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  #61  
Old 04-18-2011, 03:25 PM
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Originally Posted by Calorie Mate View Post
Right. The point is: why does it matter if mom knows who he is right now? He's not important at all at this point. He's more or less a background character, but with a couple lines so it won't feel weird when he gets more important. I'd once again bet dollars to donuts she's only thinking about him because you asked. (Again, to use The Wire to illustrate my point: He's like Lester Freamon, or possibly Weebey.)
Expanding on what I was saying earlier, I just felt like it was a lot to throw at a regular audience, regardless of whether the stuff that's truly important right now got across correctly. I feel like Theon's an obvious place where someone could be misled, easily mistaking him for another son of Ned's. The exact age thing isn't important, I just felt like it would have made a bit more sense to flesh out the Stark family before throwing everything else on.

I think the first episode of the Wire has a very clear through line of what to take from it - Jimmy is a cop that is hated by people above him, but he clearly cares about changing things for the better. He sees Avon as a high profile target, and takes a few steps towards launching an investigation against him. There are lots of other characters whose roles aren't totally clear, but still serve a purpose to that plot. Game of Thrones' first episode felt more like the writers were saying "Here are some powerful people and their families. Also, there are weird snow zombie things. Trust us, all of this will be very important".

I wrote this.
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  #62  
Old 04-18-2011, 03:30 PM
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How dare you compare Lester to Theon.
Only in the exact context I used! I love Mr. Freamon!

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Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
Expanding on what I was saying earlier, I just felt like it was a lot to throw at a regular audience, regardless of whether the stuff that's truly important right now got across correctly. I feel like Theon's an obvious place where someone could be misled, easily mistaking him for another son of Ned's. The exact age thing isn't important, I just felt like it would have made a bit more sense to flesh out the Stark family before throwing everything else on.
I suppose. I don't know, it's hard to judge, which is why I'm not.

As a dude that read a couple of these books 6 years ago, and whose girlfriend has zero exposure to it before going in, I can say my anecdotal evidence tells me it isn't hard to follow. I'm sure there are plenty of people that will get lost, too. It's always a fine line to walk. Hopefully enough people stick with it, though!

Any word yet on ratings, speaking of?
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  #63  
Old 04-18-2011, 03:37 PM
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Five and a half million viewers, which was better than Empire. I imagine it's a fair bit lower next week and then stabilizes. By comparison I think True Blood is their most popular show, and averaged a bit less than that last year.
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  #64  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:00 PM
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Five and a half million viewers, which was better than Empire. I imagine it's a fair bit lower next week and then stabilizes. By comparison I think True Blood is their most popular show, and averaged a bit less than that last year.
Wow. I mean it's on HBO so it was going to get renewed no matter what, but it's great to have that popular vote of confidence.

Speaking of, I was wiki-ing some Wire episodes, and one of the writeups for a season 2 episode mentioned that the episode drew 4.3 million viewers in its initial broadcast. I thought the Wire didn't pull in ratings?! Have TV audiences fallen that much across the board? By current HBO standards, that's some American Idol-level shit.

EDIT: Where did you get those numbers? TV by the Numbers says differently.
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  #65  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:03 PM
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I doubt it was really close to that regularly, and compared to what The Sopranos seemed to do, that's not really great.
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  #66  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
I doubt it was really close to that regularly, and compared to what The Sopranos seemed to do, that's not really great.
ARE YOU SAYING THE WIRE WON'T GET RENEWED NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
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  #67  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:36 PM
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I got the number from Wiki, but it's gone now.
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  #68  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:42 PM
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Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
White Walkers (known commonly as Others in the books, which was changed for obvious reasons)
I refute the obviousness of the reasons here. Unless you mean just a general attempt at trying to simplify things for people... but that could actually end up causing more confusion when trying to explain the difference between the Others and wights.

Although, granted, all you really need to know either way is that snow goons are bad news, but hey.
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  #69  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:47 PM
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Dire wolf pups are adorable.
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  #70  
Old 04-18-2011, 06:57 PM
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I ended up liking most of the casting and performances! Even Sean Bean I guess (although Benjen was a lot closer to the way I'd envisioned Ned, with Benjen being a little bigger and rougher looking.) I was pretty apprehensive about Jon from seeing the early pictures but I ended up liking him a lot.

It felt a little rushed at times, since they had so much to go through, but it gave a few scenes kind of a stilted feeling. A lot of scenes seem like they were just hurrying to cover everything. Like the sudden cut to finding the stag early on, or how it seemed like they were just hurrying up to get Ned to say "winter is coming" because it's the tagline. I kind of hope there's a slightly extended cut when it comes out on the DVDs (and it feels like it was edited down for time so I suppose it's possible).

But hey, pretty good pilot. I look forward to the rest of the season!

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Originally Posted by Adrenaline View Post
Yeah, it's odd that they cast her old for the part and not Joffrey.
Looks like they aged all the children which, honestly, I have no problem with. The books had them pretty young and audiences will be more comfortable with them a little older. (And of course they all look even older on top of that because Actors)

I polled my friends who hadn't seen it and they said it was a lot to take in/a lot going on but they didn't have too much trouble following it.

My only issue was that they mention five children for five wolves... but did they show Rickon at all? I only saw Robb, Sansa, Arya and Bran.
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  #71  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:00 PM
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I thought Theon was supposed to be black or something. Maybe I missed a better description somewhere in the first book, but I remember him being referred to as a "dark youth".
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  #72  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by Googleshng View Post
I refute the obviousness of the reasons here. Unless you mean just a general attempt at trying to simplify things for people... but that could actually end up causing more confusion when trying to explain the difference between the Others and wights.

Although, granted, all you really need to know either way is that snow goons are bad news, but hey.
There are a pretty famous group of Others on a certain show.

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Originally Posted by Paul le Fou View Post
My only issue was that they mention five children for five wolves... but did they show Rickon at all? I only saw Robb, Sansa, Arya and Bran.
Rickon was around, but they never called him by name that I remember.

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I thought Theon was supposed to be black or something. Maybe I missed a better description somewhere in the first book, but I remember him being referred to as a "dark youth".
Not that I recall.
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  #73  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:42 PM
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I'd been wondering about Rickon too, if he was around why wasn't he in the lineup with the other children when the King was looking them over? I figured maybe he was a baby in a crib offscreen or they wrote him out or something.

Pretty decent first episode! Some of the transitions were a teense jarring and a few scenes came off as overly stylized or oddly laid out/written, but overall I thought it was good. Can't wait to see more, if it's already at this level of quality it can (hopefully) only go up from here!

Main Distraction Of The Episode: what the heck, why were so many Dothraki randomly white and black. Is it that hard to find a decent number of copper-skinned extras? Also, I could've sworn I remembered the wedding night scene with Daenerys and Khal Drogo going a bit different from that.

TL;DR: Tyrion is the best.
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  #74  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:49 PM
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I feel all the younger characters in the book got an age bump, not only the Stark children but Dany as well (that is not a 13 year old body!). Rickon, who's only in the archery scene at the beginning looks much older than 3. As a direct result of aging all the kids Catelyn looks older than I'd imagined which is actually a plus because so much of the female cast is so young and attractive it's actually refreshing to have an older woman playing one of the main characters and she's got great crazy eyes.

The only big problem I have with the casting is Sansa and Arya. There's too big of an age gap between them. Arya's supposed to be immature but she's not supposed to look that much younger than her sister and she looks way too pretty compared to Sansa.

I feel not much was done to differentiate Theon from Robb and Jon looks wise because one problem with aging all the Stark kids is now all three teenage boys look the same age but I think there was enough emphasis in the script Robb is Ed's rightful heir and Jon is not that it can be infered by an unfamiliar audience that for now Theon is just some random dude who hangs out with them.

The puppies are so cute, but I'm worried about how they'll look in the show as they grow bigger.

And Dinklage unsurprisingly was awesome.

I also hope there's an extended cut DVD version because Dany looks like she's getting raped on her wedding night.

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Originally Posted by Knight View Post
I thought Theon was supposed to be black or something. Maybe I missed a better description somewhere in the first book, but I remember him being referred to as a "dark youth".
The people native to Westeros are supposed to be white though I think Dorne has a more Spanish/Moorish vibe than the rest of the continent. There are black people from other parts of the world.
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  #75  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:51 PM
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I'd been wondering about Rickon too, if he was around why wasn't he in the lineup with the other children when the King was looking them over? I figured maybe he was a baby in a crib offscreen or they wrote him out or something.
He was, he was the first kid whose hair Robert ruffled initially.

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Pretty decent first episode! Some of the transitions were a teense jarring and a few scenes came off as overly stylized or oddly laid out/written, but overall I thought it was good. Can't wait to see more, if it's already at this level of quality it can (hopefully) only go up from here!
Indeed. I look forward to the pacing hopefully slowing down after all the introductory stuff is done and focusing on a few characters per episode for development.

Quote:
Main Distraction Of The Episode: what the heck, why were so many Dothraki randomly white and black. Is it that hard to find a decent number of copper-skinned extras? Also, I could've sworn I remembered the wedding night scene with Daenerys and Khal Drogo going a bit different from that.
This may be cynical, but when you've got a tribe of group-fucking horse-worshipping murdering-eachother-at-weddings savages, it's best not to make them all too obviously one ethnic group. That way lies angry letters.

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TL;DR: Tyrion is the best.
Yes. Must have more of him.
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  #76  
Old 04-18-2011, 07:57 PM
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Originally Posted by tungwene View Post
I feel all the younger characters in the book got an age bump, not only the Stark children but Dany as well (that is not a 13 year old body!). Rickon, who's only in the archery scene at the beginning looks much older than 3. As a direct result of aging all the kids Catelyn looks older than I'd imagined which is actually a plus because so much of the female cast is so young and attractive it's actually refreshing to have an older woman playing one of the main characters and she's got great crazy eyes.
Well Dany in particular would have to be aged up if they wanted to keep in all her rampant nudity

Quote:
The only big problem I have with the casting is Sansa and Arya. There's too big of an age gap between them. Arya's supposed to be immature but she's not supposed to look that much younger than her sister and she looks way too pretty compared to Sansa.
I agree that the age difference is too severe looking. I wasn't expecting Sansa to be so much taller than Arya. She looks pretty young when isolated from the other Stark kids but damn is she tall when lined up with them.

Quote:
I feel not much was done to differentiate Theon from Robb and Jon looks wise because one problem with aging all the Stark kids is now all three teenage boys look the same age but I think there was enough emphasis in the script Robb is Ed's rightful heir and Jon is not that it can be infered by an unfamiliar audience that for now Theon is just some random dude who hangs out with them.
For now that works for Theon. He really came off that way in the books too, except in that the books specifically referred to him as a ward, which I didn't even understand at first.

Quote:
I also hope there's an extended cut DVD version because Dany looks like she's getting raped on her wedding night.
It's pretty close to being that anyway. I mean yeah Drogo's being gentle and Dany isn't resisting because of her obligation to Viserys, but she definitely is not philosophically a willing participant the first few times.

Last edited by blinkpen; 04-18-2011 at 08:10 PM.
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  #77  
Old 04-18-2011, 08:01 PM
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Also, I could've sworn I remembered the wedding night scene with Daenerys and Khal Drogo going a bit different from that.
That scene starts exactly the same way in the book but then they cut it off in this episode which makes me wonder if they filmed more of that scene or not because in book it was surprisingly sweet this man who'd been portrayed as a barbarian brute up to this point was pleasuring and asking his terrified young bride for her permission.
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  #78  
Old 04-18-2011, 09:22 PM
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Yeah, exactly. I hope there's more footage that was cut 'cos it changes the scene completely.

One other thing I wondered about but forgot to mention earlier, with The Others: I thought they were supposed to be tall, shining otherworldly beings with snowy white skin and shining armor and stuff? It's been a while but I most certainly don't remember them being all dark and zombie-ish just like their zombie slave horde.
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  #79  
Old 04-18-2011, 09:35 PM
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Yeah, as has generally been said... child age-ups are, I believe, legally mandated when filming a book where if you're a girl, and you've had your first period, boom. You're getting married and consummating it that night. Actually, even as it stands, there's a scene in... was it the third book? Which they're probably going to have to cut completely.

Kinda weird actually that it never really struck me during the run-up to the show that yeah, that's totally something that was going to have to happen. Although a lot of that was just me forgetting how young Dany is to start off. Could have sworn she was at least 15.
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  #80  
Old 04-18-2011, 10:21 PM
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there will be a LOT of tyrion in the show. the producers like him as much as we do, and it pays off.
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  #81  
Old 04-19-2011, 03:24 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Knight View Post
I thought Theon was supposed to be black or something. Maybe I missed a better description somewhere in the first book, but I remember him being referred to as a "dark youth".
He's not black, but I too was surprised by his being fair-haired in the show. I always had him pictured with dark or black hair, too, from the descriptions I saw in the book. Sean Bean's a little too blonde for Ned-as-written I think, too. Not that big a deal, luckily.
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  #82  
Old 04-19-2011, 04:46 AM
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If we're gonna nitpick over color details, then there's the lack of Targaryen purple eyes and Baratheon black hair. The coal trumps the gold!
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  #83  
Old 04-19-2011, 05:12 AM
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Yeah I think we should all come to terms with the fact that a few things aren't exactly the same as the book.
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  #84  
Old 04-19-2011, 05:38 AM
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If we're gonna nitpick over color details, then there's the lack of Targaryen purple eyes
They tried, but apparently the actors found the color-tinted contacts too uncomfortable.
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  #85  
Old 04-19-2011, 05:40 AM
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So Nodal made me watch this.

It was pretty good, but what's with all the creepy brother-sister stuff? Is this like a thing now?
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  #86  
Old 04-19-2011, 06:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Sheana View Post
If we're gonna nitpick over color details, then there's the lack of Targaryen purple eyes and Baratheon black hair. The coal trumps the gold!
Also only Jaime's armor should be gold. The rest of the Kingsguard has white armor.
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  #87  
Old 04-19-2011, 06:54 AM
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Yeah I think we should all come to terms with the fact that a few things aren't exactly the same as the book.
And revel in how remarkably faithful the other 97% of it is.
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  #88  
Old 04-19-2011, 09:34 AM
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I guess the number they're saying now is 4.2 million viewers, which is pretty good. Oh, also, they renewed the show for season two.
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  #89  
Old 04-19-2011, 09:39 AM
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I dunno if this was linked yet, but HBO has a viewer's guide, which might be useful for people who didn't read the books.
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  #90  
Old 04-19-2011, 09:56 AM
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Robin Arryn? I guess they changed it so people wouldn't be confused with more than one Robert?
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