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  #61  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:25 AM
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This means Shrine Maiden can't kill her as long as they're not alone. if we forbid Girl from moving and move Boy Student to the school, she should live another round.
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  #62  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:26 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
Alright, looks like we're dealing with Shadow of the Ripper.

The Shrine Maiden is confirmed for Serial Killer.


Shrine Maiden can't enter the city so it's ideal for keeping the girl safe, but there's a lot of other characters there right now.

It looks like maybe Mogri wanted the doctor to die this time? I am not sure what his game was in trying to move the Maiden to the hospital.
I thought there were 2 plots?

Maybe he was hoping we would forbid movement on the Maiden.
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  #63  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:28 AM
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There are two, but we don't know what the other is yet. There could still be another killer.

There's a murder scheduled for tonight. If someone gets too much Paranoia they could still get our girl killed. Office man is the only one with Paranoia right now, so I'd like to keep Girl away from him.
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  #64  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:31 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerad View Post
I thought there were 2 plots?
In First Steps, there's one plot and one subplot.

In Basic Tragedy (which we are not playing), there's one plot and two subplots.

There are never two plots, unless you're using "plot" to collectively refer to both main plot and subplot.
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  #65  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:32 AM
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Okay, I talked a lot about moving the Girl to the city last turn. I think there's a good chance Mogri made his moves this turn based on the assumption we would try to move her there.
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  #66  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:43 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
There are two, but we don't know what the other is yet. There could still be another killer.

There's a murder scheduled for tonight. If someone gets too much Paranoia they could still get our girl killed. Office man is the only one with Paranoia right now, so I'd like to keep Girl away from him.
I think there's very likely another killer. We know the subplot is the serial killer one; we know Girl is Key Person. So either we have the Killer one or the "avoid 2 intrigue in School" one. Mogri is certainly implying it's the Killer one, with all the intrigue he's trying to put on Girl.

I'm picking up more as we go along, but still unclear on a few things:

How do we know there's a murder scheduled?
How many loops do we get?
How many days in a loop?

It looks to me like there are three possible ways we know of to lose right now:

Shrine Maiden (serial killer) is alone with Girl (key person), Girl dies
??? (killer) is together with Girl who has 2 intrigue, Girl dies
(assuming we know there's a murder coming) person with 2 paranoia is together with Girl, girl dies.

So I'd think the following are true:

There's a Conspiracy Theorist (from the Serial Killer subplot) who is very likely at Office Worker's location, and can give Office Worker another paranoia. Being in City will be dangerous for Girl tonight.

Being with Shrine Maiden alone is obviously deadly.

Having 2 Intrigue and being with anyone but Shrine Maiden could be deadly.

How about this:

Move Boy Student sideways (Girl is not alone, Shrine Maiden can't come in and she can't be murdered)
Forbid Movement on Girl (Girl cannot be moved to Shrine or City)

Then maybe Paranoia -1 on Office Worker?

We lose if he plays Intrigue +2 on Girl and Boy is the killer, but then at least we know.

Thoughts?
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  #67  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:44 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mogri View Post
In First Steps, there's one plot and one subplot.

In Basic Tragedy (which we are not playing), there's one plot and two subplots.

There are never two plots, unless you're using "plot" to collectively refer to both main plot and subplot.
Thanks, I just figured out there was a distinction and they weren't all just plots. It basically means one orange one purple.
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  #68  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:46 AM
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BUT WAIT! Maybe intrigue on girl counts as intrigue in school. In which case 2 intrigue on girl is a loss anyway, but only if she's in School at the end of the loop.

Worth keeping in mind.
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  #69  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:49 AM
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We have three possible loops. We need to learn as much as we can on this loop, because we have to win on the next one.

Mogri gave us a 'forecast' in post 18. There will be a murder tonight and a suicide on Night 4.

Girl takes a lot of Paranoia to drive to suicide but its something we need to watch for in the next few rounds.

Forbid Intirgue on Girl, forbid move on girl, move boy to school might be our safest move today.
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  #70  
Old 05-17-2017, 08:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerad View Post
BUT WAIT! Maybe intrigue on girl counts as intrigue in school. In which case 2 intrigue on girl is a loss anyway, but only if she's in School at the end of the loop.
That means Intrigue on the location itself, not on characters at the location.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
Forbid Intirgue on Girl, forbid move on girl, move boy to school might be our safest move today.
Remember that you can't play two cards on the same target in a single day.
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  #71  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:01 AM
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Blargh.

Okay, Mogri already played his +2 Intrigue and Redge blocked it. He can't play it again this loop. So even if Boy Student is the killer, he can't kill her tonight unless there's a Brain also at the location.
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  #72  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
We have three possible loops. We need to learn as much as we can on this loop, because we have to win on the next one.

Mogri gave us a 'forecast' in post 18. There will be a murder tonight and a suicide on Night 4.
I see. Silly me.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
Blargh.

Okay, Mogri already played his +2 Intrigue and Redge blocked it. He can't play it again this loop. So even if Boy Student is the killer, he can't kill her tonight unless there's a Brain also at the location.
OK. So go with:

Forbid move on GIRL.
Move horizontal on BOY.
Move vertical on POLICEMAN (so that if he's a brain, he's very unlikely to be able to be in the same place as GIRL?)
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  #73  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:16 AM
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You guys move way too fast.

Okay, so Shrine Maiden is a serial killer.

Does Girl Student have to be a key person? Is there any other loss condition we could have triggered? i.e. Could we have lost because of "A Place to Protect" loss condition (or because Girl Student had two intrigue and died, there was now zero intrigue at the school?)

We know there is a murder coming up. We don't yet know who the culprit could be. However, the only character in danger of reaching their paranoia limit is the Office Worker. And the Office Worker is not currently at the Girl Student's location. Since Mogri did not place a card on the Office Worker, we don't need to worry about him killing the Girl Student.

Solitayre, it seems overkill to both move the Boy Student to Girl Student's location and forbid movement on the Shrine Maiden. I think we only do one of those and move the Office Worker vertical.
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  #74  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:18 AM
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I never said forbid the Shrine Maiden.

I'm onboard with Gerad's general plan.
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  #75  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:21 AM
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I do need to know who's playing what. It doesn't always make a difference, but it does matter for the once-per-loop cards (e.g. Solitayre has already played Forbid Movement).
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  #76  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:23 AM
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Oh, sorry, this game gets my brain in a knot.

I like Gerad's plan, though with the modification of playing the move vertical on Office Worker instead of Police Officer.

I volunteer to play Forbid Movement on Girl Student
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  #77  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:25 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Hedgehog View Post

I like Gerad's plan, though with the modification of playing the move vertical on Office Worker instead of Police Officer.
Why?
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  #78  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
Why?
I don't know that it really matters to me which it is, but I'd like to know the reasoning too.

Blame procrastination at work for the "move fast" bit.
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  #79  
Old 05-17-2017, 09:52 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Solitayre View Post
Why?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gerad View Post
I don't know that it really matters to me which it is, but I'd like to know the reasoning too.
To prevent him from getting a second paranoia in the case the Police Officer is the Conspiracy Theorist (and to prevent him from giving a Paranoia in case he is).
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  #80  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Hedgehog View Post
To prevent him from getting a second paranoia in the case the Police Officer is the Conspiracy Theorist (and to prevent him from giving a Paranoia in case he is).
Works for me.

I'll play move vertical on the Office Worker.

Sol, boy student is yours.
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  #81  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:10 AM
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I play Move ↔ on
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  #82  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:46 AM
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Loop 2, Day 2 actions

Paranoia +1 Forbid Movement
Girl Student gains .
Move ↔
Boy Student moves to School.
Move ↕
Office Worker moves to Hospital.
Move ↔
Police Officer moves to School.
Move ↕
Shrine Maiden moves to School.



Mastermind abilities

Girl Student gains .

Protagonist actions

No one has goodwill.

Incidents

Murder is scheduled for day 2. Nothing happens.

End of day

Loop 2, Day 3



☹ 2/3 ♥ 0 ☹ 0/2 ♥ 0 ☹ 0/2 ♥ 0 ☹ 0/3 ♥ 0 ☹ 1/2 ♥ 0 ☹ 0/2 ♥ 0


Mastermind actions

I play three cards, targeting , , and .


Protagonist actions

You're halfway to victory, but you're always a bad turn away from defeat. Do your best.
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  #83  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:50 AM
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Ahahaha I think my work added your host to its whitelist, so I'm definitely down now.
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  #84  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:50 AM
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Question: If a character has two moves, does the mastermind move happen first (if possible) and then the protagonist move? Basically, if the combination of moves would cause a character to be in a place where they cannot be, how is this resolved?
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  #85  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:52 AM
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Question 2: A character cannot have more than one role, correct?

Question 3: Does "culprit" count as a role or is it a separate dimension?
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  #86  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:56 AM
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I think the Cop is our Conspiracy Theorist, and it looks like Mogri's move this loop is to try to drive Girl Student to suicide at the end of Day 4.

Reduce Paranoia, +2 Good Will on Boy Student?
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  #87  
Old 05-17-2017, 10:59 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Hedgehog View Post
Question: If a character has two moves, does the mastermind move happen first (if possible) and then the protagonist move? Basically, if the combination of moves would cause a character to be in a place where they cannot be, how is this resolved?
1. If two different moves are played on a character (such as one horizontal and one vertical) then they combine to become one diagonal move. If that combined move cannot be made, such as in your example, the character does not move. (Diagonal also combines with other moves, but I can't remember in what way.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Hedgehog View Post
Question 2: A character cannot have more than one role, correct?

Question 3: Does "culprit" count as a role or is it a separate dimension?
2. Correct.

3. "Culprit" refers to the instigator of the day's incident and is not a specific role. If the incident is Murder, then the culprit is the killer. If the incident is Suicide, then the culprit is also the victim.
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  #88  
Old 05-17-2017, 11:01 AM
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My guess is Mogri played +1 Paranoia on Girl student and ordered Cop and Boy to move away, meaning we have to move the Girl or Shrine Maiden or our Key Person will die.
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  #89  
Old 05-17-2017, 11:01 AM
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Westerhof is correct on all counts, but for clarification:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Westerhof View Post
1. If two different moves are played on a character (such as one horizontal and one vertical) then they combine to become one diagonal move. If that combined move cannot be made, such as in your example, the character does not move. (Diagonal also combines with other moves, but I can't remember in what way.)
Only the end result of movement is considered, and diagonal + something turns that something into the other thing. So diagonal + horizontal = vertical.
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  #90  
Old 05-17-2017, 11:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Red Hedgehog View Post
Question: If a character has two moves, does the mastermind move happen first (if possible) and then the protagonist move? Basically, if the combination of moves would cause a character to be in a place where they cannot be, how is this resolved?
The simple answer is, you look at the sum of both moves; if the final location is forbidden, both moves are canceled.

So for Shrine Maiden, Horizontal alone would fail, but Vertical alone and Diagonal alone would succeed. For combined moves, H+V would succeed, as well as D+H, but not D+V.
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