tropical Freeze, if even there.
Yeah, that's what I was saying above. The four New games look and sound way too much alike, and I'm ready for something actually new.
Still waiting on a game that actually looks like this:
There is stuff from that video I wish they'd kept. The sunset and nighttime levels, for one, as well as just how it looks in general. It looks Mario-ish, but less... artificial? ...than what's in the final product.