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  #61  
Old 11-19-2009, 03:42 AM
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Sam Keith actually drew the first few Sandman issues, if I'm not mistaken. Supposedly, he quit the project because he felt too out of place. "Like Jimi Hendrix in the Beatles," is how he described it.
I really liked those first few Sandman issues with Sam Keith's art. I felt like the point where he stopped marked an unfortunate transition from Quirky Surreal Neil Gaiman Story to Moody Navel Gazing Neil Gaiman Story.

These episodes of The Maxx are great. The animation is even better than what I remember from when I was 12. It's a shame MTV is choking these 10 -minute long shorts with about 3 times as many commercials as a half-hour long program on Hulu.
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  #62  
Old 11-19-2009, 04:56 AM
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I don't remember if this was mentioned in the Disney Afternoon thread, but I always thought it was super cool how Drake Mallard used a Basil (of The Great Mouse Detective) statue in order to go into Darkwing Duck-mode from his house.
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  #63  
Old 11-19-2009, 05:44 AM
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I know that Sam Keith is still doing some stuff from times I've wikpedia'd him, but does anyone know if his non-Maxx work is any good? I really liked The Maxx and also the hugely depressing Friends of the Maxx short stories, and I'm curious if any of his post-Maxx work is worth looking at.

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The Last Unicorn looks nice but in the end the story and the characters infuriate me to no end.
The Last Unicorn is a much better novel than movie. The book has a interesting meta-commentary on fairy tales, whereas the the movie just kind of drops all that and tells the kind of boring narrative.

It's kind of like what would happen if you adapted Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy into a straight sci-fi movie with no humor. Sure, the main story is there . . . but it just kind of misses the point.

Caveat: I last read this book when I was 14. I might be over-exaggerating the degree of its narrative experimentation.
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  #64  
Old 11-19-2009, 06:46 AM
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I didn't like The Last Unicorn the first time I watched it, but it's since grown on me. I don't know why, because I can agree that most complaints about it are true.


Just to clarify: although the Nickelodeon Bone movie was scrapped, Warner Bros. is set to work on one now where Smith has more power over the whole thing and it won't be treated as purely kids' fare. It's not clear how it's going to be made, though. The most likely event seems to be a Live Action/CG hybrid or just pure CG.
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  #65  
Old 11-19-2009, 11:27 AM
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I'd really rather they didn't do anything with live action in Bone. It would just make the difference between the Bones and everybody else too jarring. I mean, the difference was already very apparent in the comic, but the people of the Valley were cartoon-ish enough that it felt plausible for the Bones to exist in the same world they did. I'm kind of afraid that live action would ruin that.

The Maxx was awesome. I never personally enjoyed the way everybody sort of drifts apart, but I did think it was an effective ending for the story (at least as far as MTV told it; I understand there was much more in the comics).

Also, I used to stay up as late as I could on weekend nights sometimes to try and catch MTV's Liquid Television. There was some wonderfully surreal stuff on there. If I'm not mistaken, that's also where Aeon Flux got its start, with the dialogue-less shorts. The Head, too, if I remember right.
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  #66  
Old 11-19-2009, 12:10 PM
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I have to admit that I really can't stomach anything by Peter Chung. That might be because my first exposure to him was Reign the Conqueror, though.
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  #67  
Old 11-19-2009, 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by bloodyinkpen View Post
I really liked those first few Sandman issues with Sam Keith's art. I felt like the point where he stopped marked an unfortunate transition from Quirky Surreal Neil Gaiman Story to Moody Navel Gazing Neil Gaiman Story.
Yeah, those first couple of issues look great. His Lucifer just look gorgeous.

Edit: Now I can't find it, but I think it is like the first panel you see of him and he is all glam and Bowie'd out.
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  #68  
Old 11-19-2009, 01:42 PM
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I really want to repost all the youtube links that I recommended in the Your Animation Childhood thread, but I feel sort of dirty about doing it.
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  #69  
Old 11-19-2009, 01:47 PM
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I really want to repost all the youtube links that I recommended in the Your Animation Childhood thread, but I feel sort of dirty about doing it.
Bring 'em on, Abraham Linkin'!
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  #70  
Old 11-19-2009, 01:57 PM
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::::::This is the repost::::::

This playlist is your friend: http://www.youtube.com/view_play_lis...16D29BA&page=1

Three musketeers as dogs! Mumi-Troll in cutout animation! Film noir parodies!

(i'd strongly suggest checking out "Film Film Film" as your first option)

Other things:
1) The most famous piece by the best animator ever (as voted by animators themselves about a decade ago)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JZS1f...eature=related
2) My personal favourite, a staple of my childhood:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bfFiQoLYilQ
(btw this user is pretty cool with english subtitles)
3) Soviet-Japanese anime about penguins:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPgBS...eature=related
4) A wonderful example of late 80s-early 90s style animation - a lot of those animators went on to work at Clasky Csupo, and you can easily notice their style in Rugrats and AAAAAHHH! Real Monsters:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HbRi39692oE

I COULD GO ON AND ON AND ON AND ON
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  #71  
Old 11-19-2009, 02:29 PM
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Oh, the book The Last Unicorn is far better than the movie, no question. I read it for the first time a year or two ago and enjoyed it quite a bit. I still have a fondness for the movie, even with the ridiculous harpy design.

Man, I have a super-hard time visualizing Bone as anything other than 2D. The designs of so many of the characters need 2D to work properly. Entirely 3D could work I suppose, but mixture of that and live action? Noooo. C'mon Jeff try for animation!

I have a long list of qualms and worries over The Princess & The Frog, just because of how much Disney exec meddling and PC blather has gone down since the beginning, but I'm still excited. Doc Facilier looks to be the best Disney villain in a while.

You know one of the biggest things that's lacking from TV animation these days? The cool opening credits! Cartoons used to have really neat opening sequences where they usually got to show off with their art design and animation, and these parts would last from thirty seconds to a whole minute. It was great! This is how we got such awesome stuff as the Batman: TAS opening. Another of my top favorites was the second opening they made for the Beetlejuice cartoon. Such fun animation! But now everything's squeezed down as much as possible to shove in more and more commercials, so sometimes there's barely enough room for a quick flash of the title. Bah humbug.

Did anybody ever see the '77 Fantastic Animation Festival? It was a crazy collection of all sorts of animated shorts, from old Max Fleischer Superman to the famous Bambi Meets Godzilla to several Claymation pieces by Will Vinton. My dad was an early adopter with VHS home video, so we had an ancient VHS copy of it and I watched it all the time as a kid. It's not that insane in retrospect probably, and it's certainly a lot tamer than any other Pink Floyd animation ever made, but the 'French Windows' animation for One Of These Days freaked me out bigtime when I was little.
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  #72  
Old 11-19-2009, 04:39 PM
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Thanks for the skinny on Looney Tunes GC, BrianC and Super Mega Maaaaaaaaaaaan X
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  #73  
Old 11-19-2009, 05:18 PM
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there are quite a few Rankin-Bass ones I like (The Hobbit, Flight of Dragons, The Last Unicorn)
I really liked the Flight of Dragons, especially the final confrontation. It's awesome because the hero kills the last boss by reciting scientific concepts and by alphabetically listing the major branches of scientific study. Also James Earl Jones' evil laugh, which is the best.
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  #74  
Old 11-19-2009, 07:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Sheana View Post
You know one of the biggest things that's lacking from TV animation these days? The cool opening credits! Cartoons used to have really neat opening sequences where they usually got to show off with their art design and animation, and these parts would last from thirty seconds to a whole minute. It was great! This is how we got such awesome stuff as the Batman: TAS opening. Another of my top favorites was the second opening they made for the Beetlejuice cartoon. Such fun animation! But now everything's squeezed down as much as possible to shove in more and more commercials, so sometimes there's barely enough room for a quick flash of the title. Bah humbug.
There's still some really good ones.
Case in point: A coworker recently got me to watch the entire run of Ben 10. The show itself is guilty pleasure material at best and aggrivatingly toyetic at worst, but the theme song is kickass. It's got a unique visual style not seen anywhere else in the show and the theme tune is a catchy throwback to golden age science fiction films. Unfortunately, every Youtube version either has terrible quality or is totally butchered so I can't back up my point here.

EDIT:

So what I actually meant to post about (and totally forgot to post about) when I entered this thread an hour ago was that I've had "Sita Sings The Blues" forever and only just watched it tonight. It's pretty good. Though it's not nearly as hard to believe it's a one-person project as people would expect you to think (especially since it's not). Major kudos for making the whole thing free, though.

So anyway, I downloaded this sometime last year. 100 short films (not sure how much of it is legal, but it's really hard to come by and totally interesting material) that represent the progress of animation over its first century, from "Fantasmagorie" to "Ryan." Cool stuff. I've only watched maybe twenty or thirty of them, but it's still worth a look.

Last edited by teg; 11-19-2009 at 08:18 PM.
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  #75  
Old 11-19-2009, 08:46 PM
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Did anyone else let out a sigh of relief after not seeing the "Drawn in front of a live studio audience" notice during the beginning of tonight's Flapjack?
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  #76  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:09 AM
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Rex The Runt. Just ten years later, it seems hard to believe something this good went out during prime time on the BBC.

Did we mention Yuri Norstein in the other thread? Hedgehog In The Fog is just beautiful.

Priit Pärn's work is very underrated.
Time Out is a pretty incredible piece of work(probably NSFW due to boobies)

And of course David Lynch started off making animation:
The Alphabet
(is David Lynch SFW? It is not clear).
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  #77  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:29 AM
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Originally Posted by Sheana View Post
Man, I have a super-hard time visualizing Bone as anything other than 2D. The designs of so many of the characters need 2D to work properly. Entirely 3D could work I suppose, but mixture of that and live action? Noooo. C'mon Jeff try for animation!
Yeah, when I thought of "Bone as a movie" my mind immediately came up with "2D animation YEAH!" Live action? CG? pplllbbbthhh. Whenever I think of CG Bone I think of Telltale's Bone game. Sorry guys, I love Tales of Monkey Island, but ... that Bone game didn't look too good.
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  #78  
Old 11-20-2009, 05:35 AM
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Did we mention Yuri Norstein in the other thread? Hedgehog In The Fog is just beautiful.
Um, what about my post? It's right on this page, you know.
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  #79  
Old 11-20-2009, 07:11 AM
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Rex The Runt. Just ten years later, it seems hard to believe something this good went out during prime time on the BBC.
It's been a while since I've watched this. It's still fantastic though.
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  #80  
Old 11-20-2009, 07:15 AM
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Oh hmm, this thread suddenly appeared and is long.

Anyway, I know people have already plugged Avatar because it's excellent, but since this thread is about great 2D animation I just wanted to reiterate how cool it is that the animators managed to take fairly realistic interpretations of actual real-world martial art forms, blend them with some magic effects, and turn out some of the best animated fight scenes I've seen, on a par with a lot of higher-budget Japanese efforts. It's good stuff.
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  #81  
Old 11-20-2009, 08:03 AM
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What strikes me the most about Avatar is the seeming ease with which it blends the concepts inherent to Western animation with the anime tropes.
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  #82  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:08 PM
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Um, what about my post? It's right on this page, you know.
Oh, I do apologise! I looked through most of your videos but managed to miss that one.
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  #83  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:35 PM
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Yeah, when I thought of "Bone as a movie" my mind immediately came up with "2D animation YEAH!" Live action? CG? pplllbbbthhh. Whenever I think of CG Bone I think of Telltale's Bone game. Sorry guys, I love Tales of Monkey Island, but ... that Bone game didn't look too good.
Has anyone played those games? I can't really imagine Bone working well in 3D either, the book is practically a 2D cartoon as it is.

And I have to join in with the Avatar praise. I love how it actually feels like the characters are slowly progressing throughout the story. The first two episodes and the last two episodes are pretty much tied for my favorites. I don't think that there are many TV shows where I can say that.
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  #84  
Old 11-20-2009, 12:44 PM
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I too love Avatar. It's like anime, but without all the trerrible parts. One thing I have noticed about anime is how so many series do about 12 episodes of a series, then all of sudden the show takes a turn(almost always darker) and then it turns into a completely different show. Anime in general doesn't seem to be able to balance drama and humor very well, something that Avatar really excels at.
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  #85  
Old 11-20-2009, 01:47 PM
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Maybe that's lost in translation. Or maybe they're too focused on the bizarre central themes at the expense of character development. What really annoyed me about Bleach is that it actually had a strong foundation (hot-headed teenager sees the dead and helps them cross over while fighting demons), but ruined it by moving the show to the spirit realm and introducing a hundred new cast members, none of which were particularly interesting. The annoying comic relief stuffed animal was partnered up with at least three others that were even more obnoxious and so abstract as to make even the later generations of Pokemon seem lifelike.

By contrast, Avatar always found ways to make you interested in each new character, even if they weren't onscreen for long, and the designs were cool without being gratuitous. Case in point... there was a wacky inventor and his handicapped son in one episode. They didn't cast him as a helpless victim, nor turn him into a spunky, handi-capable poster child for wheelchair-bound viewers. He was just an ordinary kid who wanted to save his floating island from attack by the Fire Nation and contributed to the cause. Even good shows like Gargoyles tend to drop an object lesson on their viewers' heads from time to time, but Avatar took great care to avoid that.
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  #86  
Old 11-20-2009, 02:26 PM
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Even good shows like Gargoyles tend to drop an object lesson on their viewers' heads from time to time, but Avatar took great care to avoid that.
But ArugulaZ, guns are bad! THEY ARE SO BAD AND I NEED TO MAKE SURE YOU UNDERSTAND THAT.

GUNS = BAD
I'm actually fairly pro-gun control but that episode seriously.
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  #87  
Old 11-20-2009, 02:31 PM
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I remember that gun episode. It was Disney.

Though that reminds me, because of this thread I watched part of Fantasia again for the first time in years. Holy shit, y'all! There's dinosaurs throttling and biting each other and falling over dead right onscreen! There's harpies and other female monsters with bare, nipple-laden breasts!

After so many years of being used to Disney leading the PC charge, it's almost crazy to consider that Mr. Disney himself was more concerned with artistic merit than squeaky clean-ness and would probably have no truck with how things are done today.
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  #88  
Old 11-20-2009, 03:52 PM
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I said it once and I'll say it again: I don't think Gargoyles is a bad show just for having lessons in it. And the gun episode was surprisingly straightforward. Play with guns, and you might leave one of your friends lying in a pool of their own blood! Whoops!
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  #89  
Old 11-20-2009, 04:45 PM
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I said it once and I'll say it again: I don't think Gargoyles is a bad show just for having lessons in it. And the gun episode was surprisingly straightforward. Play with guns, and you might leave one of your friends lying in a pool of their own blood! Whoops!
Yeah, instilling fear is far better than than instilling educated respect. I have trouble thinking of ANY "Very special episode" of any animated show (or live-action one for that matter) that was worth a bucket of warm spit. And let's not even talk about shows where sententious and simple-minded moralizing was the whole point.
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  #90  
Old 11-20-2009, 07:10 PM
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But Gargoyles isn't Captain Planet. Gargoyles is good. It's just a little annoying to see people get all up in arms about it having lessons put into it. If Gargoyles had to have some sort of educational value, I'm glad they put it into the show in a way that still allowed for the characters acting normally in good stories. Sure, it's obviously heavy-handed now, but that's because we're adults. At least we never had Goliath turning towards the camera in a "Gargoyles Says" moment telling kids not to climb into dryers.

Oh man, this is making me wonder what it would have been like to have an anti-drug episode of Gargoyles. I think Brooklyn would have been the most likely candidate for "character with a sudden addiction problem". And the drug? Produced by Xanatos Enterprises, of course.
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