Kind of an addition through subtraction, really
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The Ultimate Final Fantasy Thread: This Guy Are Knock You All Down
- Thread starter Issun
- Start date
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- ...whatever baha-blast bobby corwen caffeine free cherry bahamut zero cid's terrifying teeth did u kno the ffxiv free trial goes to hw? everybody knows dr unne final fantasy ha ha ha ha ha! i like big butz i'm captain basch! i'm here to kill chaos is mythril yummy? lali ho! let's mosey lord blast one to be born from a dragon role-playing game son of a submariner! square square enix stupid sexy balthier wah-wah about wah-wah xbox ps3 3ds nintendo wii sephiroth! sephiroth! you don't know jack garland
Honestly, the only real loss is the initial FFII endgame with all the dead guys as everything else was pretty eh.
It's just a bewildering combination of elements from the various versions of the game paired with generally killer remixed soundtracks that all generally works out pretty good (just from my experience with 1PR). I'm actually pretty curious what they did with the SNES trilogy now.
It's just a bewildering combination of elements from the various versions of the game paired with generally killer remixed soundtracks that all generally works out pretty good (just from my experience with 1PR). I'm actually pretty curious what they did with the SNES trilogy now.
I've got to the third set of jobs in FF3 yesterday, and I'm definitely pretty impressed/intrigued with all the mechanical tweaks they did with these remasters. I'm pretty curious to try FF2 now, and yeah I'll +1 Mightyblue too -- really wondering what they're gonna do for 4-6. For some FF3 specific things:
- Ranger: Barrage. 4 hits to random enemies. No white magic access.
- Scholar: Study and Alchemy, no magic charges. Alchemy replaces Item and doubles item effectiveness (so they moved this from a passive in DS version to a specific command here).
- Dark Knight: Bladeblitz. AOE damage, no self-hurting I don't think. Can't actually use it effectively yet since no weapons for it. No magic charges either.
- Black Belt: Boost and... Kick! Holy shit, Kick is great! It's even got the Yang sound effect!!
- Bard: Sing only, but I didn't buy them a harp yet. Only knows Paeon atm, which is small party heal.
- Viking: Just Draw Attacks. Because "Provoke" is too concise a wording I guess?
For the most part, the jobs seem most similar to their Famicom versions, but they did carry forward the spirit of the DS remake to try and add more active commands to some of the jobs as well. Dark Knight seems like it's rebranded as Samurai in all but name, which does make sense considering the names of their unique swords, but the sprite is definitely Dark Knight. I kind of wish they kept white magic for Scholar and Ranger from the DS changes, because I'm finally feeling the hit of not having a dedicated White Mage. Also, I haven't tried Geomancer yet.
- Scholar: Study and Alchemy, no magic charges. Alchemy replaces Item and doubles item effectiveness (so they moved this from a passive in DS version to a specific command here).
- Dark Knight: Bladeblitz. AOE damage, no self-hurting I don't think. Can't actually use it effectively yet since no weapons for it. No magic charges either.
- Black Belt: Boost and... Kick! Holy shit, Kick is great! It's even got the Yang sound effect!!
- Bard: Sing only, but I didn't buy them a harp yet. Only knows Paeon atm, which is small party heal.
- Viking: Just Draw Attacks. Because "Provoke" is too concise a wording I guess?
For the most part, the jobs seem most similar to their Famicom versions, but they did carry forward the spirit of the DS remake to try and add more active commands to some of the jobs as well. Dark Knight seems like it's rebranded as Samurai in all but name, which does make sense considering the names of their unique swords, but the sprite is definitely Dark Knight. I kind of wish they kept white magic for Scholar and Ranger from the DS changes, because I'm finally feeling the hit of not having a dedicated White Mage. Also, I haven't tried Geomancer yet.
Oh definitely; storming the gates of Heaven with all the dead NPCs is one of the better postgame dungeons there are
The balance changes for all of these sound really thoughtful. I was initially only really interested in V, but I'm tempted to try out the others as well, now.
I wonder if someone or some group will eventually mod the GBA content in, depending on how mod-able it is. If my memory is correct, almost all (literally all?) of the enemies in the new content were either pallet swaps or imported from other Final Fantasy games.
(The only game I would ever use that for is IV, but... I know there is a very vocal group of people who are at least saying that want those additions...)
I wonder if someone or some group will eventually mod the GBA content in, depending on how mod-able it is. If my memory is correct, almost all (literally all?) of the enemies in the new content were either pallet swaps or imported from other Final Fantasy games.
(The only game I would ever use that for is IV, but... I know there is a very vocal group of people who are at least saying that want those additions...)
Gahhh full collection on Switch pls
Not sure I like the sound of that. Definitely makes me less interested in getting this version of 1.
This is the same as DoS; magic was never hitting that hard compared to boss hp there either.
I hope that stuff does get modded in, which is why I bought the PC versions in case they ever are. I'd like to try the extra content in IV having never played it, and I like the extra content in VI even though it's pretty slim.
I've been keeping an eye on the modding discord for S-E pc games, and it sounds like any sort of actual gameplay mods are going to be a while due to the way Unity encrypts and compresses its files; stuff like assets are relatively easy to undo and then swap and redo the compression/encryption since those have to be discrete files but compressed and compiled code will take a long time to untangle unless they get the source code somehow.
Same issue with the other discrete asset file types; it's definitely possible (and you can pull out the audio files already), the issue is getting the other half of the CRC checksum and encryption done for the replaced files.
The games appear to aggressively filesize and CRC check everything loaded into the game, and the compares are hard baked into the code so it's not exactly going to be a drag and drop experience (unless someone releases the inevitable modpacks).
The games appear to aggressively filesize and CRC check everything loaded into the game, and the compares are hard baked into the code so it's not exactly going to be a drag and drop experience (unless someone releases the inevitable modpacks).
I finished FFII, and I feel like the change made to rows was a really big whiff all around. It tries to solve a problem that isn't actually a problem, and creates a massive issue in the late game.
It didn't matter that back row characters were not getting large, frequent HP gains. They just needed HP to survive ranged and AoE attacks, which they got by getting hit by ranged and AoE attacks, which they were able to survive just fine because those are less damaging than melee attacks. Generally a dedicated melee character would stop getting hit by melee attacks pretty quickly too and would also only be losing HP due to spells and abilities, so there really shouldn't be all that much of a difference in front/back row HP in the first place. Plus, this version (And DoS/PSP IIRC) already gives you periodic HP boosts even if you haven't been getting hit. I only had ~35 stamina all around by the end (10 came from the Mysidia Tower bonus), and still had ~3k HP on everyone.
Raw HP has never been an issue, and getting more of it doesn't protect you from any of the actually dangerous things in the game. The back row is now effectively just an HP multiplier... which doesn't protect you from any of the actually dangerous things in the game, so putting a character there is ultimately pretty irrelevant.
The big side effect of enemies being able to target the back row with melee attacks is that they spread their attacks around evenly, so none of your characters end up raising their evade level very much. I ended the game with 3 on everybody, when normally a solo frontliner would be at 8-9. This wasn't a huge issue for most of the game. Just cast multitarget Blink once or twice whenever an encounter looks like it'll take more than one turn and you probably won't take any damage. The problem comes with enemies that have debilitating contact effects on their attacks, where "probably" isn't good enough. The majority of dangerous enemies in the last chunk of the game fall in that category.
For example, Coeurls have a 7-hit instant death attack, and if one of those hits gets through, that character will die. Status resistance does not protect against contact effects, so there's literally no defense against it aside from evading every hit or killing them before they move. They also come in packs of up to six and frequently ambush, in which case you are virtually guaranteed a party wipe before even getting a turn. That happened to me ~3 times on one floor of Pandemonium alone, and there are six other enemies in that dungeon with similarly dangerous contact effects. There are autosaves every room transition, so dying basically doesn't matter at any point, but it still just doesn't feel like the row mechanics were changed with much consideration for the rest of the game in mind.
Previously you could build your party in such a way to make that situation a nonissue, but it's just not even an option now outside of solo runs. Which are probably much easier than a normal run overall to be honest. There's not even going to be any early game hurdle before you start snowballing now that you can equip two shields to cap evasion and still use unarmed attacks.
It didn't matter that back row characters were not getting large, frequent HP gains. They just needed HP to survive ranged and AoE attacks, which they got by getting hit by ranged and AoE attacks, which they were able to survive just fine because those are less damaging than melee attacks. Generally a dedicated melee character would stop getting hit by melee attacks pretty quickly too and would also only be losing HP due to spells and abilities, so there really shouldn't be all that much of a difference in front/back row HP in the first place. Plus, this version (And DoS/PSP IIRC) already gives you periodic HP boosts even if you haven't been getting hit. I only had ~35 stamina all around by the end (10 came from the Mysidia Tower bonus), and still had ~3k HP on everyone.
Raw HP has never been an issue, and getting more of it doesn't protect you from any of the actually dangerous things in the game. The back row is now effectively just an HP multiplier... which doesn't protect you from any of the actually dangerous things in the game, so putting a character there is ultimately pretty irrelevant.
The big side effect of enemies being able to target the back row with melee attacks is that they spread their attacks around evenly, so none of your characters end up raising their evade level very much. I ended the game with 3 on everybody, when normally a solo frontliner would be at 8-9. This wasn't a huge issue for most of the game. Just cast multitarget Blink once or twice whenever an encounter looks like it'll take more than one turn and you probably won't take any damage. The problem comes with enemies that have debilitating contact effects on their attacks, where "probably" isn't good enough. The majority of dangerous enemies in the last chunk of the game fall in that category.
For example, Coeurls have a 7-hit instant death attack, and if one of those hits gets through, that character will die. Status resistance does not protect against contact effects, so there's literally no defense against it aside from evading every hit or killing them before they move. They also come in packs of up to six and frequently ambush, in which case you are virtually guaranteed a party wipe before even getting a turn. That happened to me ~3 times on one floor of Pandemonium alone, and there are six other enemies in that dungeon with similarly dangerous contact effects. There are autosaves every room transition, so dying basically doesn't matter at any point, but it still just doesn't feel like the row mechanics were changed with much consideration for the rest of the game in mind.
Previously you could build your party in such a way to make that situation a nonissue, but it's just not even an option now outside of solo runs. Which are probably much easier than a normal run overall to be honest. There's not even going to be any early game hurdle before you start snowballing now that you can equip two shields to cap evasion and still use unarmed attacks.
you can do what
I'd guess it counts as shield bashing things to death?
Works for Cap
Dual shielding. Or double pissing off Alixsar.
Goofy does it all the time.
R.R. Bigman
Coolest Guy
Are FF’s 1-5 as good as 6? That game surprised me, and I may want to give the earlier games a try if they are also fun to play in the twenty-first century.
It goes without saying that they're good. You're not going to find the same kind of RPG in them, though, and ability to meet them on their own terms is entirely up to the individual. They're from a different time and have different design priorities and interests.
R.R. Bigman
Coolest Guy
I have to finish the the FFX games first, but hopefully after that these new versions of the classic games will be in a system I own.
Newcomers should absolutely try them through these remasters, if the Famicom trio are any indication of how the other three will fare. There's a lot done in them to make the vintage play experience as seamless as possible to modern sensibilities. I think only Sega Ages Phantasy Star by M2 compares or exceeds them in the treatment.
Yeah, the goal seems to be sanding the rough edges off of the original games from their original releases while giving them a fresh visual/audio presentation which I guess means the 'Remaster' part of the moniker is pretty apt then.
Modding progress proceeds apace; you can brute force replace asset files now and people are currently working on picking apart the csv (yes, you read that right) file that controls how the game controls flow and assets.
