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  #1  
Old 02-07-2009, 01:02 PM
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Default The manga recommendation/derision thread

We seem to have a thread for every other outgrowth of Japanese narrative drawing, and manga's mostly much better than anime, so shouldn't it get a thread? I propose the answer is yes. There is already a comics thread, but manga really is such a radically different beast I don't think they should be consorting.

I've been making my way through Phoenix; I just finished Karma, which was great, and definitely a big improvement after the one about the funny-faced emperor and alien things. I feel like Tezuka needs some minimum of space to make you care about his characters, otherwise they become too cardboard. I mean, all of his characters are very archetypal, not exactly Shakesperian, but... you know. Anyway, it was great! Probably my favorite thing I've read from him other than Future. I think Japan was so lucky to have him shepherding manga in its infancy. Maybe if Jerry Siegel or Bob Kane were as adventurous as him we wouldn't have had to wait so long for things like Contract with God and From Hell, or maybe those things would take up commensurate space with stuff like Superman.

I also read Devil Man recently, which was... terrible. It started out as passable trash, until it started in on this, "Look what's become of humanity! We're just like the devils!" Also, how much of manga's drive to serve up as much nude fan service as possible can be attributed to Go Nagai?

I read about ten pages of Violence Jack. What the fuck is wrong with this guy?

I like Uzumaki and the Akira manga.

Suggestions for further reading? What's great? What's shit?
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:03 PM
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Trigun.
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:05 PM
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I read about ten pages of Violence Jack. What the fuck is wrong with this guy?
I don't know, but he's not chicken.
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:08 PM
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Don't know if you people ever heard of it, but Yotsuba&! is pretty good.
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:25 PM
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King of Thorns is pretty badass. Pure whites and solid blacks, with shading only in certain small areas. The artwork is as good as the story, which has some decent twists and turns. I'm still in the process of finishing it up.
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:49 PM
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Kurogane, the 5 volume series, is entirely awesome. Zombie puppet mute samurai series have no right to be this good.

Also read 666 Satan and then wondered why. I guess talent doesn't run in that family.
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Old 02-07-2009, 01:55 PM
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Everybody derdes Sgt. Frog, but that's only because nobody's ever read it, and they'd heard it sometimes depicts panties. And the TT community has declared it is decidedly anti-panty. But! It also has a lot of really good humor, parody and satire. It definitely has a lot of crossover appeal - I've gotten several people who normally don't like manga to start reading it. Oddly enough, it seems like the people I know who like it the least are manga fans, so I don't know what that says.

Fullmetal Alchemist is pretty solid, and I've always loved Ranma, but neither of those are exactly obscure.
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Old 02-07-2009, 02:02 PM
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Originally Posted by yomamacuhsuckit View Post
I also read Devil Man recently, which was... terrible. It started out as passable trash, until it started in on this, "Look what's become of humanity! We're just like the devils!" Also, how much of manga's drive to serve up as much nude fan service as possible can be attributed to Go Nagai?
See, you've just invalidated any other suggestions you might make.



Devilman > Everything Else.
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Old 02-07-2009, 02:10 PM
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Among the ones I've read, personally (haven't gotten to Full Metal Alchemist, Jojo's Adventure, or Mushishi, for instance)...

The Good & Worth Making Time For:
Azumanga Daioh! and Yotsuba&!. I think these two are no-brainers.
Planetes. The anime is excellent and one of the best representatives of the medium, but the manga is just so much better.
Monster. Ditto.
Phoenix. The only regret I have about Phoenix is that Tezuka died before completing it. Otherwise, you're doing yourself a great disservice by not reading it RIGHT NOW.
Chrono Crusade. A very good shonen-style action/adventure series. It does a wonderful job with its mythology and characterization, and the ending is superb (unlike the gut-punching animated version.)
Trigun and Trigun Maximum. Just watch out for some confusing artwork, since it's often detailed beyond human comprehension. There's also more than a little Ho/Foe Yay.
Udon's Street Fighter manga, including Sakura Ganbaru!, Ryu Final, and Street Fighter Alpha. The latter is a stock-standard shonen fighting series, but it's good. The other two, though, are very well written, funny, and (in Ryu Final's case) there's a dreamlike quality to the action sequences. And it makes Sagat into a good guy! Just read them in order: Alpha, Sakura, then Final.
Ranma 1/2. Bias alert! Your mileage may vary.
Mermaid Saga. IMO, Takahashi's best and finest. Funny how that works, since this is a drama/horror series, and she's best known for romantic comedies.
One-Pound Gospel. Speaking of romantic comedies, this one is second only to...
Maison Ikkoku. Reading this straight through really makes you witness Takahashi's growth as a dramatic writer. Shame she hasn't done anything like this lately.
Violinist of Hameln. Funny, astonishingly epic, hilarious, dramatic, absurd, and heart-breaking. Sometimes within the same page! Tchaikovsky Punch!
Neon Genesis Evangelion. No, really! Better than the anime by miles.
Gimmick! Not to be confused with Hot Gimmick. This one is about an enthusiastic makeup/SFX master and the Detective Conan-like mysteries that he gets into.
Hell Teacher Nube. It's unbelievable, if not downright criminal, that this hasn't been licensed or even scanlated.

The Entertaining Time Wasters:
Urusei Yatsura. Scattershot comedy, but I like most of if anyhow (even if the anime IS a better adaptation.) Bad, bad Viz for not finishing it.
Rumic World (and 1 Or W.) I get the feeling that Takahashi works best with small vignettes and human drama. Her early work is also much better at comedy, though YMMV (again.)
Death Note. I know you know I know they know you know I wanted them to know he knows you knew it was just as planned. Did you know gods of death like apples?
Blue Dragon RalΩGrad. By the same artist as Death Note (and it shows!) It's an interesting, alternate take on the concept of Shadows from the original video game, with a fairly standard "travel the world, defeat the Big Bad" quest setting.
Video Girl Ai. It's the side-characters that make this. The Magical Girlfriend angle, at least, is handled better than similar stories, and it helps that the characters are all deeply flawed. (And, unlike Oh My Goddess!, it ends.)
Street Fighter II manga. From a different author than the other manga, still reasonably good if you're a fan of the games. The last volume gets weird with the clone fighters, though.
Saint Seiya. The ultimate "hot-blooded youth!" fighting manga series. Kurumada has a bit of a fixation on beautiful teenagers as warriors, though.
Midori Days. Speaking of Magical Girlfriends, this one is so absurd as to make the concept fresh again. The characters are also charming despite being a bunch of stereotypes.
Claymore. Standard fantasy fare, with a hefty dose of Ancient Conspiracies and Superpowered Evil Sides. Very good art, too.
Pumpkin Scissors. Take the above description, and replace "fantasy fare" with "military action." The main leads are surprisingly complex characters, evolving with nearly every chapter.
Cromartie High. Read it. I can't describe it accurately, no matter how hard I try.

The Good God Why Did I waste Money On These:
Battle Royale. I really like the movie. I love the book. The manga is so incredibly disturbing and the artwork is horrifying, inserting explicit gore and sex purely for shock value. Ugh.
Shadow Star (Narutaru). Hey an interesting deconstruction of "collectible monsters" series wow this is deeper than I th-- OH GOD OH GOD WHAT DID THEY JUST DO TO THAT GIRL OH GOD I'M HAVING NIGHTMARES.
Dark Horse's The Ring and The Grudge manga. Really, why did I waste money on these? Never mind the artwork, the translation is horrible.

Edit: Makkuro has permission to tar and feather me for forgetting Nausicaa, especially since it's my third favorite manga of all time.

Last edited by Zef; 02-07-2009 at 02:22 PM.
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  #10  
Old 02-07-2009, 02:18 PM
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Oh, yeah, Midori Days is pretty awesome, too. Weird, very, very weird, but funny.
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  #11  
Old 02-07-2009, 02:19 PM
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It's kind of silly that the thread has gone on for this long without anyone mentioning Nausicaš. Because, seriously, that is the best manga.
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  #12  
Old 02-07-2009, 02:39 PM
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Death Note. I know you know I know they know you know I wanted them to know he knows you knew it was just as planned. Did you know gods of death like apples?
I want to read this because it looks so cool, but I imagine the story has already become so voluminous that it would cost me all my gold coins to read them.



Quote:
Battle Royale. I really like the movie. I love the book. The manga is so incredibly disturbing and the artwork is horrifying, inserting explicit gore and sex purely for shock value. Ugh.
Now, now. You had it coming. Both movie and book are nothing but shock.

I suppose The World is Mine should not be suggested because it's like Battle Royale.
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Old 02-07-2009, 02:44 PM
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I want to read this because it looks so cool, but I imagine the story has already become so voluminous that it would cost me all my gold coins to read them.
On one hand, yes. On the other, it's over, so you at least have a finite number of books to read.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:07 PM
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See, you've just invalidated any other suggestions you might make.



Devilman > Everything Else.
Maybe I should revise my statement that it starts out as passable trash. It starts out as pretty good trash, but seriously, I'm not that interested in Go Nagai's devil-satire of the military industrial complex. It's silly.

I just downloaded the Nausicaa manga on accident, thinking it was the anime. Is it better?
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  #15  
Old 02-07-2009, 03:13 PM
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I just downloaded the Nausicaa manga on accident, thinking it was the anime. Is it better?
First of all - Talking Time etiquette forbids speaking of downloading, and Nausicaa is well worth having in book form.

As for better, well... it`s different from the anime, and it`s a much fuller story. However, it is very different in tone and scope. The anime is fantastic, and the manga is also incredibly fantastic. I`d give the book the edge, but it`s super close, and sort of a case of "apples and oranges," although the stories are very similar (the manga starts of quite similarly, but expands and goes quite a bit further than the anime).

Also, the ending to the manga is somewhat controversial. It's an excellent finish to the story, but it's not as... innocent as you'd expect from film Miyazaki. It's been observed that his fantasy manga (this and some earlier illustrated novel thing) feel much darker than his films.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:20 PM
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Now, now. You had it coming. Both movie and book are nothing but shock.
The movie, arguably, but while the deaths are abundant, only two or three have any gore at all, and even those are nowhere near as graphic as in the manga. And its message sits on the forefront at all times --American action movies are far more violent, with far less to talk about. It's just the age of the targets of BR's violence that make it uncomfortable.

In the novel's case, I guess my imagination is less gruesome than the manga artist's. I certainly don't see flayed skin and bursting eyeballs and teeth flying everywhere when someone gets shot in the head. Or maybe the descriptions are less explicit. Mitsuko's death in the manga takes this to such an extreme, it's downright stupid.

Quote:
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I just downloaded the Nausicaa manga on accident, thinking it was the anime. Is it better?
Like you wouldn't believe. This doesn't make the movie any less of a milestone, mind.

It's ironic that Miyazaki didn't want to write the manga, but was more or less forced to in order to publicize the movie. His changing views on religion and society also make it a fascinating read, as his (and Nausicaa's) ideals evolve throughout the narrative. The Ohmu's Dream is one of my favorite sequences in sequential art.
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  #17  
Old 02-07-2009, 03:20 PM
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Everybody derdes Sgt. Frog, but that's only because nobody's ever read it, and they'd heard it sometimes depicts panties. And the TT community has declared it is decidedly anti-panty. But! It also has a lot of really good humor, parody and satire. It definitely has a lot of crossover appeal - I've gotten several people who normally don't like manga to start reading it. Oddly enough, it seems like the people I know who like it the least are manga fans, so I don't know what that says.
Yeah, actually not true. I enjoyed Sgt. Frog for about three volumes before I realized that every book was the same stupid routine of Gundam ads spliced with light sexual exploitation of a 14-year-old. Ell oh ell. Such hilarity. I held on until about vol. 10 hoping it would eventually make good on its potential, but the creator was content to go for the easy money.

Also, I have to go against the Trigun recommendations. The anime was amusing in a "hey guys check out my Rurouni Kenshin/Wild Arms crossover fanfic" kind of way, but the manga is a mess. Dude can't draw action scenes to save his life. People face off, and five pages later someone is dead, but good luck figuring out why. For a series as action-heavy as this, that's a crime. If you want good cogent-yet-artistic action scenes, try Blade of the Immortal (which has shamefully gone unmentioned throughout this thread).
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:27 PM
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I suppose The World is Mine should not be suggested because it's like Battle Royale.
Except that, unlike Battle Royale, The World is Mine is really fucking good.


Be sure to check out Nana, which is one of the best shoujo series out there. I don't think I've ever actually found a negative review of it.

And if you're looking for more shoujo, Skip Beat is a fun series about a girl attempting to become an actress. Most importantly, this doesn't star your typical namby-pamby milquetoast doormat shoujo heroine. Mess with Kyoko and she will fucking cut you. With her amazing acting. It's a goddamn shoujo apocalypse.

Finally, Yokohama Kaidashi Kikou is one of the best comics ever made. READ IT.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:29 PM
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On Sgt. Frog - I'm less against panties and more against spending about a quarter of the time on naked Gundam ads. That's "naked" as in "blatant" not... yeah.

If you're a fan of the Fullmetal Alchemist anime, the manga is worth a look. It starts off mostly the same but starts to seriously diverge around the point where the main characters meet Greed.

Death Note is ridiculous, but definitely worth reading at least up to the big break in the story, after which it kinda goes off the rails.

Law of Ueki is absolutely incredible. The story is this - a society of beings called "celestials" is having a contest to decide their new king. Each of one hundred candidates picks a junior high student on Earth and gives them one magic power, and the kids fight single-elimination style until one is left (it's not a tournament, though, it's up to the kids to find each other). The thing that makes this already crazy premise great is the powers themselves, which generally take the form of "turn X into Y but (sometimes) only when Z". So you have a character who can turn his forehead into diamond, but only while his hands are in his pockets, etc. It's totally off the wall and totally great.

[edit] - I want to point out that I totally posted this without seeing Parish's reply (re - Sgt. Frog). Also he is right about both Trigun and Blade of the Immortal.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:30 PM
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Don't know if you people ever heard of it, but Yotsuba&! is pretty good.
It's actually going to be back in print in the US soon as well, thanks to Yen Press saving it from the purgatory of ADVs manga department.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:32 PM
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It's actually going to be back in print in the US soon as well, thanks to Yen Press saving it from the purgatory of ADVs manga department.
What?

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:36 PM
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What?

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?
Especially the "Yen Press" thing!

If Javier Lopez doesn't helm the translation, I'm going to be very very sad. But translated Yotsuba&! is better than no Yotsuba&! at all!
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:36 PM
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What?

Whaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaat?
News fresh out of Comic Con, apparently.
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  #24  
Old 02-07-2009, 03:36 PM
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Blade of the Immortal
yesssss

The plot has admittedly slowed down a bit over the past few volumes, but it is picking back up. And oh god the art
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:36 PM
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If you want good cogent-yet-artistic action scenes, try Blade of the Immortal (which has shamefully gone unmentioned throughout this thread).
Blade of the Immortal is great. It's kind of crazy how great it is.


Hajime no Ippo is also a winner. I get the feeling it hits a lot of the same notes as any other sports manga, but the fights are both well-drawn and well-written, and the sizable cast is almost uniformly likable. The only downside is that the only way to read it in English is filthy piracy.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:36 PM
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It's actually going to be back in print in the US soon as well, thanks to Yen Press saving it from the purgatory of ADVs manga department.
WHAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAT?
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:41 PM
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Mushishi. Moo Shii Shii.

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Originally Posted by Epistaxis View Post
King of Thorns is pretty badass.
This, too.

Quote:
The Good God Why Did I waste Money On These:
Battle Royale
Battle Royale was the first manga I bought with my own money. I got up to volume two before I realised it was a whole bunch of fighting and fucking for the sake of shock value. The localisation wasn't done particularly well, either. I liked the movie a lot better.

I kind of like Song of the Hanging Sky. The artwork is very pretty, and I like the concept of a birdman race that's only capable of flying throughout childhood.

Oh, and please consider Me and the Devil Blues, a manga about the "life" of bluesman Robert Johnson. Pretty fantastic.

I also adored Hotel Africa, though I think I'm alone here. I like Hee Jung Park's work, all told.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:45 PM
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First: Obligitory "comics are duuuuuumb."

Second: GUNNM/Battle Angel. Shame on Parish for not getting to it first.

Third: Challenge: name some series that are a) good, and b) less than 10 volumes. Bonus points if less than 5. I cannot get interested in 20+ volume series that are still ongoing. Your shit is not that interesting to read, author guy.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:48 PM
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Yeah, actually not true. I enjoyed Sgt. Frog for about three volumes before I realized that every book was the same stupid routine of Gundam ads spliced with light sexual exploitation of a 14-year-old. Ell oh ell. Such hilarity. I held on until about vol. 10 hoping it would eventually make good on its potential, but the creator was content to go for the easy money.
But then, that is not actually true, so, shrug. I've read the whole series up to now and never read anything into the Gundam schtick past "it's something that pathetic nerds do", which adds to the parody/humor. Seeing it as blatant advertising is a pretty surface-level way of looking at it. The whole point is that Keroro never gets around to doing his work because he spends all his time playing with models, and it's not seen as a good thing. I guess you could say the story is trying to infer that because of Gundam models the world hasn't been taken over by cartoon frogs, but that's a bit of a stretch. I got something different out of it.

As far as the sexual exploitation, how is it different from everything that has ever come from Japan albeit much more mildly? At least it's not, say, I''s. I gave the first volume of that a shot after a friend said they liked Video Girl Ai and, ugh. Now that is objectionable.
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Old 02-07-2009, 03:48 PM
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Oh hey, the first English volume of Pluto should be out soon!

Everybody needs to read Pluto.

Everybody.

Working with that thought, I have heard brilliant things about 20th Century Boys.
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