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  #61  
Old 01-22-2010, 09:59 AM
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kaisel kaisel is offline
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If there's still time to sign up, I'd be willing to give it a shot.
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  #62  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:52 AM
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Originally Posted by kaisel View Post
If there's still time to sign up, I'd be willing to give it a shot.
PM sent.
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  #63  
Old 01-22-2010, 05:08 PM
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NOTICE:

I have just realized that I have a prior engagement tomorrow that will prevent me from being online at noon, Mountain time. Therefore, I will be delaying the game's start by eight hours.

I intend to send out role PMs in approximately 6 hours, so people will get a chance to absorb their role and think about what they will do on the first day. 20 hours after that is when I'll start the game thread. If you still want to play and haven't registered yet, you need to both register and respond to the confirmation PM before I send out the role PMs, so don't delay!

As it currently stands, there are 25 players:

PapillonReel
Comb Stranger
Lucas
Shinji-Fox
Silent Noise
Brickroad
fanboymaster
Paul le Fou
Wolf
Epithet
dwolfe
Phantoon
Umby
spineshark
Guesty
Merus
Alice
Eddie
Ruik
vaterite
demonkoala
Warg
Rai
Loki
kaisel

If nobody else joins, I think I will assign the roles as follows:

5 Mafia
1 Inspector
2 Angels
1 Vigilante
1 Oracle
1 Miller (who thinks he's a Citizen)
14 Citizens

The Mafia are starkly outnumbered, but the Citizens will be working with imperfect information and there is only one Inspector. The Angels' protection covers kills from both the Mafia and the Vigilante; if they try to kill someone and fail, this will be made known.
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  #64  
Old 01-22-2010, 05:52 PM
Merus Merus is offline
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In the role PMs, can you put a reminder of that role's job and abilities? I've already forgotten what the Vigilante does.
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  #65  
Old 01-22-2010, 06:16 PM
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dtsund dtsund is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Merus View Post
In the role PMs, can you put a reminder of that role's job and abilities? I've already forgotten what the Vigilante does.
I was already planning on it. Might be good to have them here too, though, so:

Mafia: the bad guys. During the night phase, they are allowed to PM one another about the game (this is otherwise forbidden). All of them are to send me the name of the person they agree to whack that night; if the Angel doesn't save that person, he will be killed and only the Mafia and Oracle get to know what his/her role is. They win if they ever outnumber the innocents, and lose if they're wiped out.

Vigilante: on the good side, but is a loose cannon. May choose to kill one person each night, or abstain from doing so (since there is a very good likelihood of killing an innocent). Only the Vigilante and the Oracle get to know the role of the victim.

Inspector: every night, gets to send me one name. He'll get a positive result if the inspection target is a Mafia (or Miller!), a negative result otherwise.

Angel: a benevolent soul who has the power to prevent people from being killed at night. Sends me a name, and that person cannot be killed that night, by either the Vigilante or Mafia. May choose to protect himself.

Citizen: no special powers.

Miller: like a citizen, but shows up as guilty under inspection. Doesn't know he's the Miller. I have no idea why the role is called Miller.
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  #66  
Old 01-22-2010, 09:01 PM
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Emcee Escher Emcee Escher is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dtsund View Post
NOTICE:I intend to send out role PMs in approximately 6 hours, so people will get a chance to absorb their role and think about what they will do on the first day. 20 hours after that is when I'll start the game thread. If you still want to play and haven't registered yet, you need to both register and respond to the confirmation PM before I send out the role PMs, so don't delay!
Didn't see the thread till today, so I know I'm really pushing the time limit for registration, but I'd love to play if you see this before you send out the PMs.
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  #67  
Old 01-22-2010, 09:07 PM
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dangerhelvetica dangerhelvetica is offline
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Can I be Clamps?
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  #68  
Old 01-22-2010, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emcee Escher View Post
Didn't see the thread till today, so I know I'm really pushing the time limit for registration, but I'd love to play if you see this before you send out the PMs.
Quote:
Originally Posted by criminallyinane View Post
Can I be Clamps?
Sent out! If you get them, hurry and respond!
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  #69  
Old 01-22-2010, 10:20 PM
dwolfe dwolfe is offline
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Wait. No one at all can PM at all? Or only the Mafia, only at night? Or....

Man, please please post a basic rule list in the morning. 90% of all my past werewolf games were PM heavy, public light (which was annoying at times)
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  #70  
Old 01-22-2010, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwolfe View Post
Wait. No one at all can PM at all? Or only the Mafia, only at night? Or....

Man, please please post a basic rule list in the morning. 90% of all my past werewolf games were PM heavy, public light (which was annoying at times)
The rule is that nobody can PM each other, except for the Mafia at night. All other discussion takes place in the open. I'll try to get a comprehensive rule set in the OP for the game's thread.

And registration is over now! Emcee Escher confirmed in time, but criminallyinane didn't, so the final player list is

PapillonReel
Comb Stranger
Lucas
Shinji-Fox
Silent Noise
Brickroad
fanboymaster
Paul le Fou
Wolf
Epithet
dwolfe
Phantoon
Umby
spineshark
Guesty
Merus
Alice
Eddie
Ruik
vaterite
demonkoala
Warg
Rai
Loki
kaisel
Emcee Escher

I'll be sending out role PMs as soon as I run everyone through my role-randomizing Python script. There will be:

5 Mafia
2 Angels
1 Inspector
1 Vigilante
1 Oracle
1 Miller
15 Citizens

Last edited by dtsund; 01-22-2010 at 11:16 PM.
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  #71  
Old 01-24-2010, 08:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dwolfe View Post
I've never heard of a mafia game where we cannot talk in private; forming private coalitions is core to my understanding of the game.
I find this fascinating. I've only played the real life version of mafia/werewolf which is much like this - all communication during the day has to be public. Allowing private communication would completely change the game - certainly an interesting variant. Of course, this online variant also seems to allow unlimited communication by mafia during the night. In the real life version, the only thing they are allowed to do is communicate who they want to lynch with no discussion of why (Basically a nomination and vote process).
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  #72  
Old 01-24-2010, 08:44 PM
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Lucas Lucas is offline
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Yeah, I was talking to someone last night about this game and discussing the differences between this forum variant and the real-life version. I'm actually kinda sad that the little girl character can't really be done online, since she's such an interesting thing to play.
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  #73  
Old 01-24-2010, 08:45 PM
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Brickroad Brickroad is offline
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The flip side is that you can do things online you can't do in real life, like let the Mafia collaborate behind closed doors.

I guess the idea is that the mob is orderly, structured and freely share information, while the rest of the town is stricken with paranoia. And, uh, judging by the game thread, it's working!
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  #74  
Old 01-24-2010, 09:59 PM
Silent Noise Silent Noise is offline
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I have a question, if everyone who does things at night does what they want, do the mafia have the option to skip ahead to day if they all PM you about it?
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  #75  
Old 01-24-2010, 10:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Noise View Post
I have a question, if everyone who does things at night does what they want, do the mafia have the option to skip ahead to day if they all PM you about it?
Indeed! I think I said as much in the thread's OP.
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  #76  
Old 01-24-2010, 10:01 PM
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Comb Stranger Comb Stranger is offline
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Any variation would work, just differently. In a game where the civvies can PM, you would need more Mafia, since their advantage is somewhat lessened.

OOH OOH, variation idea: The Witness

In addition to a role, everyone is given a set of randomly-chosen descriptors. Ethnicity, body type, clothing, distinguishing feature, etc, chosen from a limited list. You might have 4 tall people, 4 chubby people, 3 short ones, and 4 thin ones. Unlike the roles, these are public. After someone is whacked, the GM tells a random civilian a distinguishing trait of the killer (who would be chosen at night during the mob vote). That information, if believed, could vastly narrow down the suspects. They could come out and report it, risking themselves and hoping to be believed, or make a quiet note of it until they have a profile to vote on.

So lets say the Mafia offs a guy; Jimmy sees it happen, but only makes out that the killer had a brown coat. He comes out with it at the town meeting, and the Mafia, figuring it's too vague a clue to risk blowing their cover over, doesn't try to contest it. Nothing comes of it, but the next night, Bobby witnesses someone getting an Italian necktie from a distinctly Canadian looking fellow. Again, not much, but Bobby's been having suspicions about a certain brown-coated Canadian, so he convinces the townsfolk to lynch him. Etcetera, etcetera.
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  #77  
Old 01-24-2010, 10:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comb Stranger View Post
OOH OOH, variation idea: The Witness
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  #78  
Old 01-26-2010, 06:35 PM
Silent Noise Silent Noise is offline
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Oh man, I had an awesome idea, new class ghost this person is normally just a villiger with no powers but when they die they get to choose someone they take to the grave with them, or in simple terms when ghost dies, he chooses a person to kill.
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  #79  
Old 01-26-2010, 06:37 PM
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PapillonReel PapillonReel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Noise View Post
Oh man, I had an awesome idea, new class ghost this person is normally just a villiger with no powers but when they die they get to choose someone they take to the grave with them, or in simple terms when ghost dies, he chooses a person to kill.
Someone's feeling a little vengeful.

You know, that's not a half bad idea...
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  #80  
Old 01-26-2010, 06:41 PM
Silent Noise Silent Noise is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PapillonReel View Post
Someone's feeling a little vengeful.

You know, that's not a half bad idea...
Nooooo... I'm feeling dead, hence the avatar.

But really this could give a reason to hesitate to kill, on the chance that it could come back to haunt you.
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  #81  
Old 01-26-2010, 06:44 PM
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dtsund dtsund is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Noise View Post
Oh man, I had an awesome idea, new class ghost this person is normally just a villiger with no powers but when they die they get to choose someone they take to the grave with them, or in simple terms when ghost dies, he chooses a person to kill.
That's actually a pretty neat idea. Mafia's pretty malleable in terms of what roles can do. Inspector and Angel (or roles with different names but the same function) are present in almost every game I've ever seen, but other than that there's a lot of room for creativity, and I like this one.

Some restraint is called for, though. I don't think I'd want to play another game with a Wizard, for instance ('swaps' two people each night; if he swaps A and B, for instance, and the Mafia choose to kill A and the Inspector investigates B, B gets killed and A gets inspected. The Inspector would not be told this.).
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  #82  
Old 01-26-2010, 06:45 PM
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Actually, I think there is a character like that in Werewolves of Millers Hollow
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  #83  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:18 PM
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The Ghost and Witness are really good role ideas, though I'm not sure how you would be able to work out the latter without giving away too much information. Either way, it'd be cool to see them in a later instalment.

From this list of variations, I'd like to see the Traitor (opposite of Miller; appears innocent but works with Mafia) and Thief (blocks an action from one role every night) be incorporated at some point as well. Balancing out the role alignments seems like a good thing to do, and the latter role's ability sounds like a great way to add some extra suspense to the game. Being able to have a bunch of unique, interesting effects without going overboard seems like the best way to really mold the game to a TT-unique thing.
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  #84  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:25 PM
dwolfe dwolfe is offline
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Quick rules clarification. Does one EVER know if a mafia member is successfully killed, or do we just lynch day after day and wait for a night when the mafia doesn't kill to know we won?

I assumed we'd at least know mafia when they're dead, if not good guy roles. So we could, y'know, keep a running count?
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  #85  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:27 PM
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You know, I was going to comment on your suggestion regarding Medic/Angel, but you erased it right before I clicked the Quote button. Here's what I was going to say:

I debated on what to call the class, but decided to go with Angel because of its interaction with some semi-accepted roles in more complicated games: Priest and Devil. The Priest, every night, names one person and gets a positive result if he named an Angel, Devil, or Inspector. The Devil is the same, except he works for the Mafia and inspect for Angel, Priest, or Inspector. The Devil knows who the Mafia are, but the Mafia don't know who he is.

EDIT:

Quote:
Originally Posted by dwolfe View Post
Quick rules clarification. Does one EVER know if a mafia member is successfully killed, or do we just lynch day after day and wait for a night when the mafia doesn't kill to know we won?

I assumed we'd at least know mafia when they're dead, if not good guy roles. So we could, y'know, keep a running count?
I usually play so that Vigilante kills are known, but it seemed like you all wanted the night kills to be unknown. I won't tell you if Mafia have been killed by Vigilante (or even Mafia, if they have some crazy tactics), that'll be up to the Vigilante him/herself or the Oracle.

I'll tell you when and if you've won, at least. I once saw a game where the jerk running it let the game go for a few more days after the Citizens had won...
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  #86  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:31 PM
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Yeah, I deleted my comment about that because it didn't really seem all that important to dwell on in the long run. On reflection, odds were you had a good reason going with Angel so best let it go.
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  #87  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:34 PM
Silent Noise Silent Noise is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PapillonReel View Post
The Ghost and Witness are really good role ideas, though I'm not sure how you would be able to work out the latter without giving away too much information. Either way, it'd be cool to see them in a later instalment.

From this list of variations, I'd like to see the Traitor (opposite of Miller; appears innocent but works with Mafia) and Thief (blocks an action from one role every night) be incorporated at some point as well. Balancing out the role alignments seems like a good thing to do, and the latter role's ability sounds like a great way to add some extra suspense to the game. Being able to have a bunch of unique, interesting effects without going overboard seems like the best way to really mold the game to a TT-unique thing.
I think the witness seems like it would fit better in a different sort of game, the Thief seems overpowered unless he just has to guess.

But really I think if we want the perfect game, take it slow, try out one new class at a time, I say that 2 ghosts is enough without going overboard, so before each new game how about we vote on which new class to add.
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  #88  
Old 01-26-2010, 07:54 PM
Silent Noise Silent Noise is offline
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Oo, I had another great idea, Living Bomb he thinks he's just a normal person but he was a test subject so that when he dies he explodes and takes the life of his killer, if it was a vigilante then it's simple, when it's a mafioso then it's random which of them die, same if the villigers lynch him, it's random.

What do you think of the Living Bomb and Ghost guys, can we try 'em next game? I think it adds a level of fear and caution to killing, which otherwise has no random elements, it should also be mentioned that the ghost does not know who killed him.
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  #89  
Old 01-26-2010, 08:10 PM
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PapillonReel PapillonReel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silent Noise View Post
I think the witness seems like it would fit better in a different sort of game, the Thief seems overpowered unless he just has to guess.
Having it so they'd have to guess would be a fair compromise, I think, but the only problem is that it'd potentially give the Thief Inspector-like powers. This would be especially damning for the Angel or Vigilante, since finding out their kills were stopped would out the person right away, though it could be played around.

Alternatively, having them choose a role would give a large amount of power over certain proceedings but larger games with multiple people per role might be a moderating factor.

Last edited by PapillonReel; 01-26-2010 at 08:16 PM. Reason: Original post was a mess
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  #90  
Old 01-26-2010, 08:56 PM
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Comb Stranger Comb Stranger is offline
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Can we all accuse and vote on multiple accusations, or if someone jumps the gun do we have to get a full nay vote first?
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