Kate thinks that Jack is a villain so the obvious twist is that he's a swell guy.
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To Infinity and Beyond: The Marvel Cinematic Universe
- Thread starter Vaeran
- Start date
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
And in the comics, the character is The Swordsman, who has both been a hero and a villain.
Just finished episode three and this show continues to be awesome and fun.
That looks awesome. More Spider-Gwen! And more Spidey 2099 (presumably still voiced by Oscar Isaacs so I have to keep questioning my heteresexuality) - but man, that Part One qualifier really is a bit of a mood killer.
Miguel looks way more jacked than expected
I noticed that. Looks a bit weird, but I'll take it (yes, we want our half-mexican Spider-verse representation)
Feige confirms Charlie Cox will remain the MCU's Daredevil.
He doesn't say when we'll see him again, though the rumors of him being in Far From Home (with every other casting rumor seemingly panning out besides the other two Spiders Men yet) that might be a safe bet. And with other Netflix cast returns now a possibility that might make Fisk being in Hawkeye a bit more likely?
He doesn't say when we'll see him again, though the rumors of him being in Far From Home (with every other casting rumor seemingly panning out besides the other two Spiders Men yet) that might be a safe bet. And with other Netflix cast returns now a possibility that might make Fisk being in Hawkeye a bit more likely?
I’m going to assume that he *really* doesn’t like spending time away from her following the Snap
That stood out to me as well, haha. Maybe he got a new phone as an early Christmas present.
I either missed or forgot how the trick arrows ended up in NYPD custody. Little help? Also I had been assuming that the watch was Tony's transforming repulsor gauntlet watch from Civil War (or one like it) but apparently not.
Yelena! Happy to see her again, and I hope they serve her character well.
I'm continuing to enjoy this series, but it feels like Kate is able to talk her way out of situations more easily than is believable or satisfying. She and Hawkeye could not have been more awkward at the table in front of her mom and Jack, but the two of them bought every stammered obvious lie, or at least appeared to. And walking up to a cop and going HI I'M AN AVENGER'S FRIEND, WILL YOU COMMIT CRIMES FOR ME? in front of a bunch of other people is... rather bold! Just makes the narrative feel a little too simple. It's not a big deal though.
Hawkeye is fine. It's entertaining enough that I don't regret spending time with it. I think the story is dragging though. I also have a hard time really caring about any of the characters here besides Yelena. Hawkeye to me, commits the cardinal sin of asking me to care about and root for these characters despite them not being particularly likable, which always creates a big disconnect.
I get the sinking feeling that Hawkeye himself will survive this show so we can have the happy Christmas moment at the end which sucks to me because Barton should probably die for any of this to be satisfying. At least, that's how I feel. But if we really want to see Kate elevated to an Avenger tier character and eventually replace Hawkeye, she needs more practice and real mentorship. Because as currently constituted, she's woefully unprepared and underskilled to do what Clint does. She can get there eventually, but if she's suddenly doing insane Hawkeye-tier trickshots in the last episode and going off to the Avengers Compound, it's gonna feel very unearned. It's just a weird situation as currently constituted. It'll be interesting to see how the show handles the finale.
I get the sinking feeling that Hawkeye himself will survive this show so we can have the happy Christmas moment at the end which sucks to me because Barton should probably die for any of this to be satisfying. At least, that's how I feel. But if we really want to see Kate elevated to an Avenger tier character and eventually replace Hawkeye, she needs more practice and real mentorship. Because as currently constituted, she's woefully unprepared and underskilled to do what Clint does. She can get there eventually, but if she's suddenly doing insane Hawkeye-tier trickshots in the last episode and going off to the Avengers Compound, it's gonna feel very unearned. It's just a weird situation as currently constituted. It'll be interesting to see how the show handles the finale.
Feel misled about how bad or boring Eternals would be. I liked it a lot? Black Widow was bad to me. Maybe it's just right place, right time, I dunno. Reminded me at times of the parts of (non-MCU) Mass Effect that many people hate but I do not. I guess it's simply not hard to impress me with some lore about giant, ancient, ostensibly pro-social civilization farmers. Most of the jokes were in the trailer and none of them really worked, but that just means there weren't countless worse ones throughout the film. And in fact the jokes weren't that gratingly bad in the context of some pretty charming scenes.
Kingo Act 3 where. Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.
Shang Chi was also good but requires no defense. Final bits setting up sequels, connecting back to the MCU worst part by a mile but who cares.
Kingo Act 3 where. Not a big deal in the grand scheme of things.
Shang Chi was also good but requires no defense. Final bits setting up sequels, connecting back to the MCU worst part by a mile but who cares.
Johnny Unusual
(He/Him)
I have mixed feelings about that movie. I think it's cool that it has a primarily Asian cast, Awkwafina kills it, and that fight on the bus is an amazing fight scene. Unfortunately the film ends with CGI whatever. But my other mixed feeling is ending the film with Shang-Chi getting the rings. Granted, I don't associate the character with having super-powers beyond fights good but I get making sure the Asian character is allowed to have great power. But it also means it will be dumb CGI power, and I would much rather stuff like the bus fight.
Spider-Man: No Time to Die is a great time at the movies. Go see it before you get spoiled.
There are mid- and post-credits scenes.
I guess I'll tackle the biggest point first. Leaks were flying left and right during production, so while I tried my best to avoid them I was not surprised, but still elated, to see the return of Maguire and Garfield, and every scene featuring the three Spiders-Men was an utter delight. Loved all the note-comparing, and the banter about the webshooters. The two visiting Spideys having never heard of the Avengers is appropriate, but still a little lonely to remember that it's apparently just them on their respective lonesomes against the forces of evil in their worlds. The way the movie leaves each of them is interesting; Maguire's Peter feels serene and at peace with himself, as though he's already completed his arc and is just here for a victory lap. (Which is really what this was.) He's still Spider-Man in his world, and things are apparently "complicated" with MJ, so it sounds like he's still going through it over there, but he has a maturity and a wisdom about him that befits the eldest Spidey. I sort of expected him to have a more dramatic entrance than Ned and MJ going "well, let's go fishing for more Peters Parker until we find the right one," but as soon as they said it you knew who was coming, so it worked.
I don't have any real affection for the Amazing Spider-Man movies, and yet was somehow still happy and excited to see Garfield. How'd they do that? (He was never the problem with those films, anyway.) In contrast to Maguire, his Spidey feels unfinished, in an intriguing way -- he's all alone, has no time for "Peter Parker stuff," and while we don't see the rage he mentions experiencing, he also doesn't say he'd moved past it. Feels like he still has some growing to do. I'm choosing to believe that him saving MJ from her fall (a moment I wanted for him since we first saw her fall in the trailer) was a cathartic event and that he can move on from here and find some of that peace for himself. Though I doubt we'll ever see it on screen.
Matt Murdock!! Between him and (Hawkeye episode 5 spoilers) Fisk's return, it really does feel like Christmas.
When Jamie Foxx first showed up, the guy in front of me said "Wakanda?" Not all black people are from Wakanda, my friend! In fact you'll find very few who are. Ask around.
Putting a big Captain America shield on the Statue of Liberty is deliriously dumb and I am here for it.
My theater cheered at Osborn's "I'm something of a scientist myself." I knew right then I had a good crowd. The villains were on the whole well--served by the film, though to varying degrees with Goblin and Ock obviously getting priority. (Glad they didn't arbitrarily add one more just to say they finally did a Sinister Six film.) Goblin was menacing in a way that was heightened and reminded you of the campy flavor of the Raimi era without going overboard, and I find Molina's performance so charming and enjoyable no matter what he's doing. The digital de-aging was flawless, too -- everyone looked great.
Cannot believe they killed May, though it feels right that she finally got to deliver the "with great responsibility" line, perhaps the second most anticipated line in the MCU behind "Avengers assemble." Her death and Peter's reaction to it were incredibly well done, and Happy's "how did you know her?" at the end was such a casual knife to the heart.
I honestly have no idea where Spider-Man goes from here. Tom Holland will want to exit the role eventually, and the world is more than ready for a live-action Miles Morales. While this would certainly be a melancholy note to finish on, I find I would strangely be okay with letting go here if this turns out to be Holland's final turn in the suit. It feels like AN ending, if not THE ending, and fitting for the closer to the Homecoming trilogy. Those who disliked this Spidey's reliance on Stark tech and a seemingly endless conga line of mentors up to this point will be pleased to see he's sewing his own no-frills suits now. Why's he getting his GED, though? Maybe going back to school and being a stranger to Ned and MJ (and everyone else) is just too painful.
If I have one complaint, it's that there's so much action, high emotion and callbacks that there's little room left for the breezy high school comedy of Homecoming and Far From Home, which gave those movies a unique, refreshing flavor within the MCU. I honestly don't know what you'd cut to make room, though, and this film gets so dark that those kinds of scenes would probably feel out of place anyway. I also wouldn't have minded J.K. Simmons having more to do.
I've never seen the Venom movies, and if they're anything like the mid-credits scene then I think I'm good without them. Happy for the Venom fans who got to see their boy in the MCU, but even happier that he was quarantined to irrelevance.
I could probably go on for a few more paragraphs but I'll cut it here. Doctor Strange 2 looks lit.
I don't have any real affection for the Amazing Spider-Man movies, and yet was somehow still happy and excited to see Garfield. How'd they do that? (He was never the problem with those films, anyway.) In contrast to Maguire, his Spidey feels unfinished, in an intriguing way -- he's all alone, has no time for "Peter Parker stuff," and while we don't see the rage he mentions experiencing, he also doesn't say he'd moved past it. Feels like he still has some growing to do. I'm choosing to believe that him saving MJ from her fall (a moment I wanted for him since we first saw her fall in the trailer) was a cathartic event and that he can move on from here and find some of that peace for himself. Though I doubt we'll ever see it on screen.
Matt Murdock!! Between him and (Hawkeye episode 5 spoilers) Fisk's return, it really does feel like Christmas.
When Jamie Foxx first showed up, the guy in front of me said "Wakanda?" Not all black people are from Wakanda, my friend! In fact you'll find very few who are. Ask around.
Putting a big Captain America shield on the Statue of Liberty is deliriously dumb and I am here for it.
My theater cheered at Osborn's "I'm something of a scientist myself." I knew right then I had a good crowd. The villains were on the whole well--served by the film, though to varying degrees with Goblin and Ock obviously getting priority. (Glad they didn't arbitrarily add one more just to say they finally did a Sinister Six film.) Goblin was menacing in a way that was heightened and reminded you of the campy flavor of the Raimi era without going overboard, and I find Molina's performance so charming and enjoyable no matter what he's doing. The digital de-aging was flawless, too -- everyone looked great.
Cannot believe they killed May, though it feels right that she finally got to deliver the "with great responsibility" line, perhaps the second most anticipated line in the MCU behind "Avengers assemble." Her death and Peter's reaction to it were incredibly well done, and Happy's "how did you know her?" at the end was such a casual knife to the heart.
I honestly have no idea where Spider-Man goes from here. Tom Holland will want to exit the role eventually, and the world is more than ready for a live-action Miles Morales. While this would certainly be a melancholy note to finish on, I find I would strangely be okay with letting go here if this turns out to be Holland's final turn in the suit. It feels like AN ending, if not THE ending, and fitting for the closer to the Homecoming trilogy. Those who disliked this Spidey's reliance on Stark tech and a seemingly endless conga line of mentors up to this point will be pleased to see he's sewing his own no-frills suits now. Why's he getting his GED, though? Maybe going back to school and being a stranger to Ned and MJ (and everyone else) is just too painful.
If I have one complaint, it's that there's so much action, high emotion and callbacks that there's little room left for the breezy high school comedy of Homecoming and Far From Home, which gave those movies a unique, refreshing flavor within the MCU. I honestly don't know what you'd cut to make room, though, and this film gets so dark that those kinds of scenes would probably feel out of place anyway. I also wouldn't have minded J.K. Simmons having more to do.
I've never seen the Venom movies, and if they're anything like the mid-credits scene then I think I'm good without them. Happy for the Venom fans who got to see their boy in the MCU, but even happier that he was quarantined to irrelevance.
I could probably go on for a few more paragraphs but I'll cut it here. Doctor Strange 2 looks lit.
There are mid- and post-credits scenes.
Yeaaahhhhhhh, I'd love to but I'm not stepping foot in a theater right now. Especially where I live.
Phantoon
I cuss you bad
Yeah, the only Marvel thing I've unreservedly liked since Endgame is Loki. Shang-chi was fun until it descended into all CGI. Black Widow was entertaining. Falcon and the Winter Soldier was vaguely competent. I couldn't be doing with What If at all. Hawkeye is the second best Marvel series for me, but it's only OK.
I... don't know how to reconcile my feelings on the MCU Spider-Man.
Like... to be clear, this was a great Spider-Man movie. It was everything I wanted, and I loved it. Yay! Great movie!
But the circumstances of the movie obviously warrant comparisons between "this" Spider-Man and the other movie Spider-Mans that fought those familiar villains. And I think about what this Spider-Man "has", and how he has used that, and how this is all in relation to his other movie appearances, and... like... I feel like this is a movie franchise with the absolute worst moral. Possibly morals! Like, Spider-Man as a concept has always had some dodgy morality if you think about it for a minute (much like all vigilante "secret identity" characters), but MCU Spider-Man is somehow... I don't know... that dude that is a billionaire because of his dad doing a slavery that won't stop telling you he's had a hard life and brought himself up by his bootstraps. He is a hero, he is particularly heroic in his motivations in this movie, but when you consider what he is actually doing versus what he has done... it's not great. There is something fundamentally dishonest about MCU Spider-Man, and I shudder to think of the lessons learned by the people that will internalize this movie as part of their personality (and, to be clear, if I was of a certain age, that would 100% be me doing the internalizing).
Anyway, I really loved this movie and am concerned for the future of humanity.
Like... to be clear, this was a great Spider-Man movie. It was everything I wanted, and I loved it. Yay! Great movie!
But the circumstances of the movie obviously warrant comparisons between "this" Spider-Man and the other movie Spider-Mans that fought those familiar villains. And I think about what this Spider-Man "has", and how he has used that, and how this is all in relation to his other movie appearances, and... like... I feel like this is a movie franchise with the absolute worst moral. Possibly morals! Like, Spider-Man as a concept has always had some dodgy morality if you think about it for a minute (much like all vigilante "secret identity" characters), but MCU Spider-Man is somehow... I don't know... that dude that is a billionaire because of his dad doing a slavery that won't stop telling you he's had a hard life and brought himself up by his bootstraps. He is a hero, he is particularly heroic in his motivations in this movie, but when you consider what he is actually doing versus what he has done... it's not great. There is something fundamentally dishonest about MCU Spider-Man, and I shudder to think of the lessons learned by the people that will internalize this movie as part of their personality (and, to be clear, if I was of a certain age, that would 100% be me doing the internalizing).
Anyway, I really loved this movie and am concerned for the future of humanity.
Everything Tony Stark touches turns to shit, and it's really no surprise that a Spider-Man with Elon Musk subbing in for Uncle Ben as his moral core would end up problematic.
To get lightly spoiler-y, this is the first MCU Spider-Man movie that I did not feel was wholly influenced by Spider-Man wanting to be Iron Man Jr. (Iron Robin? Iron Lad? No, that one was taken...), but the whole movie hinges on Spider-Man wanting to reform and "save" the various "doomed" villains of the previous movie franchises... BUT there is absolutely no reckoning or acknowledgement that Spider-Man is responsible for his own villains' deaths in ways that are generally parallel to how these villains were killed. I may have missed it, but I don't think there was even a knowing look at "oh, I know what it is like to watch a supervillain get killed by their own out of control hubris". And, like... that's weird? Like we all "know" these parallel universes are "other universes" because of studio reboots, and it kind of creates this implied false dichotomy that "other" Spider-Mans could have been as "good" as MCU Spider-Man who saved all these villains with technology and smarts and not just punching. But that's all that happens in the MCU! It's all that has happened in previous MCU Spider-Man movies! Villains don't have a great survival rate in these films! And it is GREAT that it is being addressed... but only in the context of it being a solvable problem in OTHER universes. I don't think there is a single reference to, "well, I mean, my hero Iron Man seems to have a pile of dead bad guys."
And, yes, this is something that further exacerbates my main complaint about End Game, which is that the movie found an excuse to (exclusively End Game spoilers) kill Thanos twice just to make the audience feel better.
Like, maybe I'm seeing too much into it, but there is a weird undercurrent of the MCU (and thus Disney) heroes are somehow morally "better" without addressing how they are exactly the same. Sure seems sus that the whole concept of "maybe we should stop murdering" only comes up when addressing the failures of other "universes".
And, yes, this is something that further exacerbates my main complaint about End Game, which is that the movie found an excuse to (exclusively End Game spoilers) kill Thanos twice just to make the audience feel better.
Like, maybe I'm seeing too much into it, but there is a weird undercurrent of the MCU (and thus Disney) heroes are somehow morally "better" without addressing how they are exactly the same. Sure seems sus that the whole concept of "maybe we should stop murdering" only comes up when addressing the failures of other "universes".
My opinion: This problem is in large part due to the movie format and the people who write for them. Villains live to die and re-die another day all the time in comics, but in a format that demands a few hours of your life there's just this feeling that something has to be accomplished in this hero vs. villain conflict people havd invested a chunk of time in watching play out. And usually that something is killing off the villain in one way or another.
Audiences want the catharsis of a conflict with the bad guy being resolved and film companies want one less person to worry about having to get back for the sequel. So off the building the Joker goes. Time for Doctor Octopus to nobly sacrifice himself to fix the problem he created. Let's contrive a situation to kill Thanos again under more actiony and fan servicey circumstances 'cuz nobody's gonna be satisfied with that murdering a dying old man situation we wrote ourselves into.
And Disney is definitely a part of the problem. I mean, long before they got their hands on Marvel they had done countless films where they conveniently make the bad guy go away forever. A couple were in the early days of their movie career. Many more were in the 80s and 90s. And it's still happening in many of their animated movies.
Just once I would like to see the "Villain beats hero to near-death" thing in one of these Disney movies end with the hero actually dying and the villain getting away instead of just having the bad guy disposed of by a convenient deus ex machina.
Audiences want the catharsis of a conflict with the bad guy being resolved and film companies want one less person to worry about having to get back for the sequel. So off the building the Joker goes. Time for Doctor Octopus to nobly sacrifice himself to fix the problem he created. Let's contrive a situation to kill Thanos again under more actiony and fan servicey circumstances 'cuz nobody's gonna be satisfied with that murdering a dying old man situation we wrote ourselves into.
And Disney is definitely a part of the problem. I mean, long before they got their hands on Marvel they had done countless films where they conveniently make the bad guy go away forever. A couple were in the early days of their movie career. Many more were in the 80s and 90s. And it's still happening in many of their animated movies.
Just once I would like to see the "Villain beats hero to near-death" thing in one of these Disney movies end with the hero actually dying and the villain getting away instead of just having the bad guy disposed of by a convenient deus ex machina.
Liked it. Probably haven't seen the first two Spider-Men in more than a decade (never seen 3) and haven't seen the ASMs since they came out. Really liked Garfield Spider-Man here in particular.
Don't buy the circumstances under which Holland-Man felt the need to warp reality. Would colleges actually deny reviewing their applications because of this, then admit it in a letter? I guess maybe. I don't know. Seems like they could all just do super-science elsewhere anyway. None of my business.
These movies don't have a sliding timeline! Aunt May died in like 2024 or some specific year. Don't hide that gravestone! Do the math.
Not sure I agree with the complaints about how the film is treating reforming/killing villains. Villains died in those movies, MCU pictures, generally any big blockbuster, almost entirely in battles or because there's some time-sensitive crisis or whatever. (been a while since I've seen Spider-Man 2, as a I said) Here Parker had the choice about very intentionally sending prisoners to their deaths and like nearly all blockbuster heroes, elected not to take it. None of these characters would coldly execute any villains, and Parker's not bringing any other dead ones back because these ones only came mistakenly doing something very risky he won't repeat.
Endgame also had that sad subplot with other Nebula. She's not dying to satisfy the audience at all! We want her to live because we know she can be redeemed. Perhaps the only female death in that duology that worked for me - Gamora's and Black Widow's were undermined by the fact that I knew they had subsequent movies coming up, but I guess they were supposed to count. I wouldn't really say Thanos's first death is supposed to be satisfying. It's clearly pointless! Fully agree that continuity clean-up is generally immoral and narratively frustrating.
My comic book thing that bugs the shit out of me is ending on a memory wipe to preserve a secret identity or whatever. I don't even really care about the MCU characters who will likely have more appearances but it was kind of cool to think about the other Spider-Men and their villains having memories of this adventure. I mean I guess they kind of could because apparently parts of this were preserved? They'd just forget about the MCU Peter Parker specifically? I don't know. I'm curious. Way more confused about this than the way time travel worked in Infinity War/Endgame, which not only made perfect sense to me but I actually liked. (traveling back in time isn't possible, but some universes' timelines travel at different speeds due to narrative convenience)
Don't care for secret identities in these narratives maybe because like, I know these characters' identities. Mostly an X-Men guy, and they don't do that. Maybe there's no particular reason for this preference.
Unfortunately this is making me fondly remember that episode of Buffy where Vampire Willow crossed over, apparently written and directed by Joss Whedon. RIP Vampire Willow.
Oh, what was up with J. Jonah Jameson here? Kinda had a weird role. Never met Maguire. Haven't rewatched the Raimi trilogy a lot so I wasn't very invested in his return but I don't think he did much here aside from appear semi-regularly. Fine, but maybe not as satisfying as a lot else in this movie.
Don't buy the circumstances under which Holland-Man felt the need to warp reality. Would colleges actually deny reviewing their applications because of this, then admit it in a letter? I guess maybe. I don't know. Seems like they could all just do super-science elsewhere anyway. None of my business.
These movies don't have a sliding timeline! Aunt May died in like 2024 or some specific year. Don't hide that gravestone! Do the math.
Not sure I agree with the complaints about how the film is treating reforming/killing villains. Villains died in those movies, MCU pictures, generally any big blockbuster, almost entirely in battles or because there's some time-sensitive crisis or whatever. (been a while since I've seen Spider-Man 2, as a I said) Here Parker had the choice about very intentionally sending prisoners to their deaths and like nearly all blockbuster heroes, elected not to take it. None of these characters would coldly execute any villains, and Parker's not bringing any other dead ones back because these ones only came mistakenly doing something very risky he won't repeat.
Endgame also had that sad subplot with other Nebula. She's not dying to satisfy the audience at all! We want her to live because we know she can be redeemed. Perhaps the only female death in that duology that worked for me - Gamora's and Black Widow's were undermined by the fact that I knew they had subsequent movies coming up, but I guess they were supposed to count. I wouldn't really say Thanos's first death is supposed to be satisfying. It's clearly pointless! Fully agree that continuity clean-up is generally immoral and narratively frustrating.
My comic book thing that bugs the shit out of me is ending on a memory wipe to preserve a secret identity or whatever. I don't even really care about the MCU characters who will likely have more appearances but it was kind of cool to think about the other Spider-Men and their villains having memories of this adventure. I mean I guess they kind of could because apparently parts of this were preserved? They'd just forget about the MCU Peter Parker specifically? I don't know. I'm curious. Way more confused about this than the way time travel worked in Infinity War/Endgame, which not only made perfect sense to me but I actually liked. (traveling back in time isn't possible, but some universes' timelines travel at different speeds due to narrative convenience)
Don't care for secret identities in these narratives maybe because like, I know these characters' identities. Mostly an X-Men guy, and they don't do that. Maybe there's no particular reason for this preference.
Unfortunately this is making me fondly remember that episode of Buffy where Vampire Willow crossed over, apparently written and directed by Joss Whedon. RIP Vampire Willow.
Oh, what was up with J. Jonah Jameson here? Kinda had a weird role. Never met Maguire. Haven't rewatched the Raimi trilogy a lot so I wasn't very invested in his return but I don't think he did much here aside from appear semi-regularly. Fine, but maybe not as satisfying as a lot else in this movie.
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It gets weirder when you realize that in addition to everyone's memories, all physical documentary evidence of Peter Parker's existence must have also been destroyed, or else there'd still be tons of newspapers and articles floating around online that out him as Spider-Man. "Peter Parker? Who's that? *click* Oh, he's Spider-Man." So I guess the real reason he doesn't return to school to finish out his senior year is that there's no record of him being enrolled there. Does he no longer have a Social Security number? Bank account? How'd he even rent that shitty apartment? You really fucked this kid's life up, Strange!
"Vaeran why are you blaming poor Doctor Strange for Peter's mess" Because it's Strange's mess!! He gets his feathers all ruffled over Parker screwing up his spell when he didn't think to ask some very basic follow-up questions before casting it. "Right, so you want to erase everyone's memory that you're Spider-Man. Everyone everyone? Any exceptions? Friends, family, loved ones? What about the other Avengers? What about me?"
PETER: Hi can you brainwash the world for me
STRANGE: Haha sure! Let's do it immediately and with no preparation.
Was he drunk???
Just regarding this:
Agree regarding Endgame and the ladies. Regarding Thanos, my point is that he had a dramatic, sad, unsatisfying death at the start of the movie and that felt genuinely earned: he won, beating him won't change that, and half the movie was about the heroes dealing with that. Then, like, I guess we needed a giant third act battle, so Young Thanos traveled through time just so we could have the big, grandiose victory over Thanos that the audience always wanted. Death one was unsatisfying, death two was the exact opposite. Always felt that was an awful example of having your cake and eating it, too. Really fun to watch! But left a bad taste in my mouth.
Agree regarding Endgame and the ladies. Regarding Thanos, my point is that he had a dramatic, sad, unsatisfying death at the start of the movie and that felt genuinely earned: he won, beating him won't change that, and half the movie was about the heroes dealing with that. Then, like, I guess we needed a giant third act battle, so Young Thanos traveled through time just so we could have the big, grandiose victory over Thanos that the audience always wanted. Death one was unsatisfying, death two was the exact opposite. Always felt that was an awful example of having your cake and eating it, too. Really fun to watch! But left a bad taste in my mouth.
Spider-Man impressions:
Katie and I are being extra careful due to close family who are immunocompromised. But, I knew I would be spoiled on this if I waited, so I watched a less than legal version on my laptop. Honestly, it was not the best experience and I wish I could have seen it in theaters. It was really hard to tell what was going on in dark scenes, and a lot of the movie took place at night or underground. Also, the first version I watched cut off right when the credits started, and I found another one that cut off after the first post credit scene. So I still haven't seen the last scene/trailer. So, that kind of stinks overall. But, that's just how things are nowadays. Looking forward to seeing the real movie when it comes out on Blu-Ray.
Even though the viewing experience was not great, I still really liked it. Marvel goes back and forth between making standalone movies that are loosely tied into the rest of the universe, and movies that totally depend on having seen X Y and Z previous movies. This one was absolutely the latter, and it brought in two other movie series and a TV show in addition to the regular MCU stuff. I've seen most of that stuff though, and I like Marvel's weird episodic style, so I was on-board.
The only lead up movies I hadn't seen were the Amazing Spider-Man movies. And now I want to go back and watch them, even though I heard they weren't great. Garfield Spider-Man was a really nice surprise in this one, and maybe knowing how things end up for him and his enemies will make the experience better? We'll see. Toby was great too, and I loved how naturally all three of them bounced off each other. There was a great brothers hanging out vibe that the movie just nailed. The villains were well written and acted too. it was really great to get more Otto and Norman, and to see them bounce off each other as well.
I liked where the movie ended up for Peter, except for MJ not remembering him. I think the reason that it bugs me is that it's the exact situation Quill and Gamora are in. And White Vision/Wanda is kind of similar, right? Marvel is terrified of having characters in a normal relationship. Watch out Hawkeye! But, the fact that he made his own suit, lives on his own, and doesn't have a bunch of overpowered friends to bail him out is really good. I've heard that they're thinking about a second trilogy, and I'm here for it.
Even though the viewing experience was not great, I still really liked it. Marvel goes back and forth between making standalone movies that are loosely tied into the rest of the universe, and movies that totally depend on having seen X Y and Z previous movies. This one was absolutely the latter, and it brought in two other movie series and a TV show in addition to the regular MCU stuff. I've seen most of that stuff though, and I like Marvel's weird episodic style, so I was on-board.
The only lead up movies I hadn't seen were the Amazing Spider-Man movies. And now I want to go back and watch them, even though I heard they weren't great. Garfield Spider-Man was a really nice surprise in this one, and maybe knowing how things end up for him and his enemies will make the experience better? We'll see. Toby was great too, and I loved how naturally all three of them bounced off each other. There was a great brothers hanging out vibe that the movie just nailed. The villains were well written and acted too. it was really great to get more Otto and Norman, and to see them bounce off each other as well.
I liked where the movie ended up for Peter, except for MJ not remembering him. I think the reason that it bugs me is that it's the exact situation Quill and Gamora are in. And White Vision/Wanda is kind of similar, right? Marvel is terrified of having characters in a normal relationship. Watch out Hawkeye! But, the fact that he made his own suit, lives on his own, and doesn't have a bunch of overpowered friends to bail him out is really good. I've heard that they're thinking about a second trilogy, and I'm here for it.
Regarding the ramifications of the finale of Spider-Man that is mentioned by Patrick:
Oh yeah, guess I just realized that the exact circumstances of Peter's life at the end of the film means..
A. There is a huge excuse for why there is no interaction if Sony and Disney never want to "crossover" again. Spider-Man doesn't "have to" show for any Avengers outings.
B. Save "Peter Parker" himself, there is no need for literally any other cast members to ever appear again, too. It would be nice (and may be played for secret cameo cheers), but there is not a single supporting player that could not be excused.
Ideal negotiating position for starting a new trilogy/round of contracts.
Oh yeah, guess I just realized that the exact circumstances of Peter's life at the end of the film means..
A. There is a huge excuse for why there is no interaction if Sony and Disney never want to "crossover" again. Spider-Man doesn't "have to" show for any Avengers outings.
B. Save "Peter Parker" himself, there is no need for literally any other cast members to ever appear again, too. It would be nice (and may be played for secret cameo cheers), but there is not a single supporting player that could not be excused.
Ideal negotiating position for starting a new trilogy/round of contracts.
Oh. lol. That makes sense.